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Stagecoach South West - Fleet News & Discussion

embers25

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16 Jul 2009
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1,816
For me, living on the eastern edge of Exeter the Falcon is the quickest way for me to get to Plymouth.
Same living by Honiton Road P and R. I use it to Plymouth, Marley Head for Totnes, the airport, and Bristol. It also used to connect well with the 126 to Weston and Wells.
I'm on it tonight to the Airport and will ask the driver about the proposed timetable change but rumour is stagecoach haven't even begun looking at rotas for their April 2 changes even yet.There are also no notices anywhere I can see relating to the new Mar 27 Falcon schedule and, if it does change, it will massively reduce its usefulness westbound as the X38 won't be much slower and overnight eastbound will have so much waiting around. My journey tonight from Honiton Road will increase by 1 hour in theory and even in peak summer a 2am coach does not need a 1 hr increase.
 
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TheWalrus

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The coaches used on the route are 2015 models. They're now over 7 years old. This is around the time the group would be looking to replace them with new vehicles. I would surmise that the business case for 'new' vehicles might not be there - otherwise they'd have been delivered or ordered. Other parts of the group get new vehicles every few years for their best performing services so that the other buses are cascaded elsewhere in the company/group.

Putting it under megabus might help with that, as it's a part of the group regularly receiving new vehicles. The back office functions are taken care of by them.

If you were being entirely cynical, you can see how Stagecoach is trying to ensure the service is no longer viable through continual changes to the timetable, the introduction of unreliable services and a worsening level of reliability from older coaches going forwards. These coaches as they age will require more maintenance than when they were new as compnents wear out. I can see a complete withdrawal of the route in a few years from now. Stagecoach South West has a lot of issues at present with service delivery - their recent visit to the traffic commissioners resulted in them offering free travel in place of a fine for non compliant operation of local bus services.
Could the Falcon transfer to Bristol depot run by Stagecoach West? It would change the logistics slightly though.
 

embers25

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Tonight's driver knew nothing of the Falcon changes and said they'd be unworkable with the tachos.
 

markymark2000

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Western Part of the UK
Tonight's driver knew nothing of the Falcon changes and said they'd be unworkable with the tachos.
Most of it would be fine on tacho as the bus would be sat around at some stops forever. Time sitting at bus stops is other work, not drive time. It would be frowned upon though that the company is relying on that fact for the run to be done legally.
 

matt_splat

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19 May 2012
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897
When the route first started didn't a driver go passenger to the airport to cover breaks into and out of Bristol? Maybe a Bristol driver could do the airport to the centre which would allow for a break. It would also reduce delays in Bristol on turn around.
 

RELL6L

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19 May 2014
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985
I expect this post will bore some people to death but I am quite interested in logistics and how things work. Now I could wait until perhaps the schools go back after Easter and this will become apparent on MusTimes, but in the meantime this is about the extended service 85 to Tavistock and the Bude outstation.

Having seen the timetable for the 85 from the start of April I am intrigued by a couple of things: (1) there are more journeys from Holsworthy to Tavistock than returning from Tavistock, including an odd journey at 18.50 from Holsworthy to Tavistock – why? And (2), in addition, there are more journeys from Holsworthy to Barnstaple than returning from Barnstaple. In both cases there are five journeys from Holsworthy and only four to Holsworthy.

Let’s start with the Tavistock end. The odd one out looks to be the 18.50 from Holsworthy to Tavistock. How is it run? The options to me would be (1) a Bude vehicle, having done something else, runs empty to Holsworthy, then runs the 85 to Tavistock then empty back to Bude; (2) a Tavistock vehicle, having done something else, runs empty from the Tavistock area to Holsworthy then in service back to Tavistock; (3) a Tavistock vehicle actually runs on the service or in the North Devon area for some of the day and uses this journey to get back to base.

The next question is why run the journey? It doesn’t appear to connect with anything, it is 45 minutes after the 85 from Barnstaple and Bideford has passed by, there is no evening journey to Holsworthy on the 71 any more (I’ll come to this later), yes it does connect with the college day 6 from Okehampton but why bother when this journey also connects with a Go Cornwall 306 at Okehampton which gets travellers to Launceston much quicker and the bus direct from Okehampton to Tavistock would take Exeter passengers there -and it runs all days (inc Saturdays) not just college days – and there’s no connection with the college run 6 in the morning (Holsworthy at 06.27). There seems to be no logical reason for it running. While not ruling out Devon county council instructing it to be run on the tender for an illogical reason it must be more likely that it is being run simply because it is convenient for Stagecoach. Which leads me to conclusion (3), that a Tavistock vehicle runs somewhere in North Devon and this is bringing it home. What could it be doing before getting to Holsworthy at 18.50? It could be the 72 finishing at Shebbear at 18.20, or the 372 which finishes at Bradworthy at 18.14, both of these currently run empty to Bude. The 72 is currently a decker so this is less likely but you never know.

For this to make sense then Tavistock have to be involved somewhere in North Devon. The most logical way for this would be for a Tavistock vehicle to run empty to Holsworthy to take up the 85 at 7.05 to Tavistock, then run on the 85 doing the 8.30 round trip to Barnstaple, then the 14.10 Tavistock to Barnstaple, returning from Barnstaple to either Shebbear or Bradworthy as above. Logically then Barnstaple run the 8.40 and 14.20 round trips from Barnstaple while Bude run the 7.05 Bridgerule to Barnstaple and 16.55 return, which is essentially what happens now, with a decker which works on other routes during the day in between. So that’s my suggestion as to what is going to happen. Alternatively perhaps Tavistock run the 372 in full, which means in the morning a Tavistock bus will run empty to Bradworthy, run the 372, Bideford locals during the day, then run the evening 372 followed by the 85 to Tavistock.

This leaves the question of the Bude outstation and what it does. At the moment I think it does this:
  • A decker on the 6 all day
  • A decker running the 819 contract in both morning and afternoon, spending the day in Barnstaple
  • A decker running the 919 contract in the morning and the 6 schoolday and college day afternoon journeys
  • A decker running the 85 (and currently 185) journeys and other services during the day
  • A decker running the 72, starting and finishing at Shebbear
  • An E200 running the 71 journeys that start and finish at Holsworthy, doing other things during the day (usually the 85)
  • A Solo running the 372, including local services around Bideford during the day.
Any of these (except the 6 and usually the 919 contract / 6 bus) can be swapped around Barnstaple or Bideford for vehicle servicing requirements, the E200 is different every day, but one assumes the drivers head back to Bude on these workings.

Going forward, if we assume that Tavistock run the evening 372 (it could be something else), and given that there will be a morning 71 from Holsworthy but no evening return working, we have the Bude position appearing unbalanced. In the morning it will provide buses for the 6, the 71, the 72, the 85, the 372, the 819 contract and the 919 contract, that’s seven. In the evening buses will return home from the 6, the 6 schooldays, the 819 contract, the 72 and the 85, that’s only five, so two short. So how is this going to work? Maybe the 919 contract won’t be run by Bude, but then something has to get to Bude for the afternoon only work on the 6. I don’t know the answer to this. Perhaps Barnstaple will run the morning Shebbear start on the 72, which will be college days only. Perhaps Bude will run something which finishes at Great Torrington, either the 71 at 18.42 or the 75 at 18.48. I will wait with interest to find out!
 

richard13

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20 Jan 2019
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123
Having seen the timetable for the 85 from the start of April I am intrigued by a couple of things: (1) there are more journeys from Holsworthy to Tavistock than returning from Tavistock, including an odd journey at 18.50 from Holsworthy to Tavistock – why? And (2), in addition, there are more journeys from Holsworthy to Barnstaple than returning from Barnstaple. In both cases there are five journeys from Holsworthy and only four to Holsworthy.

Let’s start with the Tavistock end. The odd one out looks to be the 18.50 from Holsworthy to Tavistock. How is it run? The options to me would be (1) a Bude vehicle, having done something else, runs empty to Holsworthy, then runs the 85 to Tavistock then empty back to Bude; (2) a Tavistock vehicle, having done something else, runs empty from the Tavistock area to Holsworthy then in service back to Tavistock; (3) a Tavistock vehicle actually runs on the service or in the North Devon area for some of the day and uses this journey to get back to base.
85 - Both directions start at Holsworthy/Bridgerule at 07:05. There are then 4 trips each way throughout. The buses cross at Holsworthy and it was mentioned somewhere that the drivers will swap over at that point. The last journey southbound from Barnstaple runs early and diverts to Bridgerule and then returns to Holsworthy and waits for the northbound bus to swap drivers. Where the 07:05 start buses come from and thus end is not clear. Tavistock and Barnstaple would centralise resources and thus the Bude outstation looks likely to shrink and maybe eventually to nothing.
 

RELL6L

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19 May 2014
Messages
985
85 - Both directions start at Holsworthy/Bridgerule at 07:05. There are then 4 trips each way throughout. The buses cross at Holsworthy and it was mentioned somewhere that the drivers will swap over at that point. The last journey southbound from Barnstaple runs early and diverts to Bridgerule and then returns to Holsworthy and waits for the northbound bus to swap drivers. Where the 07:05 start buses come from and thus end is not clear. Tavistock and Barnstaple would centralise resources and thus the Bude outstation looks likely to shrink and maybe eventually to nothing.
Interesting. I can see the timetable looks designed for drivers to swap at Holsworthy, but I don't think that's common Stagecoach practice. Seems odd to run empty from Bridgerule to Holsworthy at 18.05 when other buses run empty the other way towards Bude at that time. Also at the moment the equivalent journey from Barnstaple is a decker, presumably for capacity on college days, I would be surprised if Tavistock was putting a decker out on the 85. If anything it would be some other journey that heads to Holsworthy for 18.50 to do as you say, eg the 372 perhaps. Let's see.
 

MarkC

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3 Nov 2016
Messages
221
That's what I would guess as well with main 1 continuing Tavistock-Royal Parade every 20min & new 1A George Park & Ride-Royal Parade-Sherford every 20min combining every 10min George P+R-Royal Parade. Presumably the local 2 group would no longer serve Sherford (particularly if half-hourly Gold & occasional X38 will also serve the new town on top of the new Devon County Council contracted Citybus Plymouth-Ivybridge 20)?
Just for the record the CityBus 20 service will no longer serve Sherford from end of March. Instead it will operate from Ivybridge/ Lee Mill via Marsh Mills and Embankment to Plymouth Basically the Gold and 20 routes in and out of Plymouth have swapped around!
 

fgwrich

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15 Apr 2009
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Between Edinburgh and Exeter
Apologies if I’ve missed anything, but would anyone happen to know why there are 2 Stagecoach South West vehicles in Cornwall at the moment?

(Attached images are screenshots from the tracking view on bustimes.org)
 

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volvob12

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18 Aug 2021
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CUBA
Apologies if I’ve missed anything, but would anyone happen to know why there are 2 Stagecoach South West vehicles in Cornwall at the moment?

(Attached images are screenshots from the tracking view on bustimes.org)
Click on them and look at the tracking. They’ve been doing rail replacement work (again) today.
 

DaveHarries

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12 Dec 2011
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2,298
Location
England
And another entry for the Falcon:

PH1020951/281 Registered
STAGECOACH DEVON LTD
Route: Plymouth Bus Station to Bristol, Cabot Circus via Taunton, Cullompton
Service number: FAL
Service type: Limited Stop
Effective date: 01 May 2023

A look under "more details" (export as CSV) says that this is for "Punctuality changes to improve reliability."
(Source: https://www.vehicle-operator-licens...52d508622c80b02b73709040f4a#validationSummary)

Dave
 

Wolvercoter

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29 Sep 2010
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495
Location
Exeter, Devon
I see that Stagecoach South West will be taking over the 345, 315 and 377 from Go Devon Bus from 05/06/2023. Return to 5A, 5B and 5C. Details on Devon County Council website, although I can't see anything on the Stagecoach site.


The current operator of Services 315, 345 and 377 linking Exeter with Barnstaple, Okehampton and Chumleigh, has notified us that they no longer wish to operate these services. Working in partnership with Devon County Council, Stagecoach South West will provide replacement services, which will start from Monday 5 June 2023.

Service 315 will be replaced by Service 5B, which will provide up to four journeys per day Monday to Saturday between Exeter and Barnstaple via Crediton, Winkleigh, Great Torrington and Bideford.

Hatherleigh and Okehampton will be served by the extension of existing Service 5 journeys between Exeter and Crediton, which will operate roughly every two hours. These journeys will be known as Service 5A.

A number of Service 5 journeys between Exeter and Crediton will be extended to Chumleigh every two hours throughout the day Monday to Saturday. These journeys will be known as Service 5C.

Through Services 5, 5A, 5B and 5C, buses will operate every 20 minutes between Exeter and Crediton throughout the day Monday to Saturday, with certain journeys continuing beyond Crediton towards Okehampton, Barnstaple and Chumleigh.

The new routes provide extensions beyond Stagecoach’s existing route 5 service which connects Exeter with Crediton via Cowley and Newton St Cyres. A 20 minute frequency will continue to be offered between Crediton and Exeter on Monday to Saturdays with 10 trips per day operating in each direction on a Sunday. The introduction of the new services will provide up to twenty additional journeys a day, Monday to Saturdays, connecting communities between Exeter and Okehampton, Chulmleigh or Barnstaple. A map of the new services is online.

The timetables have been designed to offer connections for students travelling into Exeter college, and also to provide opportunities for residents across the region to commute into the city by bus. Buses will arrive into Exeter from 0800 in the morning, Monday to Fridays, with departures from Okehampton leaving at 0617, from Barnstaple at 0610 and Chulmleigh at 0645. The last bus departs Exeter for Okehampton at 1845, for Barnstaple at 1815 (connection from service 5) and for Chulmleigh at 1750.

Stagecoach South West Head of Commercial, Simon Ford said:

“We’re delighted to be in a position to be able to offer these services under contract to Devon County Council. We hope that communities across this part of our region will benefit from the addition of these services to our network. We’re proud to continue to offer connections to Exeter college and places of work across the city.”

Customers will also be able to continue to benefit from the cap to single bus fares, with all single journeys costing just £2 or less until the end of June. Customers can also benefit from a range of great value tickets options from Stagecoach enabling unlimited travel across the day. The company’s heavily discounted Termrider tickets offer savings of up to 28% for those in full time education, with travel in the Exeter zone equivalent to just £1.57* per day. The range of flexible ticket bundles offered by Stagecoach will find you a saving of up to 30% on daily bus travel, with those travelling in the Exeter zone from just £3.50 per day. For more information visit Stagecoach’s website.

Their new 5 services timetable is available online.
 

geoffk

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4 Aug 2010
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I see that Stagecoach South West will be taking over the 345, 315 and 377 from Go Devon Bus from 05/06/2023. Return to 5A, 5B and 5C. Details on Devon County Council website, although I can't see anything on the Stagecoach site.
So it's back to where we were a few months ago. A more sensible service pattern without the duplication between Exeter and Crediton but we have to hope that Stagecoach now have enough drivers to cover this extra work. Go Devon was, I was told, using agency drivers from a base at Winkleigh, presumably put up in B&Bs. (What exactly are agency drivers - are they self-employed?)
 

henryb

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27 Nov 2021
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Newton Abbot
I see that Stagecoach South West will be taking over the 345, 315 and 377 from Go Devon Bus from 05/06/2023. Return to 5A, 5B and 5C. Details on Devon County Council website, although I can't see anything on the Stagecoach site.

So it's back to where we were a few months ago. A more sensible service pattern without the duplication between Exeter and Crediton but we have to hope that Stagecoach now have enough drivers to cover this extra work. Go Devon was, I was told, using agency drivers from a base at Winkleigh, presumably put up in B&Bs. (What exactly are agency drivers - are they self-employed?)
Not sure about the agency drivers. But where are these new drivers coming from? I was under the impression that they were still short staffed yet they are picking up the new 97 route and the 173. Doesn’t help that other bus routes were completey rammed and some cancelled yesterday
 

geoffk

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Not sure about the agency drivers. But where are these new drivers coming from? I was under the impression that they were still short staffed yet they are picking up the new 97 route and the 173. Doesn’t help that other bus routes were completely rammed and some cancelled yesterday
Didn't know about 173. Dartline is now owned by Go Devon and I would have expected them to pick up some/all of the rural routes beyond Crediton. What's 97?
 

henryb

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Didn't know about 173. Dartline is now owned by Go Devon and I would have expected them to pick up some/all of the rural routes beyond Crediton. What's 97?
The 97 is the Exmouth town route (formerly 7 and run by Dartline) 173 is definitely now Stagecoach
 

geoffk

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The 97 is the Exmouth town route (formerly 7 and run by Dartline) 173 is definitely now Stagecoach
Thanks for info. 173 will have to be an Optare Solo and these don't fit on the stands in Exeter bus station, so Stagecoach will need to carry on using Sidwell Street as a terminus (as they do on 360).
 

embers25

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Thanks for info. 173 will have to be an Optare Solo and these don't fit on the stands in Exeter bus station, so Stagecoach will need to carry on using Sidwell Street as a terminus (as they do on 360).
There is a 57 in the morning run by a solo and so a solo uses the bus station daily. Thd 5A and 5B both running together as far as North Tawton at 0925 and 0930 is a bit dumb.
 

geoffk

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There is a 57 in the morning run by a solo and so a solo uses the bus station daily. Thd 5A and 5B both running together as far as North Tawton at 0925 and 0930 is a bit dumb.
I've seen the odd Solo in there. The problem is that the Solo has the door behind the front axle so it doesn't line up with the raised boarding/alighting area.
 

richard13

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20 Jan 2019
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123
These new Stagecoach Routes - the 97 (was7) and 173 are the existing timetable. The 5A (345) 5B (315) 5C (377) are much reduced and not much better than half the current service. The new timetables look as if they better match actual usage and probably shows why Go Devon have given them up.

The 5B will be run by Barnstaple as a stand alone service with 5 departures (currently 8 to Exeter) - the 05:22 turns back at North Tawton with a 5A connection to Exeter, the 06:10, 9:00 and 14:00 run through to Exeter with the 17:00 turning back at Crediton with connections to/from Exeter.

The 5A in shopping hours is split at North Tawton with 2 Hourly to Okehampton and hourly to Exeter otherwise similar peak service or 2 hourly.

The 5C is largely halved to 2 hourly, but with beginning and end journeys starting / finishing in Exeter.

Dartline - I presume the Plymouth City Bus management have been going through the economics of their new operation and in the current climate some services are found to be loss making. I suspect that some of their bids will not be as relatively cheap as the private Dartline was and looking at things like dead mileage or out-stationing of buses. The new management will apply different pricing and Dartline will change. The Exmouth 7 always looked odd to me as an infrequent town service that does not accept Stagecoach area tickets and thus not useable as a connection to anywhere else, except by Pass holders.
 

150249

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13 Dec 2021
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I suppose the 173 and 97 will take optares. Where will they get them from? 48032/034/035?
 

henryb

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27 Nov 2021
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Newton Abbot
Yes I noticed. I stood waiting for ages at Antonine Crescent ready to get a photo of it only for it to turn down Gloucester Road.


Yet it seems to be a dartline bus on the route today
That’s because they haven’t take over the contract yet, it was just route learning for when they do
 

158 fan

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1 Jun 2023
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south west
What are our new hand-me-down Optare Solo SRs doing and why was YJ66 ASO on the B? Is it a longer bus?
 
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150249

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Exeter
They are 3 from Stagecoach East. 48032, 48034 and 48035. They barely saw service in Cambridge. Yes they are longer I believe.
 

Apedlar12

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13 Apr 2017
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I have recently been told that 24149/150/151 will be transferring from Exeter to Barnstaple to be used on the new 5B starting this Monday (5th June).
 

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