SWR: Wrong engineering works timetables and warning from ORR

[Joe Paxton]

From the SWR homepage...

**The timetables on some routes at weekends may be incorrect. Please click on the dates when you intend to travel for further information. 03/04 February. 10/11 February. 17/18 February. 24/25 February.**

More info...

Ongoing problems with industry planning processes means that some weekend train timetables are currently displaying incorrectly.
We are working hard and doing everything we can alongside Network Rail to rectify this problem, but there is no quick fix and we anticipate the issue will continue for some time.
We are sorry that this may affect your ability to plan ahead and we will keep you updated on our progress to resolve this issue.
Please make a final check before starting your journey.

This is simply not good enough. What is the underlying problem, why has it happened and why can it not get sorted out?

 

[LAX54]

just looked a few on Trainline, they seem to be OK now, mind you not too much problem as SWR gave a link to their timetable joys of first world problems and computer errors !

 

[Joe Paxton]

just looked a few on Trainline, they seem to be OK now, mind you not too much problem as SWR gave a link to their timetable joys of first world problems and computer errors !

Yes problem as loads of people will look up train times using journey planners without looking at the SWR website whatsoever.

There was a similar message on the SWR site last month, and the result of it is that you end up with no confidence that any journey planner result is going to be correct at the weekend.

I appreciate rail industry data systems are complicated, but that's no excuse, it's not good enough.

 

[infobleep]

The same message is there for this weekend.

As it is an industry problem I assume it is affecting some other TOCs too.

If anyone able to say planning process problems are? Is it software related?

 

[Wombat]

It's interesting wording. "Industry planning processes" implies (to me, and possibly wrongly) that it's some sort of procedural problem rather than an IT problem. Which sounds unlikely, as you'd think that an offline process could be fixed.

 

[Romilly]

It's also a problem on Scotrail, although in the particular case I know about there are effectively no timetables yet for 4, 11 & 18 March 2018:

Is it usual for rail-replacement bus timetables not to have been entered into the journey planners with only 4 weeks to go until the first of the days for which they will be needed? I did try contacting Scotrail but the person replying simply agreed that there would be replacement buses on Sundays in March and didn't answer the question about when they would be put in the timetable.

 

[WatcherZero]

SWR have been warned by ORR over failing to provide customers accurate timetable information on engineering works.

http://orr.gov.uk/news-and-media/pr...t-of-national-regulatory-provisions-passenger

Statement: South Western Railway (SWR) – compliance with Condition 4 of the Passenger Licence and GB Statement of National Regulatory Provisions: Passenger
13 February 2018

The provision of information about rail services to enable passengers to plan or make their journeys with a reasonable degree of assurance is a requirement of Condition 4 of both the Passenger Licence and GB Statement of National Regulatory Provisions: Passenger.

All passenger licensees are therefore responsible for ensuring that appropriate, accurate and timely information is provided to railway passengers (including prospective passengers) to enable them to plan and make their journeys with a reasonable degree of assurance. Licensees are required to achieve this purpose to the greatest extent reasonably practicable. Our regular monitoring of train company performance identified that SWR may not be taking all the necessary steps to enable passengers to plan or make their journeys when train services are disrupted by planned engineering work.

We wrote to SWR 23 January 2018 setting out our serious concerns regarding the information provided to passengers about its rail services. We required SWR to take immediate action to ensure that passengers are provided with the information they need to make informed decisions.

In its response of 26 January 2018, SWR has set out a number of immediate improvements to provide better information to passengers. It has also given details of other enhancements together with measures designed to provide an enduring solution. We note that the action taken to date should make it easier for passengers to plan their journeys.

Nevertheless, it is important that the all of the promised improvements are delivered in a timely manner. We therefore intend to monitor SWR’s progress.

We have published today our exchange of letters with SWR given the seriousness of the issue and for the purposes of transparency.

We will also write directly to other passenger operators setting out our expectations for compliance with Condition 4 of the Passenger Licence and GB Statement of National Regulatory Provisions: Passenger. This will also be published on our website.

Correspondence

http://orr.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf...on-4-of-your-passenger-licence-2018-01-23.pdf

http://orr.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf...enger-licence-swr-reply-to-orr-2018-01-26.pdf

http://orr.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf...on-4-of-your-passenger-licence-2018-02-08.pdf

 

[theironroad]

This really is a shambles.

You only have to look at the swr Twitter feed at the weekends to see people who've pre booked a ticket for a certain train only to turn up at the station for that train to find it isn't running.

 

[Kite159]

This really is a shambles.

You only have to look at the swr Twitter feed at the weekends to see people who've pre booked a ticket for a certain train only to turn up at the station for that train to find it isn't running.

That happened to me yesterday, the train I had an advance ticket for had vanished from the system.

Some leisure travellers at the weekend will soon loss any faith in the railway and decide to use their own transport.

 

[theironroad]

That happened to me yesterday, the train I had an advance ticket for had vanished from the system.

Some leisure travellers at the weekend will soon loss any faith in the railway and decide to use their own transport.

I'm just curious, but even though there wasn't a train at the time you expected, were cheap advance fares available at the time you booked even if it turns out it was a fictional train?

 

[Romilly]

The Scotrail problem I mentioned at #6 is still ongoing: no Scotrail timetable yet for the particular route for 4, 11 and 18 March. The latest response from Scotrail customer relations was that they could see services in the timetable for those dates: alas, all they can see is the replacement buses for the four Sunday services run by train companies other than Scotrail. And staff at one of the stations could only say that they were sure there would be buses if there aren't trains: but nothing in the online timetable means that Advance tickets cannot be booked online or at the station.

 

[Kite159]

I'm just curious, but even though there wasn't a train at the time you expected, were cheap advance fares available at the time you booked even if it turns out it was a fictional train?

Advance tickets were available (at least in mid January) as I booked a £12.30 advance for the train which turned out to be fictional

 

[theironroad]

Advance tickets were available (at least in mid January) as I booked a £12.30 advance for the train which turned out to be fictional

Ok, glad that cheap rates were available. I take it this ticket was honoured without fuss on a actual running train?

 

[Kite159]

Ok, glad that cheap rates were available. I take it this ticket was honoured without fuss on a actual running train?

I just boarded the 18:15, gateline assistant just let me pass without checking the details and the guard didn't get to me until a couple minutes before arriving at Andover.

(and at least I should get £6.15 back for being ~ 40 minutes late)

 

[swt_passenger]

Just skimmed that linked SWR reply (29 page letter) and am still wondering when and why this problem first arose. Lost the will to live after about a dozen pages...

 

[TEW]

Seemed to be plenty of excuses, but not really any solutions. Incredible really that it took the ORR getting involved for SWR to publish PDF timetables for the engineering works, when they knew full well that accurate information was not available on journey planners even just a few days in advance. PDF timetable information has always been available for staff around a week in advance, so I don't see any reason public timetables couldn't have been produced for the website before.

 

[Fiyero]

It really is getting beyond a joke, I have had to cancel a planned trip because I didn't know if I'd be able to get home. I'm fine with engineering work and knowing what is and isn't possible but not knowing if I can get home seems ridiculous. It is making me, as a casual traveller, lose faith in them but I have little choice from my station

 

[43096]

Seemed to be plenty of excuses, but not really any solutions. Incredible really that it took the ORR getting involved for SWR to publish PDF timetables for the engineering works, when they knew full well that accurate information was not available on journey planners even just a few days in advance. PDF timetable information has always been available for staff around a week in advance, so I don't see any reason public timetables couldn't have been produced for the website before.

I really don't understand how and why this has changed from Stagecoach days? NR have been pretty shambolic with this stuff for some time, but SWT seemed to be able to manage round it without putting out misleading information. This seems to be something else that has gone backwards since First took over.

 

[pompeyfan]

I really don't understand how and why this has changed from Stagecoach days? NR have been pretty shambolic with this stuff for some time, but SWT seemed to be able to manage round it without putting out misleading information. This seems to be something else that has gone backwards since First took over.

SWR come in for a lot of stick, but to be fair this issue came up reasonably often with SWT, last Easter (where crew diagrams didn’t match up with ...anything) comes to mind.

 

[moley]

The way that certain parts of these letters read, once SWT knew they were loosing the franchise, they stopped preparing engineering work timetables for submission 18 weeks ahead. SWR were caught of guard and therefore have to use the late change process which only finalised timetables days ahead.

SWR are now talking about re-engaging with the process of submission 18 weeks ahead for the May timetable.