Transpennine woes and a moan...

[nr758123]

Does the attached answer your question? And these are today's pre-planned cancellations as of last night, more were canx during the day.
From early eve, these are the only trains which serve the local stations btwn Manchester and Huddersfield. We've had practically no service beyond 1800 the last two days.

And today it's the turn of the morning peak service at these stations to be wiped out. Though that doesn't guarantee that the evening peak and evening won't be impacted as well.

 

[VauxhallNova]

A much better performance today, only 18% cancelled so far.

 

[Jamesrob637]

A much better performance today, only 18% cancelled so far.

Still 17-18% more than it should be. Aren't some new measures coming in this week to avoid repeats of the fiasco?

 

[Kite159]

A much better performance today, only 18% cancelled so far.

Is that 18% cancelled of what was planned to run today, ignoring the trains removed from the timetable before 10pm yesterday?

 

[VauxhallNova]

Yes, it ignores what was cancelled at 10pm last night.

 

[mike57]

Yes, it ignores what was cancelled at 10pm last night.

So 18% of what was left after 44 were cancelled and 5 were part cancelled on the 'short term' page with respect to the current timetable which is then about 70% of the 'full' timetable. My guess is we are running at well below 50% of the pre covid timetable. No much hope really...

 

[nr758123]

So 18% of what was left after 44 were cancelled and 5 were part cancelled on the 'short term' page with respect to the current timetable which is then about 70% of the 'full' timetable.

The agenda papers for the WYCA Transport Committee on 14/10/22 use a different method of calculation taking account of what they describe as P-coded cancellations, ie cancelled the night before (item 14, para 2.36-2.38)

2.36 TPE cancellations continue to have a severe impact in West Yorkshire. Many of these are at short notice, made on the day or the evening before. The latter (known as ‘P-coded’ or planned cancellations if notified before 22:00 on the evening before) are currently not counted in the cancellation figures. The official cancellation figures therefore do not reflect the very poor passenger experience. Notification of any replacement buses is also usually late in the evening before or not until the actual morning, which has caused further passenger frustration.

2.37 On TPE, for the most recent period 5 (August), 21% of services were cancelled (approximately 16% were P-coded and 5% were same day cancellations). On Saturdays in the same period there was a total of 25% cancellations (approximately 20% were P-coded and 5% were same day cancellations).

2.38 TPE’s Manchester – Leeds – Hull services have been particularly badly affected by poor performance and P-coding, as have local stopping services between Manchester / Huddersfield / Leeds serving stations including Slaithwaite and Marsden, which rely on TPE for all their services. Cancellations have led to long gaps between services, sometimes of many hours, and severe crowding on services that do run, including impacts on Northern trains where these run routes alongside TPE

 

[TC7]

As someone who unfortunately has to deal with TPE's shinanigans on a near daily basis I'm used to cramped trains but today takes the cake. From Leeds to Manchester both the 15:07 and 15:15 were cancelled, leaving Leeds with no TPE service westbound for an hour. To compound matters further the 15:45 has turned up formed of 3 carriages already full and standing from picking up everybody else who was in a similar situation as those of us waiting at Leeds on its trip from Redcar. To nobody's suprise it left behind a large crowd of people at Leeds.

 

[greyman42]

That was not listed on the pre planned cancellations for today but it is now cancelled on jounrey check. They cancelled it at 7:54 tonight. So if you are still looking to travel then you will probably have to catch the 22:45 Lner service to York or there is the 22:23 Northern service as far as Darlington but that one will possibly be overcrowded due to match day.

I got back to the station at about 2145 and the service was shown as cancelled. At about 2155 it appeared on the information boards as running but there were no announcements. The service did run to York and returned from York to Newcastle non-stop.

 

[gazzaa2]

How is it looking for tomorrow?

 

[Frankfurt]

How is it looking for tomorrow?

TransPennine Express JourneyCheck - Train times and live real time delay/cancellation/disruption information.

TransPennine Express JourneyCheck provides real time, up-to-date train times and train disruption information keeping you informed about any delays or cancellations on the network and helping you know what to do when your journey is affected. Train Cancellations, Delays, Alterations and...

www.journeycheck.com

Check that link, tomorrow's pre-planned cancellation and alterations aren't up yet but should be in next couple of hours or so

 

[AndyHudds]

As someone who unfortunately has to deal with TPE's shinanigans on a near daily basis I'm used to cramped trains but today takes the cake. From Leeds to Manchester both the 15:07 and 15:15 were cancelled, leaving Leeds with no TPE service westbound for an hour. To compound matters further the 15:45 has turned up formed of 3 carriages already full and standing from picking up everybody else who was in a similar situation as those of us waiting at Leeds on its trip from Redcar. To nobody's suprise it left behind a large crowd of people at Leeds.

The 16.45 was no better yesterday, it turned up as a 3 car set, usually 6, already people standing with a large amount wanting to get on. Everyone squeezed on that could but people were left behind and I was crush loaded on. Its a battle to then get off at Huddersfield.

 

[sjpowermac]

Given the persistently high number of cancellations, I wonder what the chances are of the December timetable uplift actually taking place?

I guess some of the current problems will be with needing to free up instructors and drivers to complete training, particularly on the Class 68/Mk5a sets, plus route learning.

Fingers crossed that the extra train an hour over the Pennines does happen.

 

[mike57]

I wonder what the chances are of the December timetable uplift actually taking place?

Given that TPE cannot run the current timetable, or even something close to it, not a chance. What is going to change between now and December that is going to allow to increased services by 50%+ over what they are running now. Its 7/8 weeks away

Two possible outcomes, Timetable will be brought in, chaos will result or new timetable will be binned and the current timetable will be retained, no doubt with further daily cancellations.

Problem is I cannot see a solution, after all TPE having been failing passengers since May 2018.

 

[Killingworth]

Given that TPE cannot run the current timetable, or even something close to it, not a chance. What is going to change between now and December that is going to allow to increased services by 50%+ over what they are running now. Its 7/8 weeks away

Two possible outcomes, Timetable will be brought in, chaos will result or new timetable will be binned and the current timetable will be retained, no doubt with further daily cancellations.

Problem is I cannot see a solution, after all TPE having been failing passengers since May 2018.

To be as fair as possible, in late February/early March 2020 here on South Pennine they seemed to have cracked it. Then before we'd had time to confirm it wasn't our imagination along came Covid. For many months there were long empty trains but they ran.

Today it's a lottery and former regular users aren't buying tickets. They are now regular workers from home or are using alternative transport, commuting numbers may be down to only 40% of pre-Covid.

From December tickets are on sale for the extended route to Liverpool.

The 5.08 isn't running from Sheffield today. Over the last 20 days it has run 12 times, but cancelled on 8. It's similar for most other trains. It rather stretches credulity to imagine a reliable full service along the full route by December.

The internecine battles within the industry are doing permanent damage to the market for regular rail travel generally. On TPE that's becoming acute.

 

[DanNCL]

The internecine battles within the industry are doing permanent damage to the market for regular rail travel generally. On TPE that's becoming acute.

The damage is already done for many. A lot of regular train users have completely given up on TPE and won't return.

 

[BHXDMT]

Two possible outcomes, Timetable will be brought in, chaos will result or new timetable will be binned and the current timetable will be retained, no doubt with further daily cancellations.

Problem is I cannot see a solution, after all TPE having been failing passengers since May 2018.

Plenty of rumours around TPE that an emergency timetable is coming from the timetable change date. The changes will happen, but at a reduced frequency I suspect.

 

[mike57]

The damage is already done for many. A lot of regular train users have completely given up on TPE and won't return.

I used to travel to the NW from Seamer for the day every Wednesday, the ongoing problems mean I have managed to rearrange work, and either complete via teams/zoom, or hand off to someone more local. As a result I now only make the journey when its absolutely required that I have a presence in person. Thats maybe once every 6 weeks now. I am no doubt one of many. Due to the nature of the journey I also use an open return rather than cheaper advances, so the loss is greater.

 

[sjpowermac]

Given that TPE cannot run the current timetable, or even something close to it, not a chance. What is going to change between now and December that is going to allow to increased services by 50%+ over what they are running now. Its 7/8 weeks away

Two possible outcomes, Timetable will be brought in, chaos will result or new timetable will be binned and the current timetable will be retained, no doubt with further daily cancellations.

Problem is I cannot see a solution, after all TPE having been failing passengers since May 2018.

Presumably the completion of traction training/new drivers completing their training/completion of route training.

There has been a Class 68s/Mk5a set out since last week running Manchester-York-Manchester-Leeds-Longsight.

I don’t work for the company, so I honestly have no idea if the December uplift will take place, that’s why I asked

 

[Metroman62]

It's annoying to see TPE adverts on TV and YouTube saying how great they are, when in reality it's a poor service. Living in Scarborough, it's very frustrating at times to have such a poor service.

There have been a couple of local news stories about the poor TPE (& Northern) service, but nothing significant in the reports

 

[Bakerloo]

I'm honestly surprised that they still have a contract, given how many issues they have

 

[Kite159]

I'm honestly surprised that they still have a contract, given how many issues they have

Get rid of First and who will step in to run the trains? The Operator of Last Resort hasn't got the resources to take on another 'franchise', and I can't see any other companies lining up to run trains in this country.

 

[GordonT]

Get rid of First and who will step in to run the trains? The Operator of Last Resort hasn't got the resources to take on another 'franchise', and I can't see any other companies lining up to run trains in this country.

We seem to have reached the stage where TOCs with "issues" are just left to muddle on since DfT don't want to become the visible focus of responsibility for appalling delivery.

 

[SuperNova]

We seem to have reached the stage where TOCs with "issues" are just left to muddle on since DfT don't want to become the visible focus of responsibility for appalling delivery.

Because they ultimately are the ones responsible for the current mess. Having a buffer, which many Labour politicians and passengers can't see past, is in their self-interest.

 

[7522]

The daily cancelled services PDF lists 11/17 Southbound services from Newcastle cancelled tomorrow, although not all are on journey check yet and tickets for them are still for sale which is leaving me a bit confused as to whether they are definitely cancelled. If they are though it will be the worst day for them in Newcastle surely (excluding any weekends when there were diversions on route).

Still having these services for sale now is very confusing for customers if they are indeed cancelled as the website suggests. I think they need to introduce an emergency timetable on this route now as well as over the last month it has become much worse with regularly half of the daily service cancelled.

 

[gimmea50anyday]

04:25 and 07:43 appear to be running, although wether driver has to go and get the unit for 04:25 still remains to be seen

---* Edit *---

07:43 (unit diagram starys doncaster) cancelled along with 05:40 (heaton), 06:40 (Heaton), 08:4x (doncaster) 09:4x (edge Hill) and 10:4x ,(Edge Hill) services. Im guessing the 11:4x is the same unit that formed the 04:25 having run to Liverpool and back, so thats just one 802 diagram out of 7 running!

—-* Edit*—-

11:4x utilises a set that comes off Edge Hill, its the 12:47 that is formed off the same set that formed the 04:25 so 8 diagrams, 3 off Heaton, 3 off Edge Hill and 2 off Doncaster, only 1 diagram off Edge Hill and 1 off Heaton actually ran so 2 out of 8

Staff wise, all the newcastle diagrans are covered so theres no shortage of traincrew as far as Newcastle is concerned. Is it beyond the realm of sensibility for control to utilise these crews to cover other services instead? But of course when staff are working to rule as a result of the ongoing industrial dispute that flexibility and willingness to work is often lost. Hence why a rest day working agreement is needed and needs to incentivise staff to want to work on their days off

 

[mike57]

Looking at RTT this morning York - Manchester services look to be roughly 1 per hour throughout the morning, a big gap at lunchtime and a few more trains during the afternoon/evening maybe averaging 3 per 2 hours. And this assumes that this further reduced timetable doesn't suffer further cancellations. All are scheduled to be 6 car, but this is actually slighly less capacity than in the early 80s when it was hourly with a 47 + 6 or 7 Mk2s.

Nothing through to Liverpool until 12:47 from York, the 05:44 from York ran, but that it for the morning

Not an acceptable level of service between major urban centres. Maybe disgruntled customers should try and start a social media campaign about the appalling level of service, as politicians and the media seem to take more notice of that than traditional approaches these days. Start by replying with negative comments on all TPE social media posts. How about a hashtag #TPEnowhere... taking a swipe at their 'where next' campaign.

 

[VauxhallNova]

TPE management are responsible for aligning the timetable plan with the available resources.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Not an acceptable level of service between major urban centres. Maybe disgruntled customers should try and start a social media campaign about the appalling level of service, as politicians and the media seem to take more notice of that than traditional approaches these days.

For what it's worth, the current sub-optimal TPE service provision got a mention in passing on BBC Radio 5 Live's Breakfast news programme this morning.

 

[nr758123]

Not an acceptable level of service between major urban centres. Maybe disgruntled customers should try and start a social media campaign about the appalling level of service, as politicians and the media seem to take more notice of that than traditional approaches these days. Start by replying with negative comments on all TPE social media posts. How about a hashtag #TPEnowhere... taking a swipe at their 'where next' campaign.

To a certain extent that already happens, to no discernible effect.

Maybe something like the Northern Resist facebook group could be set up. TransPennine Distress, perhaps?