TfGM Bee Network - fleet discussion

[cnjb8]

It may be a number of possibilities, as follows:-

1. It may have been painted into Bee Network livery in error. We will know if more similar ones appear that it isn't an error.
2. It may be that it is allowed for restricted duties, such as schools and peak hour extra's.
3. It may be that if they have been converted to Euro 6 spec, they may have a five year extension in usage.

On another subject I haave heard that the 163 is to move to Queens Road with the next trache of franchising, and that the 58 plate 09 plate Scania OmniCity Deckers will be withdrawn, not sure though how true this is.

19481 is young enough and is compliant with emissions rules for the Bee Network, as are 09-plate Omnis at GNW

 

[GCH100]

19481 is young enough and is compliant with emissions rules for the Bee Network, as are 09-plate Omnis at GNW

It is now but presumably thats on a sliding scale, from September 09 reg and 59 reg vehicles will presumably be too old. It would not be practical to bring in an 09 reg bus for six months of usage.

 

[GusB]

It is now but presumably thats on a sliding scale, from September 09 reg and 59 reg vehicles will presumably be too old. It would not be practical to bring in an 09 reg bus for six months of usage.

What exactly do you mean by "too old"? A fixed upper age limit for buses will mean that vehicles become ineligible as time goes on. If you're specifically referring to Euro 6 emission standards then there was a fixed point in time whereby new vehicles had to comply, but this won't apply to buses that complied with earlier emissions standards, but have subsequently been retrofitted to make them Euro 6 compliant.

 

[cnjb8]

It is now but presumably thats on a sliding scale, from September 09 reg and 59 reg vehicles will presumably be too old. It would not be practical to bring in an 09 reg bus for six months of usage.

I mean that is true but Stagecoach have got to find +100 buses from somewhere provided they aren't actually buying anything from Go North West or First, so everything will help at the moment.

 

[Leyland Bus]

For those interested, here is a shot of 4031 freshly painted into Bee Network yellow.

Wheels have been put in motion for another one to be in for Monday so we'll see what happens!

 

[WWH44L]

For those interested, here is a shot of 4031 freshly painted into Bee Network yellow.

Wheels have been put in motion for another one to be in for Monday so we'll see what happens!

Looks great, very shiny Fingers crossed for Monday!

 

[Fin447]

First's 69506, 69510, 69511 and 69539 are at Adderley Green for repaint

 

[GCH100]

What exactly do you mean by "too old"? A fixed upper age limit for buses will mean that vehicles become ineligible as time goes on. If you're specifically referring to Euro 6 emission standards then there was a fixed point in time whereby new vehicles had to comply, but this won't apply to buses that complied with earlier emissions standards, but have subsequently been retrofitted to make them Euro 6 compliant.

I am not refering to the individual vehicle specifically but too the registeration squence. Generally the situation with modified vehicles that are older than the 16 year age limit, is that they are reviewed on a year to year bais for up to five years, these vehicles modified by Stagecoaach should meet these requirements. However I am sure that the Scania's at GoAhead have no such modification and are merely temporary additions and will ceased to be used on or by 1st September 2024. The 59 reg ADL Enviro at Go North West at Wigan that carries a private plate may be different in that expensive door modifications have been undertaken to convert to single door, therefore it would not make sense if the engine wasn't modified at the same time.

I think the sliding scale age limit is a useful tool, therefore new stuff is able to be introduced throughout the contract period, so that there is not a large scale issue all at once were large proportions of fleet need replacing.

 

[Busoccultation]

I am not refering to the individual vehicle specifically but too the registeration squence. Generally the situation with modified vehicles that are older than the 16 year age limit, is that they are reviewed on a year to year bais for up to five years, these vehicles modified by Stagecoaach should meet these requirements. However I am sure that the Scania's at GoAhead have no such modification and are merely temporary additions and will ceased to be used on or by 1st September 2024. The 59 reg ADL Enviro at Go North West at Wigan that carries a private plate may be different in that expensive door modifications have been undertaken to convert to single door, therefore it would not make sense if the engine wasn't modified at the same time.

I think the sliding scale age limit is a useful tool, therefore new stuff is able to be introduced throughout the contract period, so that there is not a large scale issue all at once were large proportions of fleet need replacing.

All of the Go North West Scanias are Euro 6 as they were modified while they were with RATP London as TfL required all of their buses to meet Euro 6 standards from March 2021 (With few covid related exemptions where in place until that Summer for school services).

 

[GCH100]

The situation at Stagecoach might not be as dire as it first might seem, as a large fleet of double-deck buses at Stagecoach's Oxford depot should become available once their new ADL Enviro New Style E400EV Electrics are delivered, presumably these will go to North Manchester for the new franchise, that will reduce the number of older vehicles required although there would still be a shortage of vehicles even with these. I aren't sure of which vehicles would be cascaded, but presumably a full sselection of E400 Enviro's, and E400MMC's.

 

[xitz2012@gmail]

(Taken from the First Manchester Enthusiasts Facebook page)

"Rochdale depot will consist of the new Mellor minibuses which will sadly be delayed due to the recent change of ownership.
16 B7RLEs will be allocated: 69445, 69446, 69447, 69500, 69501, 69505, 69506, 69507, 69509, 69510, 69511, 69529, 69531, 69537, 69538 & 69539.
8 E400s will transfer from Oldham, all 7 of the 14-plates and one 12-plate, fleet number to be determined. These are for schools, I assume some YSBs will be provided too?
63096-63099 will also go to Rochdale.
That’s the limit of my knowledge currently!"

 

[507021]

I mean that is true but Stagecoach have got to find +100 buses from somewhere provided they aren't actually buying anything from Go North West or First, so everything will help at the moment.

My understanding is Stagecoach are purchasing the Enviro300s from First.

 

[EnviroExplorer]

Another older Enviro 400 to have been repainted into Bee Network livery at Stagecoach Manchester is 19256, seen here at Hyde Road with credit to PS Bus Driver on Flickr - https://flic.kr/p/2pspdhT

 

[Fox192]

I’m not sure if this is relevant to this group, but does anyone have any idea what’s happening with all the queens road vehicles in march?

 

[cnjb8]

I’m not sure if this is relevant to this group, but does anyone have any idea what’s happening with all the queens road vehicles in march?

Rumoured to be 3 B9TLs to East Yorkshire, some E200s to Plymouth, and the Streetlites were offered to GoNorth East but they rejected them. The single remaining MX07 B9 on loan from GNE will return to the North East shortly

 

[EnviroExplorer]

I’m not sure if this is relevant to this group, but does anyone have any idea what’s happening with all the queens road vehicles in march?

I remember reading on a social media post that the Volvo B7RLEs would be retained for use at Bolton, although that could’ve been false. It would certainly offer a solution to replace the seemingly unreliable former Diamond Citaros though.

 

[gka472l]

Three Stagecoach E400's (not MMC) now carry Bee Network livery, 19256, 19481 and 19483

 

[Leyland Bus]

Bolton update:

4033 is this weeks repaint, this one has had the most body prep so far of the E200s as it was in quite poor condition...

 

[stait.john]

69531 in paint at Mellor in Rochdale.

 

[GCH100]

The Stagecoach 2024 Bus Handbook has been published by British Bus Publishing, and that shows quite a lot of new vehicles expected at Manchester, many of these are for the new Bee Network routes, as follows:-

11798-11799 - ADL E400MMC Note there is no 11800 as this marks the change over from the 2023 batch to the 2024 commencing at 11801.
11801-11880 - ADL E400MMC
21417-21432 - Volvo B8RLE 12.9metre MCV Evora
37631-37633 - ADL E200MMC 9.7metre
44901-44904 - Mercedes-Benz Sprinter 516CDi / Mellor Strata
49901-49904 - Mellor Strata 8.7m
76101-76120 - Volvo BZL / MCV single-deck - For Stockport
84201-84250 - BYD EV/ADL Enviro E400 City - TfGM owned vehicles for Oldham Depot
86031-86180 - Volvo BZL / MCV Double-deck H42/19F for Stockport

 

[gka472l]

The Stagecoach 2024 Bus Handbook has been published by British Bus Publishing, and that shows quite a lot of new vehicles expected at Manchester, many of these are for the new Bee Network routes, as follows:-

11798-11799 - ADL E400MMC Note there is no 11800 as this marks the change over from the 2023 batch to the 2024 commencing at 11801.
11801-11880 - ADL E400MMC
21417-21432 - Volvo B8RLE 12.9metre MCV Evora
37631-37633 - ADL E200MMC 9.7metre
44901-44904 - Mercedes-Benz Sprinter 516CDi / Mellor Strata
49901-49904 - Mellor Strata 8.7m
76101-76120 - Volvo BZL / MCV single-deck - For Stockport
84201-84250 - BYD EV/ADL Enviro E400 City - TfGM owned vehicles for Oldham Depot
86031-86180 - Volvo BZL / MCV Double-deck H42/19F for Stockport

86031 to 86070 are reported to be for Stagecoach London as mentioned in LOTS TLB 710 (for info, LOTS - London Omnibus Traction Society, TLB - The London Bus, the monthly magazine posted out to members), although a typo has them incorrectly as 68031-68070 in TLB 710....they are for routes D7, 277 & 58

HTH

HTH

 

[GCH100]

86031 to 86070 are reported to be for Stagecoach London as mentioned in LOTS TLB 710 (for info, LOTS - London Omnibus Traction Society, TLB - The London Bus, the monthly magazine posted out to members), although a typo has them incorrectly as 68031-68070 in TLB 710....they are for routes D7, 277 & 58

HTH

HTH

The London BZL double-deckers are reported as 86181-86225 by British Bus Publishing, of which 86181-86190 are for Lea Interchange, 86191-86208 are for Ash Grove and 86209-86225 are for Lea Interchange.

 

[gka472l]

The London BZL double-deckers are reported as 86181-86225 by British Bus Publishing, of which 86181-86190 are for Lea Interchange, 86191-86208 are for Ash Grove and 86209-86225 are for Lea Interchange.

That appears to have change from planned then.......LOTS is usually spot on

 

[GCH100]

That appears to have change from planned then.......LOTS is usually spot on

I guess there is room for error with the British Bus Publishing Book as well, I know LOTS is usually fairly accurate. This is the best product in the British Bus Publishing range though as its done in conjuction with Stagecoach.

 

[GusB]

The delivery of buses to London is of no relevance to this thread. Stay on topic, please.

 

[Class 466]

Where are the MCV Evoras for?

And only 3 E200MMCs?

 

[jeffery9098]

Where are the MCV Evoras for?

And only 3 E200MMCs?

Evoras is clearly for orbits and idk about enviro200mmc

 

[GCH100]

Where are the MCV Evoras for?

And only 3 E200MMCs?

The MCV Evora's are as yet unallocated as are the 3 E200MMC's, The Evora's have been ordered because of there large size in preference to ADL's, all this unallocated stock is presuably for Bee Network Routes.

 

[Dfatcontroller]

The MCV Evora's are as yet unallocated as are the 3 E200MMC's, The Evora's have been ordered because of there large size in preference to ADL's, all this unallocated stock is presuably for Bee Network Routes.

They'll all be "allocated" somewhere in a master plan.

The buses (and their quantities) aren't ordered on a whim.

 

[Class 466]

The MCV Evora's are as yet unallocated as are the 3 E200MMC's, The Evora's have been ordered because of there large size in preference to ADL's, all this unallocated stock is presuably for Bee Network Routes.

Nice to see that there is still some appreciation out there that you can’t just stretch a midibus endlessly over a proper full size single decker.