Tfl oyster card 16+

[Adzadz]

Hi All

I've been using a 16 plus oyster even thought I'm well over that age for 2 years. Xmas 2018 I recieved a letter saying basically you have been caught either plead guilty accept or deny. I sent the letter within 10 days accepting the offence and apologising and they sent another letter back saying thank you etc we may proceed with legal proceedings against you it's been 6 months and I have recieved nothing. I know I'll get another letter.

My concern: the fine is no problem I'll pay it in a heart beat it's the criminal record I'm worried about as I work and they will sniff this one way or another and I'm only one supporting my household which is causing me extreme distress. Does anyone know if I'll get a fine? Record? Both ? I'm actually ****ting bricks. Thanks adz

 

[Adzadz]

Hi All

I've been using a 16 plus oyster even thought I'm well over that age for 2 years. Xmas 2018 I recieved a letter saying basically you have been caught either plead guilty accept or deny. I sent the letter within 10 days accepting the offence and apologising and they sent another letter back saying thank you etc we may proceed with legal proceedings against you it's been 6 months and I have recieved nothing. I know I'll get another letter.

My concern: the fine is no problem I'll pay it in a heart beat it's the criminal record I'm worried about as I work and they will sniff this one way or another and I'm only one supporting my household which is causing me extreme distress. Does anyone know if I'll get a fine? Record? Both ? I'm actually ****ting bricks. Thanks adz

Sorry to make it clear I was using my oyster for 2 years and then I got clocked but I did tell.them in the letter that I can give up the lad who did it for me

 

[Llanigraham]

Sorry to make it clear I was using my oyster for 2 years and then I got clocked but I did tell.them in the letter that I can give up the lad who did it for me

If I understand that correctly, you have admitted to TfL that you have been illegally using your Oyster Card for 2 years? If that is the case I suspect that this will be treated very seriously.
And I really don't understand the underlined section.

 

[mikeg]

In some ways, I'd be tempted on this occasion to sit tight and keep your fingers crossed . They've six months to lay information before the courts. So whilst not safe yet, and bear in mind it may take time for the courts to contact you after they've contacted the court, the amount of time means your chance of having got away with it may be increasing.

Is there any way the OP can find out if information has been laid before the courts? Other than receiving a summons?

 

[Adzadz]

In some ways, I'd be tempted on this occasion to sit tight and keep your fingers crossed . They've six months to lay information before the courts. So whilst not safe yet, and bear in mind it may take time for the courts to contact you after they've contacted the court, the amount of time means your chance of having got away with it may be increasing.



Is there any way the OP can find out if information has been laid before the courts? Other than receiving a summons?

In some ways, I'd be tempted on this occasion to sit tight and keep your fingers crossed . They've six months to lay information before the courts. So whilst not safe yet, and bear in mind it may take time for the courts to contact you after they've contacted the court, the amount of time means your chance of having got away with it may be increasing.

Is there any way the OP can find out if information has been laid before the courts? Other than receiving a summons?

That's my concern is there anyway I would just receive a fine and if I don't pay the fine then I go to court? Because if I have to go court then I'm certain I'll receive a criminal record and then I'm finished.

 

[mikeg]

Not necessarily. You shouldn't receive a criminal record for a bye-law offence, it depends which legislation they use.

Also if you read my post, you'll notice time is running out for them. I suggest not bringing yourself to TFL's attention. If they don't file papers with the court before six months after the offence, you get away with it as they are 'out of time' . However it does mean a more lime opportunity to negotiate a settlement should they get the papers in just the nick of time.

 

[Salesy]

Just beware, your actions could amount to fraud by false representation (Fraud Act 2006), which is indictable and therefore not subject to a six month limitation period.

I think it unlikely that they would resort to that charge though, as the Byelaws probably have a more appropriate charge.

 

[Adzadz]

Not necessarily. You shouldn't receive a criminal record for a bye-law offence, it depends which legislation they use.

Also if you read my post, you'll notice time is running out for them. I suggest not bringing yourself to TFL's attention. If they don't file papers with the court before six months after the offence, you get away with it as they are 'out of time' . However it does mean a more lime opportunity to negotiate a settlement should they get the papers in just the nick of time.

Fair enough. Could you please explain what you mean from "however..." onwards I'm not sure I understand what you mean. Thanks

 

[mikeg]

Sorry .I suspect an autocorrect fail played it's part here. I meant 'limited' rather than 'lime'. Given they only have six months from the date of the alleged offence (what was the date of the last offence anyway?) They may be hesitant to do anything that could stall them such as negotiate a settlement if they believe they can secure a conviction. It may be preferable from their point of view to go straight to the 'court' stage of things. Note a settlement after a summons has been issued is not impossible, but less likely and probably more expensive. TfL are not particularly renowned for settling out of court, but it has happened before. I'm assuming it's TfL and not a private operator you're dealing with.

I also agree with @Salesy that a fraud act prosecution is a minor possibility, but I think it unlikely and they'd have probably acted a little quicker anyway.

 

[Adzadz]

Sorry .I suspect an autocorrect fail played it's part here. I meant 'limited' rather than 'lime'. Given they only have six months from the date of the alleged offence (what was the date of the last offence anyway?) They may be hesitant to do anything that could stall them such as negotiate a settlement if they believe they can secure a conviction. It may be preferable from their point of view to go straight to the 'court' stage of things. Note a settlement after a summons has been issued is not impossible, but less likely and probably more expensive. TfL are not particularly renowned for settling out of court, but it has happened before. I'm assuming it's TfL and not a private operator you're dealing with.

I also agree with @Salesy that a fraud act prosecution is a minor possibility, but I think it unlikely and they'd have probably acted a little quicker anyway.

Yes it is TFL I'm dealing with and date of last offence was late November last year. Given the fact it's been more than 6 months they may have another trick up their sleeve and securing a conviction means criminal record which ultimately means I'm ****ed.

I just hope somehow they just send me a fine instead of court proceedings.

 

[swt_passenger]

Yes it is TFL I'm dealing with and date of last offence was late November last year. Given the fact it's been more than 6 months they may have another trick up their sleeve and securing a conviction means criminal record which ultimately means I'm ****ed.

I just hope somehow they just send me a fine instead of court proceedings.

Just as a point of detail, TfL cannot 'send you a fine'. They might ask for an administrative settlement as an alternative to court, but I think most contributors here would think that highly unlikely in the circumstances you've described so far.

 

[Ubul]

Just beware, your actions could amount to fraud by false representation (Fraud Act 2006), which is indictable and therefore not subject to a six month limitation period.

I think it unlikely that they would resort to that charge though, as the Byelaws probably have a more appropriate charge.

I was recently prosecuted for exactly the same and under the Fraud Act so there was no 6 months time limit. I only used it for a year and still got a suspended prison sentence and a hefty fine.

 

[Adzadz]

I was recently prosecuted for exactly the same and under the Fraud Act so there was no 6 months time limit. I only used it for a year and still got a suspended prison sentence and a hefty fine.

Did you get a criminal record? If so when does your employer know about this sort of thing? I know I'm looking at the same thing basically

 

[Haywain]

I only used it for a year

"Only"!!!

Did you get a criminal record? If so when does your employer know about this sort of thing? I know I'm looking at the same thing basically

A conviction under the fraud act undoubtedly attracts a criminal record, and your employer should find out about it from you, ideally in advance of your going to court. Most employers will take a pretty dim view of finding out about something as serious as this after the conviction.

 

[Ubul]

Did you get a criminal record? If so when does your employer know about this sort of thing? I know I'm looking at the same thing basically

Of course I did. It's a suspended prison sentence. The judge says the only reason for not sending me to prison was due to my otherwise good character.
Tfl told my employer that I was summoned to court then the court also contacted them with the outcome. I have lost my job.

 

[Adzadz]

Of course I did. It's a suspended prison sentence. The judge says the only reason for not sending me to prison was due to my otherwise good character.
Tfl told my employer that I was summoned to court then the court also contacted them with the outcome. I have lost my job.

Well then that's it for me I've never been in trouble before this is my first offence I'll get the letter go court lose my job and it's done lol. Not sure how I can bounce back from this

 

[farleigh]

There is a long way to go yet. Whatever the outcome - and it is not certain to be a conviction - you can bounce back.
There will be good advice for you on here and make sure you talk about it with somebody if you can.
You will be alright.

 

[Haywain]

Well then that's it for me I've never been in trouble before this is my first offence I'll get the letter go court lose my job and it's done lol. Not sure how I can bounce back from this

Are you a member of a trade union? If you are, get in touch with their legal helpline and get some proper advice and assistance.

 

[Adzadz]

Are you a member of a trade union? If you are, get in touch with their legal helpline and get some proper advice and assistance.

How can I do that is there a number or email I can pinch please

 

[island]

How can I do that is there a number or email I can pinch please

You would need to contact the trade union you’re a member of. The number will be on your membership card.

 

[Adzadz]

You would need to contact the trade union you’re a member of. The number will be on your membership card.

I'm not part of one

 

[Haywain]

I'm not part of one

Do you have household insurance? Does that have legal cover? If not, go and find a local criminal defence lawyer.

 

[some bloke]

Unlock is a charity providing information on convictions.

They have a helpline and encourage people to read on the website first to see if it answers questions they have.

If you scroll down the home page to "Frequently Asked Questions" on the right, or further down to the list of information sections, that may be useful.

http://hub.unlock.org.uk/

 

[some bloke]

Nacro may also be useful:

https://www.nacro.org.uk/resettlement-advice-service/support-for-individuals/