Trouble purchasing All Line Rover

[jay jay]

Good afternoon

I have just been to my local station (shall remain nameless ) attempting to purchase an all line rover starting tomorrow. One of the sales clerks said it was not possible to purchase through him and that it has to be done at a large "hub" station. The other clerk said she was sure it could be done but cant remember how.

Are there any ticket office staff on here who can help here? Do you know what they have to input into the computer so I can get this sorted out?

Thanks

 

[rail-britain]

Unusual excuse / reason
Such tickets can be purchased at any manned station
More likely the staff member didn't want to waste time trying to find it!
Equally, not on commission?

However, what date do you want it to commence from?

Perhaps list some nearby stations then phone them up, see if they can sell this
Then complain to the TOC involved that the local station refused to sell one and that it cost you an extra amount to arrange this

 

[jay jay]

Yeah, I found it strange too. I have purchased it in London before but never locally. I want it to commence from tomorrow but will be boarding my first train before the ticket office opens which is why I wanted to get it sorted now. Like you say, means I am going to have to make alternative plans.

 

[penaltyfines]

Out of interest, why aren't season tickets capped at ~£1300, i.e. 2x ALRs?

 

[island]

Ticket office staff are not normally on commission, and if not trained properly on their ticket software, may genuinely not know how to issue it. However, the machines at London terminal stations are not different from the ones at the station, and any old shack that has a ticket office can issue an ALR.

I want it to commence from tomorrow but will be boarding my first train before the ticket office opens which is why I wanted to get it sorted now. Like you say, means I am going to have to make alternative plans.

You don't need to make alternative plans, just at your first station use the vending machine to buy a single to wherever it is you will first change trains or alight (or a permit to travel), and purchase the ALR there; the amount you pay for the single ticket will be deducted from the amount to pay on arrival.

Out of interest, why aren't season tickets capped at ~£1300, i.e. 2x ALRs?

Because season tickets are valid at all times, and ALRs are not.

 

[penaltyfines]

Because season tickets are valid at all times, and ALRs are not.

Only on a limited number of TOCs travelling to/from a limited number of stations...

 

[LexyBoy]

Out of interest, why aren't season tickets capped at ~£1300, i.e. 2x ALRs?

There are lots of ways you can pay more than necessary for your trip.

Also, Seasons are generally regulated fares, whilst the ALR is not - so it's more logical the ALR would be priced at at least the cost of the most expensive 7 Day Season.

 

[rail-britain]

just at your first station use the vending machine to buy a single to wherever it is you will first change trains or alight (or a permit to travel), and purchase the ALR there; the amount you pay for the single ticket will be deducted from the amount to pay on arrival

Also, select the Receipt Required option (plus obtain a receipt for the ALR)
I have received complaints from a few people using this technique but refused the deduction
They then had to send both receipts and eventually were given the appropriate refund

Also, pay by Credit Card, you will then be covered as the purchase is over £100
You can then dispute this further if need be, as some TOC will prefer to make payment by way of Travel Vouchers, rather than a cheque

 

[penaltyfines]

Also, select the Receipt Required option (plus obtain a receipt for the ALR)
I have received complaints from a few people using this technique but refused the deduction
They then had to send both receipts and eventually were given the appropriate refund

Also, pay by Credit Card, you will then be covered as the purchase is over £100
You can then dispute this further if need be, as some TOC will prefer to make payment by way of Travel Vouchers, rather than a cheque

Or travel without a ticket until someone is willing to sell you one as 'ticket issuing facilities were not available'

 

[AlterEgo]

One of the sales clerks said it was not possible to purchase through him and that it has to be done at a large "hub" station.

Nonsense I'm afraid.

What a shame - interested employees will definitely know the value of an ALR!

 

[island]

Or travel without a ticket until someone is willing to sell you one as 'ticket issuing facilities were not available'

That is not permitted — if a ticket vending machine is available and you have a payment method it accepts, you must buy a ticket for part of your journey.

If you were going to pay for the ALR with a stack of RTVs, then I guess you could travel without a ticket.

Edit: Ignore that, I misread the point you were making.

 

[RJ]

Unusual excuse / reason
Such tickets can be purchased at any manned station
More likely the staff member didn't want to waste time trying to find it!
Equally, not on commission?

What is this obsession with staff being on/not being on commission? That has absolutely nothing to do with the ability/willingness to issue a ticket in this scenario.

Anyways, rovers are available from any ticket office. Unfortunately, some staff don't know how to issue them. Having worked in a ticket office in London, I was never once asked for a rover or ranger. I did know how to issue them, anyone with two brain cells to rub together and a customer focused attitude should be able to locate the menu within the TiS they use. Having said that, if I was told I could not do something, I'd check with a manager first. Sometimes, you just don't know if there is some unknown rule in place that can get you told off. I mean, I could go to Forest Hill ticket office and buy one of those Northern Only £10 rovers. The clerk may well get into trouble for it as it would be in contravention of the TSA, but there's about a 0.0001% chance they would have been told not to sell it.

I wouldn't attribute it to poor training - with tickets, it's impossible to be trained on everything and even if finer details were included in training, the majority of people would forget about the minor things that they never have to use. Not everyone has an enthusiastic interest in the minute intricacies of the ticketing system. So no, it's not so much bad training as having a generally poor attitude. Like I said, working a ticket machine isn't rocket science, sometimes it just requires a bit of patience. There were things I didn't 'know' how to do the first time (things not offered on that line of route, such as cycle reservations and specific seat reservations for example), so I'd ask the customer to wait whilst I found out how to do it. Normally, people asking for unusual things are understanding of this, though it wouldn't surprise me if some of the people on here would aggravate the situation by having a bad attitude towards staff who don't know everything off by heart.

 

[furryfeet]

Which is the section of the fares manual that has the appropriate bar-codes and fares for issuing an ALR ?

From distant memory, reading a Barry Doe article, an ALR can be issued on demand from any APTIS machine. (I think that they have been superseded by Advantix now )
It used to be Nat 6 section G I think.

So if the OP is armed with this information, then he cannot be fobbed off by the booking clerk at his unhelpful station.

 

[RJ]

I have a manual which has step by step instructions on how the rover menu can be accessed on all of the current machines in operation. The OP needs to state where the incident happened, then I can find out what TiS they use and post the relevant instructions. But, they would need to be used in conjunction with an appropriately patient attitude with the clerk.

 

[Greenback]

That must be a distant memory! APTIS has gone for some time!

As I recall, issuing some rovers with APTIS was a pain, mainly because the machiens ahs a tiny memory, even by 1995 standards, and were not conencted to any live network, unlike the systems of today.

I do remember having to find a rather large manual, which had a lot of barcodes in it, in order to sell some sort of rover for the Midlands. I can't understand why there is such a problem buying one these days, it should be much simpler now, everything should be there at the touch of a button or the click of a mouse! (Yes, this a 'it was worse n my day' post!).

 

[33011]

Good afternoon

I have just been to my local station (shall remain nameless ) attempting to purchase an all line rover starting tomorrow. One of the sales clerks said it was not possible to purchase through him and that it has to be done at a large "hub" station. The other clerk said she was sure it could be done but cant remember how.

Are there any ticket office staff on here who can help here? Do you know what they have to input into the computer so I can get this sorted out?

Thanks

Come to Lymington Town station tomorrow and I'll issue you one. lol

 

[mallard]

They probably think that if they refuse to sell an ALR you'll buy other tickets that will be more profitable for their employing TOC, e.g. TOC-only advance tickets.

I expect TOCs track the amount of profit made by each ticket seller and base promotion decisions on it...

 

[RJ]

They probably think that if they refuse to sell an ALR you'll buy other tickets that will be more profitable for their employing TOC, e.g. TOC-only advance tickets.

I expect TOCs track the amount of profit made by each ticket seller and base promotion decisions on it...

Is this based on anything remotely veritable or just some dreamed up conspiracy? I can safely say that those doing it for a day job only care about selling the cheapest and simplest ticket for the customers requirements. I maintain my opinion the the refusal to issue any issuable ticket is more to do with a bad attitude than anything else.

 

[Greenback]

They probably think that if they refuse to sell an ALR you'll buy other tickets that will be more profitable for their employing TOC, e.g. TOC-only advance tickets.

I expect TOCs track the amount of profit made by each ticket seller and base promotion decisions on it...

Did you leave out a smiley or a wink, mallard? As a humourous post it might just have worked!

 

[AlterEgo]

They probably think that if they refuse to sell an ALR you'll buy other tickets that will be more profitable for their employing TOC, e.g. TOC-only advance tickets.

I expect TOCs track the amount of profit made by each ticket seller and base promotion decisions on it...

Think you left out a smiley there.

 

[mallard]

Is this based on anything remotely veritable or just some dreamed up conspiracy? I can safely say that those doing it for a day job only care about selling the cheapest and simplest ticket for the customers requirements. I maintain my opinion the the refusal to issue any issuable ticket is more to do with a bad attitude than anything else.

Bad attitude basically permeates the entire passenger-facing side of the rail industry. There are a good number who are very good (mostly those who were trained by BR), but I'm not even sure they're the majority anymore.

I guess this is what you get when you put bus companies in charge.

 

[Greenback]

I don't usually defend privatisation but one of the benefits is that there's a lot less evidence of bad attitudes compared to BR days!

 

[RJ]

Bad attitude basically permeates the entire passenger-facing side of the rail industry. There are a good number who are very good (mostly those who were trained by BR), but I'm not even sure they're the majority anymore.

I guess this is what you get when you put bus companies in charge.

It's nothing to do with the company and all to do with the individual. An ar*ehole is an ar*e hole is an ar*ehole, regardless of the colour of the uniform. Contrary to common opinion from a certain demographic, railwaymen employed post 1996 do have a mind of their own.

 

[mallard]

It's nothing to do with the company and all to do with the individual. An ar*ehole is an ar*e hole is an ar*ehole, regardless of the colour of the uniform.

Oh, I agree. However, the fact that so many "ar*eholes" seem to last so long in employment in certain areas of the railways suggests it's more of a cultural issue than just a case of a few "bad apples".

 

[TUC]

I've bought an All-Line Rover without any difficulty from Thornaby-they are very much available from small stations.

 

[sheff1]

I don't usually defend privatisation but one of the benefits is that there's a lot less evidence of bad attitudes compared to BR days!

Your experiences clearly differ from mine. No one ever refused to sell me a ticket in BR days, even though for non local journeys it usually meant writing out a paper ticket. I have been refused many times post-privatisation at Sheffield alone.

I have, however, bought Rovers at various stations (even including Sheffield) in recent years without any problem. So it can't be too diffucult to do.

 

[Greenback]

Your experiences clearly differ from mine. No one ever refused to sell me a ticket in BR days, even though for non local journeys it usually meant writing out a paper ticket. I have been refused many times post-privatisation at Sheffield alone.

I have, however, bought Rovers at various stations (even including Sheffield) in recent years without any problem. So it can't be too diffucult to do.

I wasn't referring to booking clerks and tickets per se. I was making a general comment about all railway staff.

My earlie rpoint about APTIS was that it must be easier to issue rover tickets today. But, as RJ says, there are bad apples and poor staff attitudes in every wak of life, and from what I hear Sheffield station ha smore than it's share.