The Shortest Route by Rail: Bus Replacement

[superalbs]

Struggling with a plan at the moment, to try and avoid a nasty bus ride.

In this scenario, the regular route between A and B is shut, and there are buses instead. However there are train services from A to C, and from C to B. C is further away from A, than B is.

I know the NRCOT states the following:

13.1.2.
...by any services (including any change of trains) over the shortest route which can be used by scheduled passenger services between the stations shown on your Ticket;...

Would a passenger be able to use a ticket from A to B, on the trains serving the route A to C to B, by reasoning of this being the shortest route by rail? The NRCOT only seems to mention trains, and the shortest route can only be calculated by the railways, not the roads.

I have summarised the above in a diagram, as shown below.



Thanks for all and any help!

 

[cactustwirly]

Struggling with a plan at the moment, to try and avoid a nasty bus ride.

In this scenario, the regular route between A and B is shut, and there are buses instead. However there are train services from A to C, and from C to B. C is further away from A, than B is.

I know the NRCOT states the following:


Would a passenger be able to use a ticket from A to B, on the trains serving the route A to C to B, by reasoning of this being the shortest route by rail? The NRCOT only seems to mention trains, and the shortest route can only be calculated by the railways, not the roads.

I have summarised the above in a diagram, as shown below.

View attachment 58037

Thanks for all and any help!

I'd say you couldn't travel via C, unless there's a specific easement, or you can get an intinerary via C.
Obviously this is assuming that via C isn't in the routeing guide, and is further than 3 miles of the shortest route.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

Struggling with a plan at the moment, to try and avoid a nasty bus ride.

In this scenario, the regular route between A and B is shut, and there are buses instead. However there are train services from A to C, and from C to B. C is further away from A, than B is.

I know the NRCOT states the following:


Would a passenger be able to use a ticket from A to B, on the trains serving the route A to C to B, by reasoning of this being the shortest route by rail? The NRCOT only seems to mention trains, and the shortest route can only be calculated by the railways, not the roads.

I have summarised the above in a diagram, as shown below.

View attachment 58037

Thanks for all and any help!

Effectively you are asking whether the length (and route) of the shortest route can vary depending on the date of your ticket's validity. That's a tough one - I can see arguments both for and against that interpretation. Unfortunately the NRCoT are uselessly vague on this point.

 

[Bletchleyite]

A bus is a "virtual train" so in my book is included in the "scheduled passenger services" banner. So no, if it's not otherwise a Permitted Route you can't, though some better TOCs do arrange sensible acceptance - VTWC certainly near-always do.

 

[robbeech]

My interpretation is it is not valid (if it’s not normally valid). Of course you could ask an authorised person if it was ok to do this and they might say yes.
Is a ticket between A and C more expensive than A and B?

 

[superalbs]

My interpretation is it is not valid (if it’s not normally valid). Of course you could ask an authorised person if it was ok to do this and they might say yes.

That would probably be my best bet, and I should have time.

It's annoying to have a perfectly usable rail route with similar journey times (only ten minutes more), but be forced to use the bus anyway.

 

[island]

In my opinion, if you couldn’t go via C when trains are running normally, you can’t when there is a scheduled rail replacement bus either.

It would be sensible to ask an authorised person to agree to allow you via C.

 

[Muzer]

Yes, the shortest route by rail depends on the current timetable in general (when it refers to "scheduled passenger services"), not the services available at any particular time. Unless the route is closed for an entire timetable period or similar I don't think you'd have a leg to stand on here, unfortunately.

If you haven't yet bought your ticket I'd start looking for more exotic options that might be valid via C.

 

[sheff1]

It all depends where A, B & C are. Sometimes a ticket may be valid A-C-B regardless of any bus substitutions. This could be the case even if the A-C fare is dearer than the A-B fare.

 

[furlong]

The bus substitution has no effect on the routes - they continue to be worked out as if the train (replaced by a bus) was still running. It's up to the operator whether or not to add new permitted routes in such circumstances - there's no obligation to do so, but TOCs often do if it reduces the scale of the bus operation required, for example.