Tree on the line between Woking & Brookwood

[gabrielhj07]

A tree appears to be blocking the SWML between Woking & Brookwood, causing grief to SWR services.

1L40 was cancelled at Basingstoke and taken out of service. 2L42 has not been brought into service yet, and 1W16 has stopped additionally at Basingstoke and seems to have taken up all stops to Woking.


1L38 was cut short at Farnborough, and turned back to pick up 1L39 from Basingstoke.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Apr 2024 ==

And here is the tree, seen from 1W16 passing on the Up Slow:

 

[trainophile]

Seems to have been a few cancellations due to high winds today. A couple of XCs from Birmingham New Street were showing cancelled, including an Edinburgh and a Plymouth around midday today.

 

[gabrielhj07]

Seems to have been a few cancellations due to high winds today. A couple of XCs from Birmingham New Street were showing cancelled, including an Edinburgh and a Plymouth around midday today.

I saw that a South Coast - Midlands XC was cancelled as well, though I don‘t know if this was for the weather.

 

[FuzzyDuck]

Not that unusual for XC to terminate short at Reading.

 

[infobleep]

Seems to have been a few cancellations due to high winds today. A couple of XCs from Birmingham New Street were showing cancelled, including an Edinburgh and a Plymouth around midday today.

I checked online to see if the storm was named but it seems the Met Office hadn't named it but Météo France had named it Storm Renata.

Dépression Renata: trois départements en vigilance orange “vent violent”

Le Nord, le Pas-de-Calais et la Somme ont été placés en vigilance orange pour "vent violent" lundi 15 avril, d’après le dernier bulletin de Météo-France.

rmc.bfmtv.com

So I guess they weren't expecting it to be too damaging in the UK.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I was on the 1205 off Waterloo which terminated at Woking well over three hours late.

Having seen the pictures of the twig above, I'm quite flummoxed as to why it took so long to get things sorted. Was serious damage caused to the power supply? (We did have power for almost all of those three hours, it was only off for maybe ten minutes). I had at least expected a very large tree!

I am also quite unimpressed that while we did have power and were able to move (it was the train in front that hit it) no attempt was made to extricate us, either by way of evacuation or just running us back wrong line. A delay was inevitable, but the length of it wasn't. Had no toilets been available it's one of those cases where I'd have seriously considered using the egress - and it was already long enough to be causing people issues due to the lack of any kind of catering, at one point an announcement was made regarding water for someone who needed to take meds.

The driver and guard did what they could, but they seemed poorly informed too.

And at Woking it was a shambles, for instance the following Weymouth had a last minute platform alteration to 5, which I expect not everyone made due to the narrow footbridge - yet the former had been sat in 4 with no driver (gone elsewhere, either for PNB or to work something else) for over half an hour at that point and so that could have been known and announced well in advance.

Very, very poor on SWR and NR's part. Delay Repay doesn't seem enough, really.

I think this is the longest single delay I've ever experienced (except where I've given up entirely), and unlike in the case of a fatality (my second-longest one) it barely seemed justified, either, when there were options that were simply not taken.

 

[Recessio]

I've heard reports a passenger pulled an egress, evacuated to track and started clearing branches themselves! Pretty terrifying that they were handling tree branches during wet weather on third-rail territory...

 

[Bigfoot]

I've heard reports a passenger pulled an egress, evacuated to track and started clearing branches themselves! Pretty terrifying that they were handling tree branches during wet weather on third-rail territory...

Correct. Passenger egressed not once but twice! Certainly didn't help matters, along side that trees seemed to just keep falling over as soon as one was cleared another dropped just down the line.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've heard reports a passenger pulled an egress, evacuated to track and started clearing branches themselves! Pretty terrifying that they were handling tree branches during wet weather on third-rail territory...

That might explain the brief power outage.

With the airport being a possible destination, I wonder if they weren't from the UK? I can imagine that that would have been considered helpful in some Eastern European and Asian countries (and they don't have third rail in the same way).

 

[zwk500]

With the airport being a possible destination, I wonder if they weren't from the UK? I can imagine that that would have been considered helpful in some Eastern European and Asian countries (and they don't have third rail in the same way).

Tbh it's equally likely to be somebody who's lived in the UK all their life and has just 'had enough' and is either ignorant of the safety risks, or believes themselves to be perfectly capable of acting safely. Your own reaction to the pictures upthread would be shared by more than a few passengers caught up in it, I expect ('its only a twig, I'll get out and shift it for them while they have their committee meeting' etc).

There's numerous instances of people who clearly have lived in the UK for ages (because they reference the problems extending over years) doing various 'guerilla' maintenance when the local council takes forever to repair a pothole or replace a fence or whatever.

 

[455refurb]

The length of delay and consequential vigilante action - just another example of the symptoms and outcome of the state of today's rail industry in the UK. Paralysed by inaction, lack of resources, political meddling, and endless procedural bureaucracy. That is not to say that the vast majority of the staff on the ground don't do their best. I feel sorry for them.

 

[infobleep]

Tbh it's equally likely to be somebody who's lived in the UK all their life and has just 'had enough' and is either ignorant of the safety risks, or believes themselves to be perfectly capable of acting safely. Your own reaction to the pictures upthread would be shared by more than a few passengers caught up in it, I expect ('its only a twig, I'll get out and shift it for them while they have their committee meeting' etc).

There's numerous instances of people who clearly have lived in the UK for ages (because they reference the problems extending over years) doing various 'guerilla' maintenance when the local council takes forever to repair a pothole or replace a fence or whatever.

Would it have been possible to provide an update to passengers explaining this or would that have caused further problems and tensions?

 

[Recessio]

Would it have been possible to provide an update to passengers explaining this or would that have caused further problems and tensions?

I've always thought signallers could use the feature that allows them to directly PA into train tannoys more often

 

[coppercapped]

I checked online to see if the storm was named but it seems the Met Office hadn't named it but Météo France had named it Storm Renata.

Dépression Renata: trois départements en vigilance orange “vent violent”

Le Nord, le Pas-de-Calais et la Somme ont été placés en vigilance orange pour "vent violent" lundi 15 avril, d’après le dernier bulletin de Météo-France.

rmc.bfmtv.com

So I guess they weren't expecting it to be too damaging in the UK.

I'm in Bonn at the moment and yesterday (Monday) at least one tree came down across the DB's left bank line along the Rhein between Remagen and Koblenz[1].

Job stopped - whilst walking to our car along the Rhein in Remagen in the evening we met some passengers who had given up and were going for a meal there...

Happens elsewhere too!

[1] As everyone probably knows the hillsides there are very steep.

 

[zwk500]

Would it have been possible to provide an update to passengers explaining this or would that have caused further problems and tensions?

I wasn't on the train so can't comment on the specific circumstance, although I have always felt that hearing 'I'm sorry I haven't got any updates, I'll let you know as soon as I do' at appropriate intervals is better than complete silence.

I've always thought signallers could use the feature that allows them to directly PA into train tannoys more often

Signallers usually have enough else going on, they can tell the drivers the situation and the let them work out how to handle it (such as by updating the guard if there is one)

 

[pompeyfan]

There was 2 trees down within 5 minutes of each other. One blocked both down lines at Woking, and the other both down lines at Weybridge.

The fact both trees were close to each other probably worked against NR rather than to their benefit.

 

[Somewhere]

I've always thought signallers could use the feature that allows them to directly PA into train tannoys more often

Because Signallers are just sat around doing nothing twiddling their thumbs waiting for the obstructions to clear themselves

 

[43066]

I've always thought signallers could use the feature that allows them to directly PA into train tannoys more often

Absolutely not. That’s for emergency situations where the train driver is uncontactable, and is very much not something signallers would do regularly. I’ve never known it to happen, nor heard of it happening.

It’s not something they would realistically have time to do, given that one signaller can control very large areas with dozens or scores of trains on their patch at any one time, and many complex junctions and stations.

It would also be completely inappropriate for a signaller to usurp the traincrew by making direct announcements, when the on train staff are best placed to judge the situation.

 

[greaterwest]

I've heard signallers announce to the train that the doors will open on the right hand side on arrival at Guildford (if they have routed the train into platforms 6/7 in the London direction) just before the train arrives (while it's in the tunnel).

 

[skyhigh]

I've heard signallers announce to the train that the doors will open on the right hand side on arrival at Guildford (if they have routed the train into platforms 6/7 in the London direction) just before the train arrives (while it's in the tunnel).

Are you certain it wasn't the driver/guard? Can't say I have ever heard (or even heard of!) a signaller making an announcement.

 

[Horizon22]

I've heard signallers announce to the train that the doors will open on the right hand side on arrival at Guildford (if they have routed the train into platforms 6/7 in the London direction) just before the train arrives (while it's in the tunnel).

That is surely the driver or guard.

PA to train externally by GSMR can be some at some TOCs and by signallers I believe, but only in very specific circumstances (normally with the driver's agreement / in emergency)

 

[greaterwest]

Are you certain it wasn't the driver/guard? Can't say I have ever heard (or even heard of!) a signaller making an announcement.

That is surely the driver or guard.

PA to train externally by GSMR can be some at some TOCs and by signallers I believe, but only in very specific circumstances (normally with the driver's agreement / in emergency)

Yes, I am certain, "for the attention of the train crew" was the phrase used! It was also quite loud. It was a few years ago so unsure if they do this (or are allowed to) any more.

I'll also add that this was in the midst of a spate of wrong-side opening at Guildford. For those unaware, Guildford 6/7 is a single track with two platform faces, but doors are only ever opened on the platform 6 side due to the third rail being on the platform 7 side.

 

[coppercapped]

Absolutely not. That’s for emergency situations where the train driver is uncontactable, and is very much not something signallers would do regularly. I’ve never known it to happen, nor heard of it happening.

It’s not something they would realistically have time to do, given that one signaller can control very large areas with dozens or scores of trains on their patch at any one time, and many complex junctions and stations.

It would also be completely inappropriate for a signaller to usurp the traincrew by making direct announcements, when the on train staff are best placed to judge the situation.

More than forty years ago I was on a late-running German InterCity train when Control - not the signallers - made announcements to the passengers directly through the train's PA system concerning connection alterations at the next stop.

I was very impressed!

 

[Falcon1200]

The length of delay and consequential vigilante action

Presumably the 'vigilante action', ie passengers on the track, resulted in traction current being switched off, effectively closing all four lines regardless of which the trees were actually obstructing? Perhaps the result of trespass in third rail areas could be more widely publicised, in particular when trains are at a stand for a while, regardless of the reason.

 

[zwk500]

Presumably the 'vigilante action', ie passengers on the track, resulted in traction current being switched off, effectively closing all four lines regardless of which the trees were actually obstructing? Perhaps the result of trespass in third rail areas could be more widely publicised, in particular when trains are at a stand for a while, regardless of the reason.

It would make no difference, I expect. There's enough warnings not to go onto the track. Trying to blame stuck passengers for getting frustrated is unlikely to work in the railway's favour.

 

[Meerkat]

It would make no difference, I expect. There's enough warnings not to go onto the track. Trying to blame stuck passengers for getting frustrated is unlikely to work in the railway's favour.

I disagree - the warnings are that YOU might get hurt and/or in trouble.
Those are things an individual can judge their own risk on.
They might not know “If anyone opens a door the powers goes off, all trains stop, and onboard services will eventually go off - it’s not constructive“
It also ensures that bystanders realise they have a stake in telling the person not to do it (anyone likely to do it is likely to have been gobbing off about it being ridiculous and if it isn’t sorted soon they will do it).

 

[dctraindriver]

Yes, I am certain, "for the attention of the train crew" was the phrase used! It was also quite loud. It was a few years ago so unsure if they do this (or are allowed to) any more.

I'll also add that this was in the midst of a spate of wrong-side opening at Guildford. For those unaware, Guildford 6/7 is a single track with two platform faces, but doors are only ever opened on the platform 6 side due to the third rail being on the platform 7 side.

I’m a driver and I do that every time I’m put into 6 when the guard thinks it’ll be 5.

 

[zwk500]

I disagree - the warnings are that YOU might get hurt and/or in trouble.
Those are things an individual can judge their own risk on.
They might not know “If anyone opens a door the powers goes off, all trains stop, and onboard services will eventually go off - it’s not constructive“
It also ensures that bystanders realise they have a stake in telling the person not to do it (anyone likely to do it is likely to have been gobbing off about it being ridiculous and if it isn’t sorted soon they will do it).

I still think that if a person is willing to ignore the warnings already in place they'll tell anybody trying to reason with them where they can shove their advice.

 

[Bigfoot]

I've heard signallers announce to the train that the doors will open on the right hand side on arrival at Guildford (if they have routed the train into platforms 6/7 in the London direction) just before the train arrives (while it's in the tunnel).

There was a timetable a few years ago (think pre covid) that had a quite a number of up trains timetabled into 6 instead of 5 and it caused no end of wrong side door openings. There seemed to be no logic behind it.

I’m a driver and I do that every time I’m put into 6 when the guard thinks it’ll be 5.

Exactly the same as me, always announce it. A quick pa is easier than the rigmarole of dealing with the reporting etc.

Anyway, we digress on a large tangent here.