Station lighting times

[thenorthern]

This may seem a strange thread but I was looking out for the Northern Lights the other night which sadly never came.

One thing I did notice though was that intermediate stations between Stoke-on-Trent and Derby switch off their station lighting at around 23:00 presumably as the line closes at 22:00 and there is little point in keeping the stations lit when there are not going to be any trains passing.

It made me think though what is the policy with station lighting and do stations on lines open 24 hours a day but with no trains stopping after 22:00 such as Alsager keep their lights on right through the night.

Also is station lighting the responsibility of the TOC or Network Rail.

 

[Elecman]

The TOCS are responsible for station lighting but if a train stops gave to call after dark the station must be lit. In most cases the lights will be turned off after last booked service and before first service by a combination of time lock and photocell control.

 

[Gathursty]

I know that Pemberton's lights shut off a little bit after 8pm (as no evening services on the Kirkby Northern branch)

I remember being at an unlit Kirton Lindsey platform on a cold, dark, late Winter evening doing some bagging and looking up to see many constellations above me. Wigan is quite opposite to the Lincolnshire Wolds and is too well lit to see anything good up in the heavens.

 

[mbreckers]

All I can contribute is that a lot of ScotRail managed station have sensors near the platform entrances to switch on the lights if they are off at night

 

[causton]

Some stations will stay open without lighting and some will close, for example stations on the Great Northern route have closed but I remember some in Northern territory have remained open, just with a reminder for people to be more careful.

 

[hassaanhc]

Some stations will stay open without lighting and some will close, for example stations on the Great Northern route have closed but I remember some in Northern territory have remained open, just with a reminder for people to be more careful.

Think it is to do with whether DOO services call there or not. I remember it being mentioned that there is a higher minimum lighting level for stations that DOO services call at. As a result, SWT stations seem to stay open during lighting failures. However, just now the 2336 Brighton to Bedford will not call at Balcombe due to lighting issues.

 

[tsr]

Think it is to do with whether DOO services call there or not. I remember it being mentioned that there is a higher minimum lighting level for stations that DOO services call at. As a result, SWT stations seem to stay open during lighting failures. However, just now the 2336 Brighton to Bedford will not call at Balcombe due to lighting issues.

Some Southern services did call at Balcombe during the lighting issues last night as they were able to dwell in the platform (as is standard practice) whilst conductors ensured that passengers were away from the train safely before dispatching. But of course the DOO equipment used by Thameslink does indeed need some level of ambient light to operate. Platform 1 and the car park at Balcombe were affected by this issue.

Most Southern stations seem to have all-night lighting of some description. Apart from those served by overnight services, many only have a gap of a couple of hours between first and last trains, so the energy saving and cost-effectiveness of timers/photosensitive switches is probably negated by the cost of fitting and maintaining them. However, automatic dimmers are used at some locations.

 

[DarloRich]

Will the station lights not be on time, movement or light based sensors?

 

[John Webb]

There seem to be several stations north of St Pancras, including St Albans City, where despite the lamp heads being apparently fitted with photo-cells, the lights are often on in broad daylight, particularly at this time of year. Seems to be that they are on a time switch which doesn't have a 'solar' dial to compensate for the changes in sunset/sunrise over the year.

 

[Deepgreen]

I believe different stations have different switching regimes. What annoys me is when the station lights are on 24 hours a day while even the smallest works are undertaken there - the waste of electricity is huge. My local station is Betchworth, which has faux gas-type lighting, which has been on 24 hours a day for the last week, for no apparent reason! Then there are the siding sodium overhead lights that have been on permanently at Redhill's disused sidings for several years without ever seeing a train in that time!

 

[tsr]

Then there are the siding sodium overhead lights that have been on permanently at Redhill's disused sidings for several years without ever seeing a train in that time!

Trains do occasionally use the sidings, especially the Up Goods Loop and Snowplough Siding, but you wouldn't often see them because it typically happens for run-round moves at about 4-5am! As I have said before, I believe the lighting on the Up side of the station may be controlled by DB Schenker or an associated company, leading to possible complications in maintenance - and they would have to fit switching to the lights which was accessible from all walking routes to and from the sidings, as well as drivers of arriving freight trains, in order for the lights to be safely used.

If you look on the Tonbridge side, you will see the Up Tonbridge Siding has lighting fitted. This is because the sidings are used to store Southern and FGW stock, and usually need to be able to be accessed at almost all hours of the day. Some of this lighting is newer than the rest, and presumably at least marginally more energy efficient.

What would be better would be LED lights or movement sensors controlled by trains entering the sidings (with manual overrides), but I should imagine that this would not be cost effective on the Up side, as the sidings will probably change beyond recognition in the next year or so.

 

[causton]

Think it is to do with whether DOO services call there or not. I remember it being mentioned that there is a higher minimum lighting level for stations that DOO services call at. As a result, SWT stations seem to stay open during lighting failures. However, just now the 2336 Brighton to Bedford will not call at Balcombe due to lighting issues.

That makes sense actually, never considered it might be the DOO equipment that would be affected!

 

[najaB]

I'm curious about this as well. Springfield station only gets three or four calls a day but almost always seems to be lit when I pass through on a train. I'm wondering if they lights are on all the time, or are they switched on by the approach of a train?

 

[reb0118]

Springfield station.... almost always seems to be lit

The lights may be on but there is nobody at home.............

 

[thenorthern]

Berney Arms I think can't have trains calling throughout the night as the platform isn't lit I think but according to Real Time Trains there is one very late night train passing the station. Also didn't Llangelynin have to close in 1991 because of lighting issues.

 

[Deepgreen]

Trains do occasionally use the sidings, especially the Up Goods Loop and Snowplough Siding, but you wouldn't often see them because it typically happens for run-round moves at about 4-5am! As I have said before, I believe the lighting on the Up side of the station may be controlled by DB Schenker or an associated company, leading to possible complications in maintenance - and they would have to fit switching to the lights which was accessible from all walking routes to and from the sidings, as well as drivers of arriving freight trains, in order for the lights to be safely used.

If you look on the Tonbridge side, you will see the Up Tonbridge Siding has lighting fitted. This is because the sidings are used to store Southern and FGW stock, and usually need to be able to be accessed at almost all hours of the day. Some of this lighting is newer than the rest, and presumably at least marginally more energy efficient.

What would be better would be LED lights or movement sensors controlled by trains entering the sidings (with manual overrides), but I should imagine that this would not be cost effective on the Up side, as the sidings will probably change beyond recognition in the next year or so.

The goods loop is used, yes, but that isn't where the offending lights are. Judging by the thickness of the rust on the snowplough siding (very much thicker than the loop), nothing has used it for a very long time. It just beggars belief that something so simple as a light switch should be so hard to get right! Movement sensors would be great, and the Tonbridge sidings are at least occasionally used (I saw a 166 in there last week).

 

[Peter Mugridge]

There seem to be several stations north of St Pancras, including St Albans City, where despite the lamp heads being apparently fitted with photo-cells, the lights are often on in broad daylight, particularly at this time of year. Seems to be that they are on a time switch which doesn't have a 'solar' dial to compensate for the changes in sunset/sunrise over the year.

It could be that the pigeons have put a decorative coat over the photosensors. A time switch will only allow the lights to switch off outside operating hours. Within operating hours it's purely down to the photosensors.

 

[John Webb]

It could be that the pigeons have put a decorative coat over the photosensors. A time switch will only allow the lights to switch off outside operating hours. Within operating hours it's purely down to the photosensors.

I'm pretty certain that the photocells are simply not connected up. Every light is either on or off at the same time, including the approach road to the multi-story carpark. Does seem a waste when the photocells appear to be fitted and therefore usable.

 

[tsr]

The goods loop is used, yes, but that isn't where the offending lights are. Judging by the thickness of the rust on the snowplough siding (very much thicker than the loop), nothing has used it for a very long time. It just beggars belief that something so simple as a light switch should be so hard to get right! Movement sensors would be great, and the Tonbridge sidings are at least occasionally used (I saw a 166 in there last week).

You'd need the same set of lights to illuminate the Goods Loop and Snowplough Siding to perform any shunting manoeuvres there. Ambient lighting from the car park and station is not reliable enough.

And it would not quite be as simple as "a light switch". You'd need controls from all the authorised walking routes to the sidings, as well as some accessible from any train arriving. The shunter for these sidings will often arrive by train. When I consider how many times I see sensor-operated lights on walking routes having problems, I think it's easier not to. Also, you might have to replace the lights themselves at great cost, as I think those lights at Redhill take a while to start up (not really suitable for sensor use).

As for the Tonbridge Sidings, those are used at least a couple of times a day, but you'd usually have to be waiting for the 0504 Up Thameslink at Redhill to see them in use, or else waiting at some point in the evening when stock is released from passenger duties and worked ECS down there. For reference, drivers on duties involving the sidings will often end up booking on considerably before 5am.

 

[pitdiver]

Berney Arms I think can't have trains calling throughout the night as the platform isn't lit I think but according to Real Time Trains there is one very late night train passing the station. Also didn't Llangelynin have to close in 1991 because of lighting issues.

Talking of Berney Arms will all forum members be aware that the Berney Arms itself is now closed and will possibly never reopen

 

[thenorthern]

Talking of Berney Arms will all forum members be aware that the Berney Arms itself is now closed and will possibly never reopen

When did it close?

 

[Ediswan]

Talking of Berney Arms will all forum members be aware that the Berney Arms itself is now closed and will possibly never reopen

If so, somebody really ought to tell National Rail Enquiries. The website is still showing services and ticket prices.

 

[greatkingrat]

Does he mean that the pub of the same name has closed?

 

[Elecman]

Unfortunately the normal failure mode for photocells leaves the lights on!! Hence lights being on in daylight.

 

[lincolnshire]

Unfortunately the normal failure mode for photocells leaves the lights on!! Hence lights being on in daylight.

It could also be the dreaded sticky fingers who have flicked the override switch and not switched it back to auto again, seen that happen many times the usual a little knowledge is dangerous and costly in electric consumption.

 

[Deepgreen]

You'd need the same set of lights to illuminate the Goods Loop and Snowplough Siding to perform any shunting manoeuvres there. Ambient lighting from the car park and station is not reliable enough.

And it would not quite be as simple as "a light switch". You'd need controls from all the authorised walking routes to the sidings, as well as some accessible from any train arriving. The shunter for these sidings will often arrive by train. When I consider how many times I see sensor-operated lights on walking routes having problems, I think it's easier not to. Also, you might have to replace the lights themselves at great cost, as I think those lights at Redhill take a while to start up (not really suitable for sensor use).

As for the Tonbridge Sidings, those are used at least a couple of times a day, but you'd usually have to be waiting for the 0504 Up Thameslink at Redhill to see them in use, or else waiting at some point in the evening when stock is released from passenger duties and worked ECS down there. For reference, drivers on duties involving the sidings will often end up booking on considerably before 5am.

All understood, but the goods loop lights are NOT on all day every day, when the snowplough siding ones have been on permanently for the last three years at least. The Tonbridge sidings are also not on during daylight hours. So my point was; why do the snowplough units have to be on when the others don't/aren't - I'm surprised they've not burnt out by now.

 

[transportphoto]

Does he mean that the pub of the same name has closed?

The pub. The station is very much still open.

 

[reb0118]

The pub.

Closed for the season or permanently?

 

[pitdiver]

Does he mean that the pub of the same name has closed?

Yes sorry it's the Pub that has closed. So don't get.
stuck in that area as there's nowhere else to take shelter. My source friends who cruise on the Broads.

 

[alxndr]

Swindon station remains on all night long.