Travelling in the Vestibules.

[Northernboy67]

I am not sure where this should really be. But I will try here. From time to time, I travel from Birmingham New Street to London Euston. Sometimes the 16:10 on a Saturday. Which gets in at 17:33. From there I go to St. Pancaras International, in order to try and get the 17:55 High Speed 1 service to Medway towns. Because I am seated in Standard class, usually Coach B towards the rear. At about 10 minutes from Euston, I vacate my seat and pass through the train and through First Class, so I can get to the front. I do this so I am near the exit at Euston. I have seen the signs about the first class Vestibules. Is there really anything to stop me doing what I am doing. As I am usually at the front of the train, 5 minutes from Euston. I just would not want to be caught out.

 

[Flamingo]

First Class includes the vestibules of the carriages. On FGW we have signs up explaining that, and I spend more time than I wish to explaining this to the hard of thinking. This includes those that wish to walk through First Class to spend the last five minutes of the journey cluttering up the vestibules.

One of the perks of paying the extra for travelling in First Class for some people is so they are at the right end of the train on arrival and able to get off quickly. They can't do this if there are (potentially) every customer in Standard Class queueing to exit through the First Class doors.

Basically, if you are in a First Class portion of the train you are liable for a First Class fare.

 

[221129]

I am not sure where this should really be. But I will try here. From time to time, I travel from Birmingham New Street to London Euston. Sometimes the 16:10 on a Saturday. Which gets in at 17:33. From there I go to St. Pancaras International, in order to try and get the 17:55 High Speed 1 service to Medway towns. Because I am seated in Standard class, usually Coach B towards the rear. At about 10 minutes from Euston, I vacate my seat and pass through the train and through First Class, so I can get to the front. I do this so I am near the exit at Euston. I have seen the signs about the first class Vestibules. Is there really anything to stop me doing what I am doing. As I am usually at the front of the train, 5 minutes from Euston. I just would not want to be caught out.

Yes. The vestibules are part of first class so you are commiting a byelay offence at the very least.

 

[CallySleeper]

Is there really anything to stop me doing what I am doing.

Yep, being escorted back to standard by a member of the train crew or a byelaw offence if you don't comply.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yep, being escorted back to standard by a member of the train crew or a byelaw offence if you don't comply.

Or if relevant a Penalty Fare.

Edit: As it's VT not a Penalty Fare.

Why not simply walk to the very end of Coach E or U? It's not *that* far from the barrier.

Neil

 

[185143]

Is there really anything to stop me doing what I am doing.

Yep, being escorted back to standard by a member of the train crew or a byelaw offence if you don't comply.

I'm not defending the OP, but I can understand his viewpoint and it does seem a bit harsh, although there is no way to prove you haven't been stood/sat there for ages I suppose.

 

[38Cto15E]

Didn't some HSTs (ECML?) have a swing barrier in the gangway outside the kitchen area to deter such manouvres?
I would have thought that the OP would be OK if he left it until Willesdon before moving into the First class area, or one could always catch a slightly earlier train or buy a weekend upgrade.

 

[pne]

Why not simply walk to the very end of Coach E or U?

Or buy a 1st class ticket from Milton Keynes to Euston?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Or buy a 1st class ticket from Milton Keynes to Euston?

Assuming the train stops there of course. A costly way to save about 5 minutes.

Neil

 

[yorkie]

The time difference between the front of Std and the front of 1st is going to be minimal - 30 seconds?

Out of interest, which way do you walk to St Pancras? Do you go along the congested Euston Road? If so, you can save about 3 mins by going via Brill Place/Phoenix Road; See map.

 

[CallySleeper]

I'm not defending the OP, but I can understand his viewpoint and it does seem a bit harsh

Me too; I also tried to play the convenience card once for a ten minute hop and it was pretty humiliating. Rules are there for everyone I suppose no matter how far you're going.

 

[pne]

Assuming the train stops there of course.

The 16:10 on a Saturday does.

In general, of course, you're right - and the OP did just mention that train as an example ("sometimes").

 

[PermitToTravel]

There was a 14-page argument on this a year ago: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=92406

 

[westv]

One thing to remember is that the train crew may be sorting out the 1st class kitchen on arrival to get it ready for the next departure. The last thing they need is passengers wandering through and getting in the way.

 

[Northernboy67]

The time difference between the front of Std and the front of 1st is going to be minimal - 30 seconds?

Out of interest, which way do you walk to St Pancras? Do you go along the congested Euston Road? If so, you can save about 3 mins by going via Briill Road/Phoenix Road; See map.

That is the way I always go. A friend of mine who used to work for Network Rail, taught me this route.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Thanks for the responses. I shall bear this in mind.

 

[Mr Spock]

One thing to remember is that the train crew may be sorting out the 1st class kitchen on arrival to get it ready for the next departure. The last thing they need is passengers wandering through and getting in the way.

You would not go trough the kitchen area so assume you mean the staff are probably clearing and resetting the tables.

At the standard end of 1st class the sliding door has a big sign on it stating that it is 1st class only beyond that point.

As for the walking route it may be quicker via Brill Rd, etc but I always think it is more interesting walking down Euston Road.

 

[Greenback]

It must be annoying for those in first class when people start traipsing through to get to the last vestibule 10 minutes before London.

On the few occasions I've used FGW first class to London, though, I haven't noticed it happening. Perhaps that's because of the notices and keen enforcement of the rules by train crew!

As yorkie said, it doesn't really save a lot of time, and using a better route better Euston and St Pancras would be more advantageous in saving time.

 

[Stompehh]

It must be annoying for those in first class when people start traipsing through to get to the last vestibule 10 minutes before London.

On the few occasions I've used FGW first class to London, though, I haven't noticed it happening. Perhaps that's because of the notices and keen enforcement of the rules by train crew!

As yorkie said, it doesn't really save a lot of time, and using a better route better Euston and St Pancras would be more advantageous in saving time.

Many people on the FGW trains actually want to be towards the rear of the train to access the Hammersmith & City/Circle lines!

 

[Flamingo]

Many people on the FGW trains actually want to be towards the rear of the train to access the Hammersmith & City/Circle lines!

Not enough!

 

[yorkie]

Not enough!

I wonder if this is partly due to lack of knowledge. Some people will be heading south, some on foot, some by bus, but surely a significant number would want the H&C/Circle? I think some people don't realise that the best place to go for that is near the middle/rear (about coach E-ish from memory?) or maybe I'm overestimating the proportion who'd want to go that way.

 

[Greenback]

Most of the people who get off at the same time as I alight from standard seem to be heading towards the main concourse. I suspect it varies quite a bit, though, depending on the time of day.

 

[FenMan]

I wonder if this is partly due to lack of knowledge. Some people will be heading south, some on foot, some by bus, but surely a significant number would want the H&C/Circle? I think some people don't realise that the best place to go for that is near the middle/rear (about coach E-ish from memory?) or maybe I'm overestimating the proportion who'd want to go that way.

Yep, that's what I do!