Storm Gerrit related disruptions-27/12/23

[DJCC]

Even in London £300/night will get you a very decent hotel - no wonder LNER don't publicise it much! Do other TOCs have the same policy?

 

[JModulo]

Does anyone know how long the flooding between Lockerbie and Carstairs is likely to keep the WCML blocked?
I seem to recall it happens at least once a year.
I am due to travel to Edinburgh tomorrow p.m.

Its currently open. Been a few freight services, and a pendo has left Glasgow heading south.

 

[greyman42]

It looks like an HST has suffered a bit of damage at Broughty Ferry:

Source: https://twitter.com/Longydfc/status/1740022708446830880


View attachment 149181

(Image from twitter shows a damage cab and a ScotRail HST. Someone in high-vis stands next to the powercar)

Is that going to be a write off?

 

[benbristow]

Sat on the 1130 LNER from London Kings Cross to Edinburgh.

What a journey.

Was meant to go from Cleethorpes to Warrington Central then change to Bank Quay then go up with Avanti to Glasgow but saw news that the WCML was having problems so decided to go the East Coast instead from Doncaster (anytime ticket).

Saw a LNER train to Edinburgh at Doncaster waiting at the station which should've departed. Staff saying for people standing to leave the train. No way I was going to jump on. Went for a wander around the station got back and the train was still sat there. Saw someone boarding and there was room so sneaked on board and off we went. Managed to grab a seat at York.

Train stopped at Newcastle for about half an hour needing a new TM and Driver who were delayed on another delayed service. Train just started moving again out of nowhere.

Good job I decided to hop on when I did as seen the train recommended to board at Doncaster was cancelled north of Newcastle.

Then just gone past Berwick-Upon-Tweed. Stopped there for some reason even though not scheduled. Announcement just gone out saying there's been overhead line issues and the train had to switch from electric to diesel. Thank you hybrid trains. Now running back on electric.

All good fun on the iron road lol.

 

[The Prisoner]

First freight services through Lockerbie around 1630. Tesco/DRS before Av*nti https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:H08460/2023-12-27/detailed

 

[flitwickbeds]

Even in London £300/night will get you a very decent hotel - no wonder LNER don't publicise it much! Do other TOCs have the same policy?

Hmm, not so sure any more. I work in the events industry and am constantly booking hotel rooms for crew. We have a flat rate to our client of £200 for inner London which is supposed to cover the cost of the room plus maybe a little bit of profit. Recently even Travelodges in the suburbs have sometimes been north of £200 a night.

 

[12LDA28C]

There are a few delays but not many cancellations at Edinburgh Airport this morning. Seems that the airline industry is far more robust and customer-focused than the railways these days.

Totally different industries so an irrelevant comparison. You don't see too many planes striking fallen trees or encountering flooding at 37,000 feet.

 

[bramling]

Yet another day of LNER giving up and leaving their customers to fend for themselves. It’s happening far too often to believe this company is fit for purpose.

To be fair, we are going through an absolutely rancid run of weather. It is rather unfortunate that this coincides with Christmas, but it is what it is.

 

[Lost property]

Totally different industries so an irrelevant comparison. You don't see too many planes striking fallen trees or encountering flooding at 37,000 feet.

True, but they do tend to strike other aircraft on the ground, ground equipment and various bits of infrastructure instead.

However, there is a very close similarity when it comes to airlines parting with money for compensation

 

[mm333]

Was meant to go from Cleethorpes to Warrington Central then change to Bank Quay then go up with Avanti to Glasgow but saw news that the WCML was having problems so decided to go the East Coast instead from Doncaster (anytime ticket).

Saw a LNER train to Edinburgh at Doncaster waiting at the station which should've departed. Staff saying for people standing to leave the train. No way I was going to jump on. Went for a wander around the station got back and the train was still sat there. Saw someone boarding and there was room so sneaked on board and off we went. Managed to grab a seat at York.

Good work. Were you on the 1224 from Cleethorpes like I was? I thought that was going to get cancelled for a moment as it they were struggling to get into the front cab of the rear set. There has so far been four cancelled TPX services from Cleethorpes today.

I got into Doncaster in time to get a Northern stopper to Leeds that was 30 minutes late. But that terminated at Wakefield Westgate. The next service to Leeds was a crammed double Voyager north but I knew there was an Azuma 5 minutes behind so I happily waited for that.

 

[Trainguy34]

Any updates on the Scotrail HST that struck a tree?

 

[benbristow]

Good work. Were you on the 1224 from Cleethorpes like I was? I thought that was going to get cancelled for a moment as it they were struggling to get into the front cab of the rear set. There has so far been four cancelled TPX services from Cleethorpes today.

I got into Doncaster in time to get a Northern stopper to Leeds that was 30 minutes late. But that terminated at Wakefield Westgate. The next service to Leeds was a crammed double Voyager north but I knew there was an Azuma 5 minutes behind so I happily waited for that.

Yes I was. Rear cab nice and quiet as it doesn't open after Cleethorpes until Donny lol

 

[Tayway]

Any updates on the Scotrail HST that struck a tree?

I went to have a look about an hour ago, and there were only a couple of Network Rail operatives still at the scene. Presumably they will have to wait for daylight or at least better weather conditions to get it moved.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

Any updates on the Scotrail HST that struck a tree?

The driver went to hospital but luckily no serious injuries, likewise passengers and staff on the train.

 

[mm333]

Yes I was. Rear cab nice and quiet as it doesn't open after Cleethorpes until Donny lol

Doh! I should have realised that. *makes mental note for next time*

 

[30907]

It's becoming a joke how often they are doing that. I've just been through Kings X, there are hundreds if not thousands of people on the concourse. What are they supposed to do now?

As it turned out, LNER seem to have managed to run most of their trains most of the way but with some big delays.

 

[mralexn]

I don't know what's going on, however everything seems to have come to a stop around Morpeth. 1S25 has been waiting just outside the station for around 25 mins now with 1S97 close behind.

Well no sooner than I post that, 1S25 gets the road! :P

 

[gazzaa2]

Av*nti doing their usual and telling people not to travel north of Preston despite the line being open at the moment from Preston to Carlisle and TPE services operating - 1204 Glasgow to Liverpool has just started on time from Carlisle at 1328 https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:G67317/2023-12-27/detailed#allox_id=0

I appreciate operationally their staff split at Preston, but to turn around and just say it's too hard to serve Preston to Carlisle and not to travel - regardless of whether they operate the occasional service on that section - is the usual abdication of duty from a shockingly bad TOC.

Then you have an increasing number of people who were already en route stuck at Preston.

I've posted many times before about this - this "extreme" weather is happening literally every few weeks now. Does nobody sit down in the single brain cell that is Av*nti HQ and make any sort of a plan for disruption whatsoever?

It's got to the point where if there's a bit of rain due or it's windy, I would not risk travelling by train. A short commute at most and that would be with a contingency in place for any return. The railways don't have the contingencies these days.

I wouldn't travel north of Preston with Avanti in any weather.

 

[island]

Av*nti managed to run an empty service from Carlisle to Preston non stop at 1425. Could they really have not found anyone to staff it? How did it get there? On a line that is "closed".

Shambles.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:30113/2023-12-27/detailed

No train manager in the right place maybe.

 

[d70g]

I wouldn't travel north of Preston with Avanti in any weather.

As someone who regularly commutes between Preston and Glasgow - usually AWC but sometimes TPE - that's a wee bit hyperbolic. Avanti services are certainly better in clement weather. And whilst I’m very much not a AWC fanboy, the WCML north of Carlisle is prone to all of meteorological / topographical challenges that have long been a problem. Flooding is flooding. High winds are high wins, after all.

 

[londonmidland]

Gusty winds and showers will continue into tomorrow before dying off, however the next cause of concern is this next deep area of low pressure for this Saturday (30/12). Further widespread gusts, with the strongest winds in the South West, a large part of Wales and the North West. Around 65-75mph possible. Some high rainfall totals expected across Wales and the North West as well.

Should this be a named storm, it is expected to be called 'Storm Henk'

Charts from WXCharts

The picture above shows a wind gust chart which is forecasting another spell of wet and windy weather forecast for this Saturday (30/12) with some rail disruption likely.

 

[londonbridge]

What’s the overall forecast for Friday/Saturday? My current planned itinerary is Friday 15:48 Kings X-Doncaster, check in at hotel, then hop over to Rotherham for football, back to Doncaster then Sandall Park parkrun Saturday morning before 12:04 back to London.

 

[londonmidland]

What’s the overall forecast for Friday/Saturday? My current planned itinerary is Friday 15:48 Kings X-Doncaster, check in at hotel, then hop over to Rotherham for football, back to Doncaster then Sandall Park parkrun Saturday morning before 12:04 back to London.

Friday is looking like the much better day out of the two, with sunny spells for most places and just a moderate breeze. Saturday looks like a washout for most places, with gusty winds. Although do keep an eye on the forecast and travel news of course.

 

[RollingStock19]

A friend is booked on the 1S97 14:48 King’s Cross to Edinburgh service. Looking at real train times it’s formed from the 1E82 9:24 from Edinburgh, but can’t see if it’s departed and the 14:48 will be delayed? Anyone know?

It ran, but around 3hrs late. But you probably know that by now

I don't know what's going on, however everything seems to have come to a stop around Morpeth. 1S25 has been waiting just outside the station for around 25 mins now with 1S97 close behind.

Well no sooner than I post that, 1S25 gets the road! :P

There was reports of issues with the OLE around Alnmouth that required inspection. Things got moving pretty quickly though.

 

[MarkWi72]

Tree down on the Trent Valley between Lichfield and Rugby according to Avanti. Lines are blocked.

 

[Bantamzen]

I have to say that some comms channels failed badly yesterday. Case in point with the disruption on the Calder Valley route with Northern's website pointing to National Rail's for info, and NR pointing at Northern's. Thankfully the social media team were a bit more on point, and staff on stations and trains even more so with ticket acceptance communicated to Man Vic pretty quickly, for me at least. But anyone without access to social media or station staff, I can imagine they may have had long wait and serious problems.

 

[156421]

I have to say that some comms channels failed badly yesterday. Case in point with the disruption on the Calder Valley route with Northern's website pointing to National Rail's for info, and NR pointing at Northern's. Thankfully the social media team were a bit more on point, and staff on stations and trains even more so with ticket acceptance communicated to Man Vic pretty quickly, for me at least. But anyone without access to social media or station staff, I can imagine they may have had long wait and serious problems.

Unfortunately not everyone can access social media. Also another problem is that the social media teams often block people for showing dissent. For instance I can't see anything LNER tweets. I don't recall ever interacting with them... ah well.

 

[kermit]

I think the line from Edinburgh to Aberdeen is still closed, with LNER saying "no current estimate for reopening". Does anyone have any info on the chances of services running by Saturday 30th December, afternoon? Thanks

 

[TPO]

Not to defend the indefensible, but is there something in moving the problem here - that "you aren't going to get past Preston" potentially deters more people from the attempt, rather than leaving more people stranded at Carlisle, which arguably has fewer alternative onward transport options to Scotland.

Fundamentally isn't the issue that in these days of threadbare provision - everything is pushed to the max so there isn't really the scope to turn trains in places they aren't designed to, not to mention the fact the crew for much of the service GLC - PRE is provided from Polmadie, who are now somewhat severed from the rest of the WCML network. If there were more main lines in to Scotland you would stand more of a chance of one or more of them withstanding the weather, but as it is, all of the Anglo Scottish traffic descending on either Newcastle or Carlisle to board a 2 car sprinter to Glasgow seems equally problematic.

You wonder if something could be done "Collect free travel voucher when you use today's ticket tomorrow" to more actively discourage those who have an option to travel another time.

For those who don't have that option, its really another sorry day for long haul rail travel.

Good point.

Also, I think we need to consider that the expectation of people has changed, that there's a severe winter storm in the off doesn't seem to register.

Perhaps we need to remember than no matter how good our "technology" there's always something in a big weather event that will cause a problem. That might mean a journey curtailed, or a journey delayed. T'was ever thus, except that these days we are great at getting offended if it's not all perfect.

When I am planning to travel, I always check long term, medium term and short-term forecasts and make provision. If it's possible it might be bad weather, I will book flexible arrangements so they can be cancelled last minute. I choose my means of travel and route appropriately- longer way around, stick to main roads, use the van in which I can overnight if stuck. Yes, I have cancelled on occasion.

This weather event was forecast and widely published. It's a time of year when a lot of people are on a break, so resources for transport systems will be limited.

Could the transport infrastructure do better? Yes, it could. But if you want a transport system this is resilient for the worst conditions, it costs money; how many folks effected by this had a cheap advance ticket?

I also wonder if as a society we need to re-learn a lesson about respecting natural conditions, living within the limits they impose.

TPO

 

[Falcon1200]

The railways don't have the contingencies these days.

It is worth mentioning that in Scotland at least it was not just the railway affected by the weather but multiple roads were closed as well. Sometimes adverse weather will overcome all reasonable measures to cope with it.