The Labour Party under Keir Starmer

[A60stock]

14 years of many atrocious decisions and wrong doings by the previous government and I never once saw a petition. A few months into a labour government and people are losing their minds, even though there isn't really much they've done which stands out (I dont think Labour offer much above the Tories anyway......but thats another discussion).

It seems quite clear..........Labour are heavily demonised no matter what they do, but when the Tories do anything, no problem mate, carry on

 

[Sorcerer]

14 years of many atrocious decisions and wrong doings by the previous government and I never once saw a petition. A few months into a labour government and people are losing their minds, even though there isn't really much they've done which stands out (I dont think Labour offer much above the Tories anyway......but thats another discussion).

I'm not a huge fan of Starmer and have been somewhat unimpressed with how things have been so far, the press really have been frothing at the mouth with every decision that the Labour government have made, and I could only dream of the Tories receiving a fraction of the scrutiny. Labour have been in power for about five months yet you'd think they were responsible for the last fourteen years of austerity. I am convinced Labour could find a universal cure for all cancers and the press would phrase it as "Labour is destroying the pharmaceutical industry" because it wasn't some billionaire claiming the credit of greater scientists (quite like Elon Musk perhaps?).

 

[A60stock]

Exactly, the level of scrutiny received for both are worlds apart. You would think Labour are a far left party with the way things are portrayed.

On saying that, very disappointed with things so far. No bold decisions, nothing drastically different from before.

 

[DarloRich]

It seems quite clear..........Labour are heavily demonised no matter what they do, but when the Tories do anything, no problem mate, carry on

and I could only dream of the Tories receiving a fraction of the scrutiny.

is the correct answer!
The press behaviour has been really poor. I think Labour should hit back with Levison 2. Just hammer them. They cant be trusted to be honest

 

[edwin_m]

14 years of many atrocious decisions and wrong doings by the previous government and I never once saw a petition. A few months into a labour government and people are losing their minds, even though there isn't really much they've done which stands out (I dont think Labour offer much above the Tories anyway......but thats another discussion).

It seems quite clear..........Labour are heavily demonised no matter what they do, but when the Tories do anything, no problem mate, carry on

There were two petitions asking for a second Brexit referendum, aiming to reverse one of the Tories' most damaging decisions. Ignored of course.

 

[AlterEgo]

There were two petitions asking for a second Brexit referendum, aiming to reverse one of the Tories' most damaging decisions. Ignored of course.

The petitions stuff is a farce and completely antithetical to our parliamentary system. They are correctly looked upon with derision - inside Parliament, too. (I used to have to attend committee meetings!)

 

[jon0844]

is the correct answer!
The press behaviour has been really poor. I think Labour should hit back with Levison 2. Just hammer them. They cant be trusted to be honest

Elon is goading Labour to do something to X, as this will then give him even more ammunition to attack Labour and the UK in general. After all he keeps talking about free speech (except when he's banning people and throttling links so they become almost inaccessible from posts).

Look at how he got so 'concerned' over people being jailed for Tweeting that people should set fire to a hotel, or Tommy being jailed for contempt of court and was partly responsible for the whole 'two tier' nonsense.

You'd think the richest man on the planet who everyone thinks is a genius might be able to check (you know, given he owns the world's biggest social media platform) the actual facts before posting, but he has an agenda and I think we're going to see more of what that is before the next election. I have no doubt he's going to get heavily involved in trying to get Labour ousted at the next election, or sooner if he can help turn everyone against the party before then. It's already started and isn't going to stop.

I've said before that I think Nigel Farage will defect to the Tories and stand as PM for the next election, so I am sure Elon will help make that happen by also attacking the Tories under Kemi Badenoch's leadership. It's a bit too early for that, but let's wait and see.

The petitions stuff is a farce and completely antithetical to our parliamentary system. They are correctly looked upon with derision - inside Parliament, too. (I used to have to attend committee meetings!)

Can we create one to demand Labour bans X or charges Elon with interfering with our political system?!

 

[iorhgaoerighao]

Exactly, the level of scrutiny received for both are worlds apart. You would think Labour are a far left party with the way things are portrayed.

On saying that, very disappointed with things so far. No bold decisions, nothing drastically different from before.

David Cameron fcuked a pig and the TV show Black Mirror made an episode about it.

 

[edwin_m]

David Cameron fcuked a pig and the TV show Black Mirror made an episode about it.

The media that generally favours the Tories sometimes sides with a particular faction and turns the guns against others within "their" party.

 

[dosxuk]

David Cameron fcuked a pig and the TV show Black Mirror made an episode about it.

That Black Mirror came around several years before the rumours about David Cameron and the pig surfaced. Charlie Brooker has been on the record that he knew nothing about the rumours when writing the show.

 

[Leyland Bus]

That Black Mirror came around several years before the rumours about David Cameron and the pig surfaced. Charlie Brooker has been on the record that he knew nothing about the rumours when writing the show.

Just a good eye for knowing what Tory Toffs are like then...

 

[A60stock]

Elon is goading Labour to do something to X, as this will then give him even more ammunition to attack Labour and the UK in general. After all he keeps talking about free speech (except when he's banning people and throttling links so they become almost inaccessible from posts).

Look at how he got so 'concerned' over people being jailed for Tweeting that people should set fire to a hotel, or Tommy being jailed for contempt of court and was partly responsible for the whole 'two tier' nonsense.

You'd think the richest man on the planet who everyone thinks is a genius might be able to check (you know, given he owns the world's biggest social media platform) the actual facts before posting, but he has an agenda and I think we're going to see more of what that is before the next election. I have no doubt he's going to get heavily involved in trying to get Labour ousted at the next election, or sooner if he can help turn everyone against the party before then. It's already started and isn't going to stop.

I've said before that I think Nigel Farage will defect to the Tories and stand as PM for the next election, so I am sure Elon will help make that happen by also attacking the Tories under Kemi Badenoch's leadership. It's a bit too early for that, but let's wait and see.

Your thoughts scare me...........because I feel llike you might be onto something here.

Out of interest, I am not totally clued on to what Elon's agenda is (asides from.....you know the obvious), but what are we expecting him to do and how will it affect both the US and UK?

 

[DarloRich]

Out of interest, I am not totally clued on to what Elon's agenda is (asides from.....you know the obvious), but what are we expecting him to do and how will it affect both the US and UK?

Fill his pockets with taxpayers money, reduce rights for workers, advance the sovereign individual agenda, reduce the availability and viability of public sector/public services and fill his pockets with tax payer money

 

[jfollows]

Elon Musk appears to want to be “king of the world”, just like Boris Johnson, but without the inconvenience of having to be elected to the post first. A deeply unlikeable and untrustworthy person, and I’m referring to both of them.

 

[A60stock]

Fill his pockets with taxpayers money, reduce rights for workers, advance the sovereign individual agenda, reduce the availability and viability of public sector/public services and fill his pockets with tax payer money

Awful. I do wait to see what Trump/Elon end up doing

 

[takno]

Elon Musk appears to want to be “king of the world”, just like Boris Johnson, but without the inconvenience of having to be elected to the post first. A deeply unlikeable and untrustworthy person, and I’m referring to both of them.

It's an interesting approach. All his real money is in Tesla, who are at risk of being tariff-blocked from half their markets and are reputationally dead to much of their potential US customer base. He owns a social network which is smallish and shrinking fast, whilst taking anti-regulatory stances which genuinely have the potential to see it banned outright in much of the world. Everything else is in SpaceX, which any sensible governments will be starting to see as something they badly need competition for, both in launch capability and satellite Comms.

He needs free trade, international trust and external capital, but has backed a president who stands four-square in the way of that.

 

[DarloRich]

Awful. I do wait to see what Trump/Elon end up doing

repeat as above

Also Musk needs Tesla and Space X to prosper, avoid congressional investigations/prosecutions, win more contracts, generate postive PR, make him look like some kind of Tony Stark and fill his pockets with money with taxpayers money

 

[jonnycoleraine]

First of all, it's not a question of finding it "onerous", it's a question of whose responsibility it is. You were the one who made the claim.

Doing a quick search, most of the results relate to households, which as I already pointed does not mean that a quarter of pensioners are millionaires. Whether you have a source that actually says what you claim, or whether you are making the same misinterpretation, is impossible to verify unless you actually cite the source you were basing your claim on.

The same old drivel "source please"

 

[Andyh82]

14 years of many atrocious decisions and wrong doings by the previous government and I never once saw a petition. A few months into a labour government and people are losing their minds, even though there isn't really much they've done which stands out (I dont think Labour offer much above the Tories anyway......but thats another discussion).

It seems quite clear..........Labour are heavily demonised no matter what they do, but when the Tories do anything, no problem mate, carry on

This one in 2022 demanded a general election and was signed by over 900,000 people

Archived Petition: Call an immediate general election to end the chaos of the current government

Call an immediate general election so that the people can decide who should lead us through the unprecedented crises threatening the UK.

petition.parliament.uk

This one in 2023 demanded a general election and was signed by almost 300,000 people

Archived Petition: Call an immediate general election

The Prime Minister should call an immediate general election to allow the British public to have their say on how we are governed, we should not be made to wait until January 2025

petition.parliament.uk

This one was against Boris Johnson proroguing Parliament and was signed by over 1.7m people

Archived Petition: Do not prorogue Parliament

Parliament must not be prorogued or dissolved unless and until the Article 50 period has been sufficiently extended or the UK's intention to withdraw from the EU has been cancelled.

petition.parliament.uk

This one from 2016 called for the UK to remain in the EU and was signed by over 6m people

Archived Petition: Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU.

The government repeatedly claims exiting the EU is 'the will of the people'. We need to put a stop to this claim by proving the strength of public support now, for remaining in the EU. A People's Vote may not happen - so vote now.

petition.parliament.uk

 

[Tetchytyke]

Doing a quick search, most of the results relate to households, which as I already pointed does not mean that a quarter of pensioners are millionaires.

The biggest asset in any household- the home- is usually held jointly and so the full value of the asset belongs to both people.

Whilst a home is an illiquid asset it is still an asset and, like any asset, it can be sold. If someone is cash poor and asset rich then they can, at any time, cash in that asset.

If someone is freezing to death in a million pound house then there's a simple solution: sell up and move somewhere cheaper. It's what the rest of us working age people have to do if we can no longer afford to live where we live.

As for the petition, I'm sure it's just a complete coincidence that it's gaining huge amounts of traction days after we let Ukraine lob British missiles into Russia. Complete coincidence.

 

[Harpo]

If someone is freezing to death in a million pound house then there's a simple solution: sell up and move somewhere cheaper.

You’re all heart aren’t you? There are many older folk living near to me who couldn’t bear to leave the home where they raised their family or in many cases lived with a now deceased spouse.

Unfortunately, there are no inducements to encourage downsizing and free up larger homes. Stamp duty will still be payable alongside all other house move costs. Its a damned expensive way to try to liquidate the value of a home.

 

[Tetchytyke]

You’re all heart aren’t you? There are many older folk living near to me who couldn’t bear to leave the home where they raised their family or in many cases lived with a now deceased spouse.

The world is full of people who couldn't bear to leave their home but had to because they couldn't afford it anymore. Everyone else has to sell up. Why should pensioners be any different?

I do agree with your comments on Stamp Duty- I think the changes coming in in 2025 are a very bad move- but equally they don't have to buy their new home.

 

[ainsworth74]

The world is full of people who couldn't bear to leave their home but had to because they couldn't afford it anymore. Everyone else has to sell up. Why should pensioners be any different?

Quite.

I'm not too fussed either way really. I'd have been quite content to leave the Winter Fuel Payment as a universal benefit for pensioners if we'd introduced alongside a Winter Fuel Payment for working age people worth a damn (the current Cold Weather Payment system is a joke £25 but only if the temperature at your nearest weather stations is 0 degrees or less for 7 consecutive days and the Warm Home Discount is a sticking plaster at best). Perhaps everyone on Universal Credit (and those who are still on legacy benefits) should have been able to get £200 if they live alone or £300 if the have a partner, children or are not fit for work. I wouldn't have minded that.

But, seeing as expanding the benefit wasn't on the cards I can't help but feel that its time that some of the pain has to be felt by pension age people. The working age welfare system has been gutted like a fish to the point that there's nothing left to cut. So cutting the Winter Fuel Payment from a universal benefit to one targeted at the poorest pensioners does not seem unreasonable.

Particularly when you recall that any pensioner whose income (between state and private pensions as well as earnings if they're still in work) is lower than £218 per week will still receive a Winter fuel Payment because those are the ones who will be getting, or should be, Pension Credit, to allow them to qualify for the Winter Fuel Payment (one positive of this policy is that it has finally got pensioners to go out and claim the damn thing, perhaps it'll stop being the most underclaimed benefit!). Worth noting that the personal allowance for a single person aged 25 or over on UC is £90 per week and they get no Winter Fuel Payment at all.

I think the policy has been completely bungled from a communication point of view, as with so much else that the Labour Government have been doing, but I don't think it's terrible policy overall considering the wider financial context we're in.

That being said I increasingly think that if they don't sort themselves out in the next few months in terms of having any sort of communication strategy at all they are sunk for the next election. I don't think it necessarily means a Tory Government in 2029 but it'll be a complete disaster for Labour.

 

[Tetchytyke]

That being said I increasingly think that if they don't sort themselves out in the next few months in terms of having any sort of communication strategy at all they are sunk for the next election. I don't think it necessarily means a Tory Government in 2029 but it'll be a complete disaster for Labour.

The people in charge of communications for Labour have been too busy fighting each other since the election. We know Morgan McSweeney won his little power battle against Sue Gray because "Labour insiders" (I wonder who that might have been?) briefed vociferously against her to the BBC's Chris Mason but, having won it, nothing has changed.

Sky News' reporting of Louise Haigh's resignation was very interesting. Journalists only go into detail on seemingly random matters when they are signposting who told them something.

See what you think: https://news.sky.com/story/transpor...ction-with-misleading-police-in-2014-13262362

With connections to former Downing Street chief of staff Sue Gray, there has been speculation her cabinet role could be under threat in a future reshuffle.

Ms Gray's son, Labour MP Liam Conlon, is Ms Haigh's parliamentary private secretary and acts as her "eyes and ears" in parliament, while another of her former employees also worked for the former chief of staff before she was sacked after losing a power struggle within Number 10.

You look at the catastrophic damage that the unelected adviser Dominic Cummings did to the Tories. If Starmer doesn't get a grip on all this backbiting soon then his government will go the same way.

FWIW if I were a betting man I'd be putting a tenner on Farage to become Prime Minister in 2029. This version of Labour are offering nothing to the working poor. I wouldn't be surprised if the working poor decide that, you know what, the far right can't be any worse.

 

[Gloster]

I have a hope that the shine will come off Farage before long. To many Reform voters he is Reform and Reform is he. If he continues with his blatant grifting and neglect of his constituents he may find that Reform will lose its aura of being different. Not that he is likely to care much once he has checked his bank statement.

 

[Harpo]

I have a hope that the shine will come off Farage before long.

Single topic Farage even managed to turn the farmers' IHT protest into a race issue bleating 'people in North London think farmers are too white'.

Nige, when the farmers said bring loud whistles to the protest they didn't mean that one.

 

[Yew]

I have a hope that the shine will come off Farage before long. To many Reform voters he is Reform and Reform is he. If he continues with his blatant grifting and neglect of his constituents he may find that Reform will lose its aura of being different. Not that he is likely to care much once he has checked his bank statement.

The pains of late stage capitalism are still there, and Keir Starmer doesn't seem to be making much of an effort to reverse them. Whilst Farrage does, though he misdirects people's anger to Immigrants and foreigners.

 

[nanstallon]

If Starmer doesn't get a grip, we shall end up with Farage (with the help of the fascist press) as PM in 2029. I'm not at all impressed with Starmer with poor handling of the winter fuel allowance issue showing poor communications. Now the panic sacking of a competent Transport Minister, because ten years ago she forgot to tell her employer that she had found a mobile phone that she had thought was stolen, shows another dismal side to him.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

If Starmer doesn't get a grip, we shall end up with Farage (with the help of the fascist press) as PM in 2029. I'm not at all impressed with Starmer with poor handling of the winter fuel allowance issue showing poor communications. Now the panic sacking of a competent Transport Minister, because ten years ago she forgot to tell her employer that she had found a mobile phone that she had thought was stolen, shows another dismal side to him.

Doubt that but could certainly be a power broker if the Torys dont get themselves sorted.

 

[takno]

If Starmer doesn't get a grip, we shall end up with Farage (with the help of the fascist press) as PM in 2029. I'm not at all impressed with Starmer with poor handling of the winter fuel allowance issue showing poor communications. Now the panic sacking of a competent Transport Minister, because ten years ago she forgot to tell her employer that she had found a mobile phone that she had thought was stolen, shows another dismal side to him.

She resigned. Quite sensibly overall - I completely agree that the whole thing is utterly trumped up, but there's no point trying to sit it out for a week - the press would just keep at it.

She may well also have concluded that she's already done all the cool stuff in transport. The next couple of years is going to explaining to people that change takes time, whilst dealing with price rises. Even if investment happens on a huge scale there will be a lot of essential projects which don't get funded. Far better to leave now and aim to get back in later.

What I'm not greatly impressed with is Heidi Alexander, but who knows, maybe she'll work out.