SR letter and number headcodes

[ianhr]

Always seemed a bit of a lost opportunity that the post-war SUBs were not converted to EPB, these following directly after their construction, and the SUBs went for major works overhauls for the next 30 years. It would have made for a nice fully compatible suburban fleet for a long while.

Yes they seemed to try to deal with the incompatibility problem by segregating the fleets geographically, with the Eastern section becoming 100% EPB and the Central and Western divisions using the SUBs, with a few exceptions. The 06 Victoria-Holborn Viaduct via the 'wall of death' line, the Guildford New line and the Reading and Windsor lines were EPB.

 

[Dr_Paul]

that would be buffer greace you couldnt paint anything on as units jumped to different numbered service often several times a day ??
when we has a sub on the south london[vic to london bridge] on the odd occasion you would just carry the frame with 22 in it from end to end .

That explains things. I recall seeing the route number written in what looked like black paint, and wondered if it might obscure the display when a stencil was later clipped on. Buffer grease could be easily wiped off.

 

[30907]

The SED was wholly EPB from about 1959, no doubt the 10-car scheme on the SE side influenced matters (and the fact that seating capacity was a far bigger issue than on the other two, and prewar SUBs had very varied capacity).

 

[contrex]

The SUBS could run in multiple with everything built before; the 1951 type stock could not, and it was not until the late 50s/early 60s that the balance tipped, with CEP/BEP, CIG/BIG, VEP, etc. I think the cost was the main reason.

 

[yorksrob]

We are wandering a long way off the original topic of SR headcodes but this is interesting and maybe worthy of a new thread.

Yes, at that time cWW1 and the 1920s there were no flexible plastics and the usual insulating materials were waxed paper, rubber, various fabrics and wood. I am not sure of the exact conductivity of wet wood but would not in the light of modern understanding want to risk my life to it. Until quite recently if a failed train on the Southern needed to be isolated from the traction supply the crew had to "paddle up" by inserting wooden paddles (which were stored in the cab or guard's van) between the conductor rail and the shoes.

Are these the same wooden paddles that would sometimes be placed in the drivers window ?

 

[big all]

Are these the same wooden paddles that would sometimes be placed in the drivers window ?

yes indeed as an unofficial indication that the handbrake is on in that cab ??

 

[contrex]

Are these the same wooden paddles that would sometimes be placed in the drivers window ?

In the secondman's window, as I recall, to indicate that the handbrake had been applied.

 

[yorksrob]

In the secondman's window, as I recall, to indicate that the handbrake had been applied.

I remember that in the 90's in the CEP's and VEP's.

 

[Journeyman]

Yes they seemed to try to deal with the incompatibility problem by segregating the fleets geographically, with the Eastern section becoming 100% EPB and the Central and Western divisions using the SUBs, with a few exceptions. The 06 Victoria-Holborn Viaduct via the 'wall of death' line, the Guildford New line and the Reading and Windsor lines were EPB.

For a brief period around 1982/3, the Western Section had to juggle with SUBs, EPBs, 455s and 508s all at the same time. Must have been fun if diagrams got messed up - hmm, how do we couple this SUB to this 508?

 

[big all]

I remember that in the 90's in the CEP's and VEP's.

Yes before any stock like 455/456/319 where parking brakes were spring loaded and apply when drivers master controller is shut down or air supplies reduces below the level required to hold the springs loaded parking brake off.

As an aside paddles would be found on any train regularly found working over the third rail even when not electric for the reason when using a short circuit bar the paddle was required to scrape the bottom off the third rail clean for a short circuit bar so were fitted to Cromptons, Thumpers, Reading DMUs and of course class 73s

 

[contrex]

From July 1967, the SE division used redundant 6-PUL & 6-PAN cars reformed into 6-COR units to cope with a stock shortage. They were mainly used on Kent Coast rush hour and excursion services. Their working life on the South Eastern lasted only a few months.

 

[ianhr]

Returning to headcodes I have just realised that there was an odd class of pre-war suburban unit that carried numerical rather than letter stencils, these were the 8 2-SL and 4 2-WIM units which operated the South London (Victoria-London Bridge via Denmark Hill) and Wimbledon-West Croydon via Mitcham lines. On both routes they carried number stencil '2' (both the wide and narrow type). These sets were not merely pre-war but pre-WW1 having first entered traffic as AC units on the LBSCR in 1909! They were rebuilt as DC sets around 1929 and lasted until replaced by 2-EPBs in 1954. Being 9'6" wide they were restricted to these routes + access to Selhurst depot via Streatham, and Lancing via the Quarry Line, and never normally worked in multiple with 3-SUBs or 4-SUBs although their electrical equipment was compatible.

 

[RichJF]

Just for interest, Southern E group has a fantastic page of all the headcodes used by EMUs and DEMUs on all three regions. This includes some now closed routes!

"Southern" EMU and DEMU Headcodes

 

[ianhr]

Just for interest, Southern E group has a fantastic page of all the headcodes used by EMUs and DEMUs on all three regions. This includes some now closed routes!

"Southern" EMU and DEMU Headcodes

Yes, this group is a very useful resource for anyone interested in the Southern, especially modelling.