Trivia: Slowest and fastest services on UK rail network

[mjc]

Eh? XC are timed 12.5 minutes between the two and that includes a minute engineering allowance. Where does the 60mph come from? Considering they stop at both stations and it’s not 125 all the way.

Ah, ok I apologise I’d been seduced by difference between the departure times from Stafford and Wolverhampton but that of course doesn’t account for the time at platform at Wolverhampton. One of my regular journeys is actually 14 mins, as below, but then sits at Wolverhampton for 5 minutes for no good reason, even Birmingham New Street only gets a 7 minute wait!

So that gets it to c. 73 mph between the stations, and I get there’s some acceleration and deceleration time but that’s still not great.

 

[The Planner]

Ah, ok I apologise I’d been seduced by difference between the departure times from Stafford and Wolverhampton but that of course doesn’t account for the time at platform at Wolverhampton. One of my regular journeys is actually 14 mins, as below, but then sits at Wolverhampton for 5 minutes for no good reason, even Birmingham New Street only gets a 7 minute wait!

So that gets it to c. 73 mph between the stations, and I get there’s some acceleration and deceleration time but that’s still not great.

Like I said though, its not 125 all the way, its slow until Rickerscote and slows down at Bushbury.

 

[al78]

If local journeys with a single connection are included then Horsham to Haywards Heath on a Sunday can take 41 minutes to do a journey with a net distance of 15 miles. When taking into account the time needed for me to cycle to the station and buy a ticket in good time it would take about the same time to cycle the full distance from my house which is only a little under two and a half miles from the station.

 

[Sprinter150]

Roger Ford actually had an article in this month's MR (pg34) on the increasing number of trains scheduled to run 100mph+ (now 494 services per day). Fastest services in 2023 are Ashford to Ebbsfleet on HS1 (averages 111.4mph) and one STA-WFJ up express from MAN (108.9mph)

 

[class26]

a few statistics taken from July`s Modern Railways -

Ashford - Ebbsfleet 33.42 miles, 18 minutes av 111.4 mph
Stafford - Watford 116.13 miles, 64 minutes, av 108.9 mph
Grantham - Stevenage 77.71 miles, 43 minutes, av 108.4 mph
Didcot - Swindon 24.15 mils, 14 minutes, av 103.5 mph
London - Yotk, 188.4 miles, 106 mins, av 106.5 mph

 

[dk1]

a few statistics taken from July`s Modern Railways -

Ashford - Ebbsfleet 33.42 miles, 18 minutes av 111.4 mph
Stafford - Watford 116.13 miles, 64 minutes, av 108.9 mph
Grantham - Stevenage 77.71 miles, 43 minutes, av 108.4 mph
Didcot - Swindon 24.15 mils, 14 minutes, av 103.5 mph
London - Yotk, 188.4 miles, 106 mins, av 106.5 mph

Was interesting that more faster services have started to appear over the last few years. Avanti have it on the classic network.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

If local journeys with a single connection are included then Horsham to Haywards Heath on a Sunday can take 41 minutes to do a journey with a net distance of 15 miles.

Not really. Think that would be an entirely different discussion as we'd now be talking about multiple trains, not the slowest or fastest individual train. Must be any number of shortish journeys where sub-optimal connections, particularly on a Sunday, result in relatively lengthy overall journey times.

 

[Bartsimho]

Was interesting that more faster services have started to appear over the last few years. Avanti have it on the classic network.

A change in the way the industry is looking at journeys again?

Prioritising headline expresses which connect big places?

 

[Bald Rick]

but then sits at Wolverhampton for 5 minutes for no good reason, even Birmingham New Street only gets a 7 minute wait!

There’s good reasons.

 

[Bartsimho]

There’s good reasons.

Say them then rather than just keeping them to yourself when this is a forum for discussing these

 

[Bald Rick]

Say them then rather than just keeping them to yourself when this is a forum for discussing these

oh I don’t know the detail, but I do know that planners don’t put in long station dwells for ‘No good reason’

Its almost certainly to align the paths correctly for the busy Wolves - Brum and Brum - Cov corridor.

 

[mjc]

oh I don’t know the detail, but I do know that planners don’t put in long station dwells for ‘No good reason’

Its almost certainly to align the paths correctly for the busy Wolves - Brum and Brum - Cov corridor.

Oh I’m sure there is a reason, doesn’t make it a good reason for me to spend an unnecessary 8 minutes a day admiring Wolverhampton station! If it took 5 minutes to get the passengers on and off then that would be a good reason but rarely the case (last week may have been…people so rammed in that it took ages to unload and load but that’s a separate problem).

 

[The Planner]

Say them then rather than just keeping them to yourself when this is a forum for discussing these

oh I don’t know the detail, but I do know that planners don’t put in long station dwells for ‘No good reason’

Its almost certainly to align the paths correctly for the busy Wolves - Brum and Brum - Cov corridor.

The Shrewsbury New St leaves Wolves at 0833 so the earliest the XC could leave is 0836. The Shrewsbury stops at Galton Bridge so you are going to catch it up, so leaving at 0839 makes no difference apart from you arent chasing reds. XC are also of the view that its better not to be chasing reds as passengers assume something is wrong. 7 minutes is fine for New St, it has to go at xx.03 anyway.

 

[Bald Rick]

Oh I’m sure there is a reason, doesn’t make it a good reason for me to spend an unnecessary 8 minutes a day admiring Wolverhampton station! If it took 5 minutes to get the passengers on and off then that would be a good reason but rarely the case (last week may have been…people so rammed in that it took ages to unload and load but that’s a separate problem).

Well what might be good for the planners might not appear to be good for individual travellers, but planners do try to make the plan to be ‘net good‘ for everyone.

I actually look to get at least 18 minutes at Wolverhampton station between trains, in the hours of 1100-2300 (and when I’m not working) as it then affords time for a trip to the Great Western.

The Shrewsbury New St leaves Wolves at 0833 so the earliest the XC could leave is 0836. The Shrewsbury stops at Galton Bridge so you are going to catch it up, so leaving at 0839 makes no difference apart from you arent chasing reds. XC are also of the view that it’s better not to be chasing reds as passengers assume something is wrong. 7 minutes is fine for New St, it has to go at xx.03 anyway.

Aside from not chasing reds, a later departure from Wolves also allows a slightly shorter journey time for those travelling from Wolverhampton to the XC stations beyond New St, and it is therefore slightly more attractive and theoretically generates slightly more revenue.

 

[dk1]

A change in the way the industry is looking at journeys again?

Prioritising headline expresses which connect big places?

Hopefully. It's an interesting read.

 

[Railperf]

The fastest trains over 100mph average speed listed here ...

Rail Performance Society - 100mph Scheduled Runs

www.railperf.org.uk

 

[SteveM70]

I can’t get my little head around a train averaging over 100mph between Didcot and Swindon

 

[matt_world2004]

Greenford to west Ealing has an average speed of 13.6 miles per hour

 

[Railperf]

I can’t get my little head around a train averaging over 100mph between Didcot and Swindon

We don' t have any records in the RPS archives of any train achieving or beating the 14 mins yet, though they have been very close.
in May 2021 we finally recorded a run of 14 min 17 sec that finally beat a 1980's 14min 18 sec HST time. Later that month a fastest time of 14 min 10 seconds was recorded.

In the down direction 14 min 5 seconds is the best we have seen so far.

 

[JonnySeagull]

I travelled Nottingham to Leicester recently (27 miles 39 chains) and there are two services which leave 13 minutes apart. The earlier one takes 47 minutes for an average speed of approx 35.1 mph and the later service takes 21 minutes for an average speed of approx 78.5 mph. Does anyone else have an example of a bigger average speed difference between two trains travelling between the same places like that?

 

[WizCastro197]

I travelled Nottingham to Leicester recently (27 miles 39 chains) and there are two services which leave 13 minutes apart. The earlier one takes 47 minutes for an average speed of approx 35.1 mph and the later service takes 21 minutes for an average speed of approx 78.5 mph. Does anyone else have an example of a bigger average speed difference between two trains travelling between the same places like that?

There is also the 30 minute service which stops at a few intermediate stations between Leicester and Nottingham like Loughborough, East Mids Park etc.

 

[miklcct]

I travelled Nottingham to Leicester recently (27 miles 39 chains) and there are two services which leave 13 minutes apart. The earlier one takes 47 minutes for an average speed of approx 35.1 mph and the later service takes 21 minutes for an average speed of approx 78.5 mph. Does anyone else have an example of a bigger average speed difference between two trains travelling between the same places like that?

Watford Junction - Euston on the LNR vs the Overground

 

[JonnySeagull]

There is also the 30 minute service which stops at a few intermediate stations between Leicester and Nottingham like Loughborough, East Mids Park etc.

The 21 minute service was unusual as it was direct (normally even the London trains stop at East Midlands Parkway) but the longer service stopped pretty much everywhere before Leicester where it terminated. Just found it unusual for them to leave 13 minutes apart and call at the same place.

 

[D6975]

To be fair the 77 miles must be straight line and there’s a lot of water in the way. By land it’s probably about 100 miles and the railway takes a meandering route of around 125 miles so still pretty slow but not so shocking…

By rail, Inverness - Georgemass is actually 147 miles, god only knows from where they got the 77.

 

[AndrewE]

The 21 minute service was unusual as it was direct (normally even the London trains stop at East Midlands Parkway) but the longer service stopped pretty much everywhere before Leicester where it terminated. Just found it unusual for them to leave 13 minutes apart and call at the same place.

cf. Liverpool and Crewe. A bit off-topic, but just 2 trains an hour in each direction, leaving within about 10 minutes of each other in both directions too!

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Trainline says Inverness to Georgemass Junction is 77 miles and takes 3 and a half hours.

If Trainline said it was raining, I'd be inclined to look out of the window or step out of the front door to check.

 

[Amlag]

Bere Alston to Gunnislake is 4m 40c and takes 20mins equalling an average speed of just a fraction over 13 mph.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Bere Alston to Gunnislake is 4m 40c and takes 20mins equalling an average speed of just a fraction over 13 mph.

Typically timetabled as 18 minutes in the opposite direction, which speeds the return journey up to a much more impressive 15 mph on average!

 

[higthomas]

The fastest trains over 100mph average speed listed here ...

Rail Performance Society - 100mph Scheduled Runs

www.railperf.org.uk

I'd been wondering when someone would post what I'd see as the "definitive" answer for the fastest!

 

[HST274]

Simply because of the length of the journey I checked Aberdeen to Penzance, and that came out an average of about 56.7 mph, for a journey 750miles (roughly) long and 13.25 hours. Not the fastest or slowest of course, but I was curious.