South Wales 'Metro' updates

[MikePJ]

Does Queen St resignalling need to be complete before the 398s can be rolled out on the TAM lines?

And as there's no 'like' button, just a thanks to Mike for all the pics! Always nice to see what's happening.

Thanks! I don't believe the resignalling is required for the 398s to be introduced north of Queen St, but it will be needed to achieve the intended service frequency.

Great, thanks for the photos.

Looks like trains may use the new platform whilst the old one is completed.

It certainly looks like it. I suspect that the white hoarding adjacent to the station building (left-hand edge of the first picture) will be removed to allow passenger access onto the new platform whilst the old one is fenced off.

(New post merged in) Here are some more pictures of Cardiff Bay and Butetown, taken from the station platform and out of the window of a 150.


Meanwhile... another consultation document has appeared, this time with regard to track and signalling changes that will happen during a blockade at Pontypridd in the first two weeks of October (these are Network Rail weeks "27 and 28" - NR count weeks from 1st April). The changes are:

- the redundant Engineers' siding at Pontypridd station will be removed, together with associated signalling.
- platform 2 at Pontypridd station (used by trains towards Cardiff) will be reconfigured for permissive working (this involves moving some signalling equipment). "Permissive working" means allowing a second train into the platform when it is already occupied. My suspicion is that this is being done to allow for trains to be joined at Pontypridd which may be operationally useful, such as to recover from disruption - i.e. for a train from Treherbert to be attached to the rear of a train from Merthyr, for example, and then continue into Cardiff as one service.
- Line speeds are to be increased slightly on the Treherbert line, on a section of track near to the junction at Pontypridd this will be increased from 25mph to 40mph (40mph for all trains towards Treherbert; 25 mph locos / 40mph multiple units towards Pontypridd). Presumably this will help trains clear the junction more quickly.
- Similarly, a section of the Up Main line through Trefforest Estate station (i.e. the line heading towards Pontypridd) will have linespeed raised from 55mph to 60mph. This is a distance of just over two miles, so the speed increase will shave about 10 seconds off the journey time for a non-stop train. As all trains are supposed to call at the station, realistically the speed increase will be a few seconds, but presumably every little helps.

 

[Broseley man]

Conquering the post-eisteddfod blues

Ben Wildsmith With Baroness Morgan embarking on her ‘listening exercise’ around the nation this month, wouldn’t it be enlightening if she undertook the journey on public transport? I feel certain that she’d encounter some fellow passengers who would be happy to share one or two concerns with the...

nation.cymru

So, electric trains have begun?

 

[CapitalStar378]

Conquering the post-eisteddfod blues

Ben Wildsmith With Baroness Morgan embarking on her ‘listening exercise’ around the nation this month, wouldn’t it be enlightening if she undertook the journey on public transport? I feel certain that she’d encounter some fellow passengers who would be happy to share one or two concerns with the...

nation.cymru

So, electric trains have begun?

I think the writer confused 231s with 756s. When are the 756s due to start now?

 

[MikePJ]

I think the writer confused 231s with 756s. When are the 756s due to start now?

Allegedly in the next couple of months.

 

[anthony263]

2

I think the writer confused 231s with 756s. When are the 756s due to start now?

diagrams in October been reported by some tfw staff

 

[Lurcheroo]

2

diagrams in October been reported by some tfw staff

That would be great !

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

Apparently TFW carried an extra 100,000 passengers between Cardiff and Ponty during Eisteddfod week. I was one of them - and the extra trains were great.

 

[Lurcheroo]

Apparently TFW carried an extra 100,000 passengers between Cardiff and Ponty during Eisteddfod week. I was one of them - and the extra trains were great.

Just goes to show what the new trains will allow!

 

[Envoy]

I see that Persimmon/Church Church have been given permission by Cardiff Council to build another batch of new homes at Llanilletrn north of the M4 near J33. I can’t find the plans on the Cardiff Council planning portal.

I was always under the impression that a route had been safeguarded through this area so that any future Metro extension to Cregiau could be linked to the former rail route that goes through to the City Line in Fairwater. If they are not allowing for such a route at this location - then that would indeed be very foolish. It would also be foolish to have on-street running through these new suburbs which would restrict the speed of travel and could lead to the Class 398 tram-trains not keeping to schedule and thus screwing up the entire network when they reach the city.

Please note that this is not speculation but part of the master plan for the Metro system going forward.

Planning approval secured for 74 new high-quality homes at major Cardiff site |

www.persimmonhomes.com

"Cardiff Council recently granted approval for 74 high-quality homes at Persimmon Homes East Wales’ major site at Llanilltern Village on the west of Cardiff".

 

[John R]

Do you have any evidence that they are not allowing for the Metro, or is it just speculation?

 

[Envoy]

Do you have any evidence that they are not allowing for the Metro, or is it just speculation?

Don’t know - that is why I was bringing it to attention on here as perhaps someone can come up with the answer?

Planners can be incredibly stupid - as witnessed by building a few houses on what is hoped will be this Cross City west - east route near the junction with the City Line in Fairwater and on the other hoped for extension from Penarth to Sully. Of course, back when these houses were built, there was no talk about re-building these former rail routes but you would have thought that they would have realised that they could at least be useful cycleways/footpaths.

Anyway, they should soon be releasing plans for consultation about the first phase of the Cross City route which is the section from the Bay Line across Callaghan Square to the south side of Cardiff Central station.

 

[CapitalStar378]

I see that Persimmon/Church Church have been given permission by Cardiff Council to build another batch of new homes at Llanilletrn north of the M4 near J33. I can’t find the plans on the Cardiff Council planning portal.

I was always under the impression that a route had been safeguarded through this area so that any future Metro extension to Cregiau could be linked to the former rail route that goes through to the City Line in Fairwater. If they are not allowing for such a route at this location - then that would indeed be very foolish. It would also be foolish to have on-street running through these new suburbs which would restrict the speed of travel and could lead to the Class 398 tram-trains not keeping to schedule and thus screwing up the entire network when they reach the city.

Please note that this is not speculation but part of the master plan for the Metro system going forward.

Planning approval secured for 74 new high-quality homes at major Cardiff site |

www.persimmonhomes.com

The rail route is protected from development so I'm sure the houses aren't planned for the potential track bed.

This was posted on the Cardiff Wales Map Forum, contains some interesting details on 4tph on the Coryton and City lines, plans to extend the Crossrail to Penarth and electrify the line as well as plenty of other bits.

It's a 9 page document so I can't add detail to this post, please advise if I need to change the format. Thanks.

Cardiff Crossrail Cabinet Presentation

 

[Smwrff]

Some interesting new plans for Cardiff Cross Rail - some new service patterns - another new station....

 

[Envoy]

The rail route is protected from development so I'm sure the houses aren't planned for the potential track bed.

This was posted on the Cardiff Wales Map Forum, contains some interesting details on 4tph on the Coryton and City lines, plans to extend the Crossrail to Penarth and electrify the line as well as plenty of other bits.

It's a 9 page document so I can't add detail to this post, please advise if I need to change the format. Thanks.

Cardiff Crossrail Cabinet Presentation

Many thanks for the Cardiff Cabinet presentation. Can’t see the blocking of Bute Street north going down well as it effectively cuts off access to car parks at John Lewis & St.David’s 2 for those coming from the Penarth Road direction. Well, yes OK, I know they should use public transport.

I am sure that houses are not planned for the potential trackbed in the Llanilltern area but I certainly trust that streets are not planned for the potential Metro route in that area.

 

[Signal_Box]

Many thanks for the Cardiff Cabinet presentation. Can’t see the blocking of Bute Street north going down well as it effectively cuts off access to car parks at John Lewis & St.David’s 2 for those coming from the Penarth Road direction. Well, yes OK, I know they should use public transport.

I am sure that houses are not planned for the potential trackbed in the Llanilltern area but I certainly trust that streets are not planned for the potential Metro route in that area.

Why should anyone be forced to use public transport ? This a dictatorship where we do as we’re told for fear of punishment.

Again and again were told use public transport which is pitiful at best and dangerous at worst. Recents stats from BTP suggest a huge (Although context is everything) raise in assaults on females on public transport (well trains, and trams).

 

[The exile]

Again and again were told use public transport which is pitiful at best and dangerous at worst. Recents stats from BTP suggest a huge (Although context is everything) raise in assaults on females on public transport (well trains, and trams).

Not sure car-parks are viewed as being much safer…

 

[John R]

Why should anyone be forced to use public transport ? This a dictatorship where we do as we’re told for fear of punishment.

Again and again were told use public transport which is pitiful at best and dangerous at worst. Recents stats from BTP suggest a huge (Although context is everything) raise in assaults on females on public transport (well trains, and trams).

Given the comment is about traffic approaching from the Penarth Road direction, I don’t think you can call the service pitiful or dangerous, with 4tph from both Penarth and Barry right into the heart of Cardiff’s retail and business districts.

 

[The exile]

Why should anyone be forced to use public transport ? This a dictatorship where we do as we’re told for fear of punishment.

Where does it say anything about forcing people to use public transport?

 

[Lurcheroo]

Why should anyone be forced to use public transport ? This a dictatorship where we do as we’re told for fear of punishment.

That’s an interesting take for sure.
As far a I can tell no one is being forced to use Public transport. You can still drive and use the car parks.

I however, am forced to drive due to lack of public transport. I’m also forced to purchase (very expensive) car insurance and car tax.

Let’s be real It’s certainly far from a dictatorship, but nobody is free even under a democracy, there are expectations on behaviour and really that’s for the better. Otherwise I could just come over to your house, beat the daylights out of you and that would be that.

The Welsh government in particular are trying to encourage (not force) people to use public transport to reduce emissions.

Although based on what you’ve said I’m half expecting a response saying climate change is a hoax

 

[Signal_Box]

That’s an interesting take for sure.
As far a I can tell no one is being forced to use Public transport. You can still drive and use the car parks.

I however, am forced to drive due to lack of public transport. I’m also forced to purchase (very expensive) car insurance and car tax.

Let’s be real It’s certainly far from a dictatorship, but nobody is free even under a democracy, there are expectations on behaviour and really that’s for the better. Otherwise I could just come over to your house, beat the daylights out of you and that would be that.

The Welsh government in particular are trying to encourage (not force) people to use public transport to reduce emissions.

Although based on what you’ve said I’m half expecting a response saying climate change is a hoax

There is a real direction of travel to make car driving especially into Cardiff as difficult and unpleasant as possible, to force modal change.

You encourage by making all forms of transport practical to everyone, I can’t get to work on public transport if a road toll or congestion charge is enforced (it’s coming) I’ll be forced to pay it simply because the public transport offering can’t get me to work at the time my employer requires. Why should those on very poor wages again be forced to change jobs or pay another tax in the name of climate change when in reality even if every emission emitting vehicle in wales turned electric the co2 output saves would be like a pebble in the ocean ?

The first minister drives round in a big diesel or petrol vehicle but I have to change to public transport.

Lucky I’ll be dead by the time ll these eco policies / fantasy really hit us normal people so it won’t be my problem.

Yes I’m a right laugh at parties as well.

Not sure car-parks are viewed as being much safer…

You can generally escape a car park…in your car.

Given the comment is about traffic approaching from the Penarth Road direction, I don’t think you can call the service pitiful or dangerous, with 4tph from both Penarth and Barry right into the heart of Cardiff’s retail and business districts.

The world doesn’t centre around Penarth though or Barry.

Where does it say anything about forcing people to use public transport?

Closing off roads, making them bus only, adding multi sets of traffic lights which stop the flow of traffic and cause jams create more emissions.

 

[Topological]

Hope they do not change it, but Cardiff is one of the easiest cities to drive into that I know. You can go from 70* to parked near the shopping centre in minutes.

 

[Signal_Box]

Hope they do not change it, but Cardiff is one of the easiest cities to drive into that I know. You can go from 70* to parked near the shopping centre in minutes.

Minutes ? From a major trunk road like the M4 or A470 into the city centre parking areas…minutes yes about 20-30 if the traffic is bad.

 

[John R]

The world doesn’t centre around Penarth though or Barry.

Nope, but given you were complaining about access from the Penarth Road direction (there's a clue in the name), I'd venture that the services from Penarth and Barry are pretty relevant.

 

[Topological]

Minutes ? From a major trunk road like the M4 or A470 into the city centre parking areas…minutes yes about 20-30 if the traffic is bad.

Speed, its 50 in the tunnel under the dock, but as far as I am aware the A4232 is 70 until the 50 sign just at the entrance to the tunnel.

It's pretty easy to be doing the speed limit on that road from the M4 all the way up to the tunnel. Indeed I still get overtaken on that stretch. I cannot think of anywhere else that is like that.

It is busier at the weekend admittedly.

 

[Signal_Box]

Nope, but given you were complaining about access from the Penarth Road direction (there's a clue in the name), I'd venture that the services from Penarth and Barry are pretty relevant.

I was complaining about access to the city centre shopping area the economic heart of the city, it’s very problematic from all directions.

Speed, its 50 in the tunnel under the dock, but as far as I am aware the A4232 is 70 until the 50 sign just at the entrance to the tunnel.

It's pretty easy to be doing the speed limit on that road from the M4 all the way up to the tunnel. Indeed I still get overtaken on that stretch. I cannot think of anywhere else that is like that.

It is busier at the weekend admittedly.

Forgive me, I completely overlook the link road. Yes it’s 70 then 50 (for now) then down to 30/30 into the city from the East dock and Prison area.

 

[Topological]

I was complaining about access to the city centre shopping area the economic heart of the city, it’s very problematic from all directions.


Forgive me, I completely overlook the link road. Yes it’s 70 then 50 (for now) then down to 30/30 into the city from the East dock and Prison area.

It is a brilliant road, so no doubt on the list to change. I also accept that many areas to the immediate South West do not have a junction to join that road.

However, for now it offers a great route into Cardiff and you can be parked in 30 minutes from leaving Port Talbot 50 limit.

Coming in on the Eastern equivalent is more of an experience. Goes well then a slower trek round the old industrial units (not bad for thinking what used to be there railway wise maybe).

 

[The exile]

You can generally escape a car park…in your car.

Once you’ve got back to it…

 

[Envoy]

The trouble is that with people driving in to central Cardiff from all directions and aiming for John Lewis / St.David’s 2 car parks, that they all get jammed up. Indeed, once full, many will sit in their cars waiting for a slot to gain entry. I really do wonder how many of those people would have been better off travelling by train to central Cardiff? Don't get me wrong - I am not anti car but consider that we should use the best form of transport depending on where we are going. Going to the centre of a compact city like Cardiff is surely better by rail than by car - hence all the money going into the Metro and better main line trains.

 

[John R]

It’s great that Cardiff has a thriving retail centre, unlike, say, Bristol. Knowing some people who go from North Somerset by train to shop there, it may well be that the proximity to the retail centre of the rail stations is a major reason why it hasn’t suffered like some others.

 

[Richard Scott]

The trouble is that with people driving in to central Cardiff from all directions and aiming for John Lewis / St.David’s 2 car parks, that they all get jammed up. Indeed, once full, many will sit in their cars waiting for a slot to gain entry. I really do wonder how many of those people would have been better off travelling by train to central Cardiff? Don't get me wrong - I am not anti car but consider that we should use the best form of transport depending on where we are going. Going to the centre of a compact city like Cardiff is surely better by rail than by car - hence all the money going into the Metro and better main line trains.

I hate driving in Cardiff and avoid it like the plague but still have to drive about 10miles to most convenient station of Newport.
Nearest station is Severn Tunnel Junction but is 3 miles in wrong direction and ticket costs twice as much as Newport and then parking on top. Metro is a great idea if it's near where you live but we need a station in Magor otherwise some of us will continue to need to drive. Is there one proposed (I know there's an action group campaigning for one but seems falling on deaf ears)?