Southern and Bombardier

[Nym]

Surely the software could be written for a newer version of the OS, and still be fully compatible?

Is it Win 95 or Windows CE, as used more in embedded systems? That is actually pretty stable and used in loads of things.

What do the 379s use? Mac OS?!

Bombardier might need to recompile some code but I am sure they could factor this into the cost.

Depends on how the software has been written...

Also depends on what you mean by Mac OS, if you mean it by what it actually is (Unix with shiney buttons) then I beleive quite a lot of Rolling Stock uses unix based OSes for it's higher level software, but won't have an apple on it, if it does have a logo it would proberbly be a penguin or a guy in a red hat.
Windows CE is very stable because they where awake when they designed it, but embeded systems have moved on now, depending on how big and what they need to be doing, I've seen them running on anything from directly chip dependant bytecode up to actually running full OSes like Red Hat, Debian or Windows XP.

With the amount of deprecated libraries from Windows 95's implementation of C though I wouldn't really want them to just re-compile the code. Since everything is written on top of standards, they could have reached a nice midpoint with Southern and made new 377 units, of a new subclass, still compatable by hardware and communication software with all other 377 units, but running on a new build of software, based on the old one. Personally for the processing power needed I'd be looking at somthing around the size of a netbook for processing power, running a unix based OS.

 

[jon0844]

I only meant OS X as in the suggestion of a glamorous front-end, not the core OS underneath (and I wasn't serious).

The 377s aren't that old (the 377/5s only finished a couple of years ago) and even the 379s are a bit of a hybrid aren't they - a mix of the 377 design with some of the next generation train they're doing. Some of those made it into the 379s I believe (can't state exactly what - but going by what I've read on here and elsewhere) so the trains could, as you say, be a hybrid that is engineered to be compatible with the rest of the fleet.

Bombardier must have a division to work all of this out, so I think they just went for the easy option - saying it couldn't be done. That saves on dev time, and something else for the company to mess up!

 

[pemma]

I was speaking to members of the TLP team today, and their plan is to return the 377s first.

I was basing it on Southern saying they were due the 377s back in time for the Dec 13 timetable change: http://www.southernrailway.com/southern/news/southern-launches-competition-for-130-new-carriages/
and DfT saying the 319s would be fully refurbished and in service in the North West by 2013:
http://webarchive.nationalarchives....t.gov.uk/pgr/rail/pi/rail-electrification.pdf
which suggested that the 319s would be released first with time needed for refurbishment and crew training before they can enter service.

I would hope if the Southern order does go ahead and is delivered before the 377/5s that in fact the 377/5s are released first as this would allow Southern to sublease something to Northern to cover the 319 refurbishment program before later using the extra units as extra capacity and 313 replacement. I would prefer Northern to be allowed to order new EMUs as well given how late the 319s will be but I can't see that happening.

 

[HH]

They must be documents based around the original plan I guess. Based on a December signing the new trains would have started arriving in December 14 (outside the first test train) at a rate of 1 per week. They all have to be tested before entering service.

There are 23 377/5s, plus there will be 1 377/2 on spot hire (part of KO1 which should be agreed soon). So that would be around June 15 before all the 377s could be released. However the signing just got put back to April, so that would take us to October 15, providing there's no further slippage. Then the 319s will be replaced at the same rate. IIRC there's 86 of them.

It's this delay that has caused the early end of the current FCC Franchise and the intention to have a short interim franchise to deal with the new trains introduction.