Trivia: Stations that have direct service to London but few people wishing to travel there

[PTR 444]

The above question seems to apply to all stations at the moment, as government advice to stay at home means hardly any passengers making a journey to the capital. It’s got me thinking though, what about stations that have a direct London service but already had few passengers making a direct journey to London before Covid-19.

The criteria for this is that a station must have a direct service to any London terminal, but with fewer than 100 people a day making a journey to the capital from there. I think some of the more rural Dorset stations like Upwey and Moreton might be contenders as they are pushing the 2h commute time to/from London.

 

[yorkie]

...but with fewer than 100 people a day making a journey to the capital from there...

So basically a thread for people with access to LENNON database of ticket sales

 

[Bletchleyite]

Pick one of the smaller West Highland Line stations served by the Cally. All Cally passengers will be going to London, near enough, but the vast majority of passenger numbers will be on the other services and travelling domestically in Scotland.

 

[Iskra]

Most of the smaller stations on the LNER and Caledonian Sleeper services North of Edinburgh. Probably also the services between Berwick-Upon-Tweed and Newcastle that receive a skip-stop London service at places such as Alnwick or Morpeth. Also places such as Skipton and Keighley with one train per day to London and places such as Mirfield, Brighouse and Low Moor on Grand Central's services. Probably also the smaller stations West of Plymouth on GWR London services or on the North Wales Coast West of Chester too.

 

[Envy123]

I'd guess some of the stations between Edinburgh and Aberdeen, like Stonehaven?

 

[si404]

Obvious examples are places where London trains form local service some distance from London (eg Cornwall).

Additional obviousness can come from stations that get less, or at least not much more, than 100/day travelling full stop. (eg Little Kimble's 5,572 for the 18/19 year is less than 20 per day!)

Then you have the infrequent 1 or 2 trains per day direct that strongly hints there isn't much of a market. (eg the LNER services in West Yorkshire, though Harrogate went to 2-hourly in December - but is that genuine London demand, or providing a fast Leeds service with long trains on the busy commuter/leisure route?)

And sometimes all three factors tie together - eg sleepier stops on the Highland Mainline that see 2tpd to and from London (sleeper and Highland Chieftain).

 

[tonysk14]

Halifax, Brighouse, Wakefield Kirkgate etc. on the GC Bradford KX. Surely these services must carry more local passengers as far as Doncaster. I can't see a massive Brighouse to KX daily demand.

 

[si404]

Additional obviousness can come from stations that get less, or at least not much more, than 100/day travelling full stop. (eg Little Kimble's 5,572 for the 18/19 year is less than 20 per day!)

Stations with 2-hourly or better direct London service, but less than 80k/year (which is just over 200/day entering either or exiting and so works out as about 100/day) annual usage:

Acton Bridge, Adisham, Amberley, Ashurst, Bayford, Bekesbourne, Bloxwich, Bloxwich North, Chartham, Chilham, Cooksbridge, Cowden, Cressing, Crowhurst, Denham Golf Club, Feniton, Hever, Hollingbourne, Holton Heath, Honeybourne, Kearsney, Kemsing, Kings Sutton, Martin Mill, Minster, Monks Risborough, Moreton, Saunderton, Selling, Snowdown, Shepherds Well, Sole Street, Sudbury Hill Harrow, Upwey, Westenhanger, Whimple, White Notley, Wilmcote

There are a few more between 80 and 100k, and others that get limited London service.

 

[PTR 444]

Stations with 2-hourly or better direct London service, but less than 80k/year (which is just over 200/day entering either or exiting and so works out as about 100/day) annual usage:

Acton Bridge, Adisham, Amberley, Ashurst, Bayford, Bekesbourne, Bloxwich, Bloxwich North, Chartham, Chilham, Cooksbridge, Cowden, Cressing, Crowhurst, Denham Golf Club, Feniton, Hever, Hollingbourne, Holton Heath, Honeybourne, Kearsney, Kemsing, Kings Sutton, Martin Mill, Minster, Monks Risborough, Moreton, Saunderton, Selling, Snowdown, Shepherds Well, Sole Street, Sudbury Hill Harrow, Upwey, Westenhanger, Whimple, White Notley, Wilmcote

There are a few more between 80 and 100k, and others that get limited London service.

What percentage of annual passengers from those stations actually travel to London?

 

[swt_passenger]

What percentage of annual passengers from those stations actually travel to London?

You just won’t get an answer. It’s confidential commercial information, as per Yorkie’s post #2

 

[InOban]

Traditionally the vast majority of passengers from the HML on the Chieftain were travelling no further than Edinburgh, or at a push, stations such as Newcastle or York - trips for which there is no alternative mode except the car.

 

[aliceh]

Holton Heath? Gets an hourly Waterloo - Weymouth service but largely just serves an industrial estate (hence no late evening or Sunday service). Can't imagine many would travel from there to London

 

[causton]

Holton Heath? Gets an hourly Waterloo - Weymouth service but largely just serves an industrial estate (hence no late evening or Sunday service). Can't imagine many would travel from there to London

I stayed in a caravan park just round the corner from there actually, and used the station to travel to London!

That's... one... one passenger...

 

[ATW Alex 101]

I never imagined Alsager and Kidsgrove having that many passengers using the direct services through to London Euston, but perhaps they do, for tourism purposes. And both those stations seem to have a fair amount of footfall for other destinations.

Same goes with Kirkham & Wesham, having a direct service to/from London Euston, can’t imagine many using the service direct to London, but stand to be corrected.

 

[AndyHudds]

Halifax, Brighouse, Wakefield Kirkgate etc. on the GC Bradford KX. Surely these services must carry more local passengers as far as Doncaster. I can't see a massive Brighouse to KX daily demand.

Your assumption is very very wrong. I use the service in a regular basis from Brighouse when I go to London for football games and the like, although I live in Huddersfield it's pretty handy to have as Brighouse is a very short hop from Huddersfield by bus and rail. It serves the leisure market well from West Yorkshire and the passenger numbers are good.

 

[Ianno87]

Your assumption is very very wrong. I use the service in a regular basis from Brighouse when I go to London for football games and the like, although I live in Huddersfield it's pretty handy to have as Brighouse is a very short hop from Huddersfield by bus and rail. It serves the leisure market well from West Yorkshire and the passenger numbers are good.

I find it hard to believe that Mirfield or Low Moor generate very much London demand.

I do agree that the London flows from Brighouse, Halifax and Bradford seem pretty healthy.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

The above question seems to apply to all stations at the moment, as government advice to stay at home means hardly any passengers making a journey to the capital. It’s got me thinking though, what about stations that have a direct London service but already had few passengers making a direct journey to London before Covid-19.

The criteria for this is that a station must have a direct service to any London terminal, but with fewer than 100 people a day making a journey to the capital from there.

I'd guess Honeybourne counts. 66k passengers per year, so 182 entry/exits per day, or 91 return journeys. Generally the biggest flow from Vale of Evesham stations is to Worcester rather than Oxford/Reading/London.

Pershore (95k per year) is probably similar.

 

[xotGD]

While there may be under 100/day on the direct Airedale - Kings Cross service, the total number of passengers going to London per day from Keighley or Skipton would, I imagine, exceed that.

 

[CaptainHaddock]

My guess would be Colwall. It always felt strangely surreal to be standing on a tiny platform in a little country village and then see an 8 coach Paddington-bound HST pulling up.

 

[AndyHudds]

I find it hard to believe that Mirfield or Low Moor generate very much London demand.

I do agree that the London flows from Brighouse, Halifax and Bradford seem pretty healthy.

Well yeah, Mirfield and Low Moor demand must be low, I agree.

 

[si404]

What percentage of annual passengers from those stations actually travel to London?

Unless it's over 90% at some of the busier ones that are at 75-80k/year, which is safe to assume isn't the case, all those stations would fit your criteria of fewer than 100 people per day travelling to London. But we don't know exact percentages, and, as mentioned by others, we won't as the data is commercially confidential.

The list I compiled was designed to be that, while a couple of them can't be said with 100% certainty, these stations that have a regular and fairly frequent (most are hourly) London service (rather than a limited, token, or irregular one) do not generate 100 station->London journeys per day.

My guess would be Colwall. It always felt strangely surreal to be standing on a tiny platform in a little country village and then see an 8 coach Paddington-bound HST pulling up.

It would have been on my list if it had slightly more London service (it's 5tpd or something). But I ignored the rabbit hole of stations with infrequent London service as I'd imagine most of those do not generate the traffic.

 

[gazthomas]

I would think some of the smaller North Wales coast stations that Avanti stop at, Prestatyn and Fflint would qualify

 

[ATW Alex 101]

I would think some of the smaller North Wales coast stations that Avanti stop at, Prestatyn and Fflint would qualify

Prestatyn I should imagine gets a fair few, when I was surveying that station, I recall a number of people travelling to London. Flint less so, I agree.

 

[greyman42]

Halifax, Brighouse, Wakefield Kirkgate etc. on the GC Bradford KX. Surely these services must carry more local passengers as far as Doncaster. I can't see a massive Brighouse to KX daily demand.

Whenever I do the Bradford to Doncaster run, most passengers appear to be going to London. Very few alight at Doncaster.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Well yeah, Mirfield and Low Moor demand must be low, I agree.

Always seems to be plenty of folk with luggage waiting for GC at Mirfield, and I'm pretty sure they aren't holidaying in Doncaster! It's a railhead for Dewsbury and the Spen Valley for London trains, as well as having as good or better connections for Huddersfield as Brighouse does.

 

[chefchenko]

I never imagined Alsager and Kidsgrove having that many passengers using the direct services through to London Euston, but perhaps they do, for tourism purposes. And both those stations seem to have a fair amount of footfall for other destinations.

Same goes with Kirkham & Wesham, having a direct service to/from London Euston, can’t imagine many using the service direct to London, but stand to be corrected.

I’ve used it from kidsgrove a few times but it went via Trent valley then , I’d not bother with it now it’s via brum

 

[stj]

I would say all the stops between Cardiff and Swansea on the GWR Londons.

 

[AndyHudds]

Always seems to be plenty of folk with luggage waiting for GC at Mirfield, and I'm pretty sure they aren't holidaying in Doncaster! It's a railhead for Dewsbury and the Spen Valley for London trains, as well as having as good or better connections for Huddersfield as Brighouse does.

Not to veer off topic too much but I wonder if GC will call at Elland and the resited Ravensthorpe when they open?

 

[ValleyLines142]

I would say all the stops between Cardiff and Swansea on the GWR Londons.

Absolutely not, there are a staggering number of commuters that travel from Bridgend, Port Talbot, Neath and Swansea going to London, and not just between 7am-9am but also mid afternoon. If you get on an IET at Cardiff at about 8am that's come from Swansea, it's fairly full already and most are on their way to London as I've overheard commuters discussing their onward journey on the tube. Whenever I'm going to London or Bristol I try and get a service that starts at Cardiff where I have first choice of seats.

There's even a fair few from up in the Valleys that drive down to stations such as Neath to get the London train.

 

[Huntergreed]

Lockerbie in my region must be a contender. The only up avanti service to Euston from there leaves at 7:30am, and since we like our lie ins nobody is ever up on time to catch it. Genuinely think there is a good source of revenue to be found by introducing even one or two more London bound calls at Lockerbie, I know a lot of folk who would use it.