Unit numbers

[CumbrianSausag]

This will seem a ridiculous question for most but would appreciate the help. Have just got back into the scene after a 10 year absence and dismayed by the lack of locos have decided to go chasing units as well.

I've always ignored them, all my life I've blanked them but now times have changed. My stupid question is this......I've always been used to looking at the side of loco's to get the number and can't get used to chasing the sometimes ridiculously small numbers on the front, is there any relation between the leading coach number and the unit? For example, have just seen a 144 (I think) out of Leeds, couldn't see the front, the side number was 55618, how do I find the unit?

If there is a way does this always apply as can barely ever glance the numbers on Voyagers...

Any help would be much appreciated.

 

[Lampshade]

Don't read anything into the carriage numbers on Pacers.

Theoretically, the last two or three digits (depending on class) of the carriage number show which unit it is. You saw carriage 55618, therefore you'd expect the unit to be 144018 - but it's not, I have a picture of 144018 and it's 55xxx carriage is 55841.

Sprinters are easy, they have 2/3 carriages, a 52xxx, a 55xxx (in the case of 3-car 158s) and a 57xxx car. For example carriage 57468 is the DMSL of unit 156468.

 

[CumbrianSausag]

So the answer to my question is.. no. You have to get the front number?

 

[jopsuk]

Yes- it doesn't happen much, but carriages can be swapped between units- think this may have been more common with older generation units. Of course, there's those that take the numbers of carriages, coaching stock and freight wagons, but people that take any numbers (have to say, I'm not one) really shouldn't pass comment on this!

 

[Lampshade]

So the answer to my question is.. no. You have to get the front number?

Ideally yes, but on most units it can be deciphered using one of the carriage numbers.

 

[CumbrianSausag]

What about the newer Voyargers and Pendalino's, often find myself lineside as they hurtle by, do they tend to stay 'in set', the numbers on the Voyagers are tiny!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Ideally yes, but on most units it can be deciphered using one of the carriage numbers.

So what about my 144, if I'd got both numbers how do I know which is right?

Forgive my ignorance and thanks for the help!

 

[Lampshade]

So what about my 144, if I'd got both numbers how do I know which is right?

Forgive my ignorance and thanks for the help!

The front number. As I said don't read anything into the carriage numbers on 142s/143s and 144s, they have very little bearing on the actual unit number.

 

[driver9000]

The last two digits of a Voyager/Pendolino vehicle number are the same as the set number ie 69122 is from 390022. The vehicle numbers on Pacers (14x) bear no relation to the set number. Have a look at this website which details multiple unit formations:

www.thejunction.org.uk

 

[Dreadnought]

Don't read anything into the carriage numbers on Pacers.

Although there is no correlation between coach and unit number for pacers (also many EMUs are similar) they can still be vital when spotting as the number used will only relate to one unit!

All you need is a book which lists units and associated coach numbers.

BTW CumbrianSausag 55618 is from 142027.

 

[87019Chris]

This will seem a ridiculous question for most but would appreciate the help. Have just got back into the scene after a 10 year absence and dismayed by the lack of locos have decided to go chasing units as well.

I've always ignored them, all my life I've blanked them but now times have changed. My stupid question is this......I've always been used to looking at the side of loco's to get the number and can't get used to chasing the sometimes ridiculously small numbers on the front, is there any relation between the leading coach number and the unit? For example, have just seen a 144 (I think) out of Leeds, couldn't see the front, the side number was 55618, how do I find the unit?

If there is a way does this always apply as can barely ever glance the numbers on Voyagers...

Any help would be much appreciated.

I'm going to say the simplest thing possible for you, your best bet is to go down to whsmiths and get yourself the following three books; british railways pocket book No 1 Locomotives, british railways pocket book No3 DMUS & on-track machines, and british railways pocket book No 4 EMUS &light rail systmes. And books No 3&4 contian full set numbers so for example your 144 units side numbe of 55618 is in my book actually 142027 and I didn't even have to see it but that is how I do it if you can get a minimum of 2 side numbers incase of an odd set then your fine hope this helps allot

Chris

 

[hairyhandedfool]

What about the newer Voyargers and Pendalino's, often find myself lineside as they hurtle by, do they tend to stay 'in set', the numbers on the Voyagers are tiny!....

There are ways to identify most unit types by the coach numbers, Voyagers and Pendilinos are as follows:

220 = last two digits of coach number.
221 = last two digits of coach number add 50. (except 60994 (221142) and 60794 (221143)).
390 = last two digits of coach number.

 

[sprinterguy]

Sprinters are easy, they have 2/3 carriages, a 52xxx, a 55xxx (in the case of 3-car 158s) and a 57xxx car. For example carriage 57468 is the DMSL of unit 156468.

The centre car of a 158 is numbered 587XX, not 55XXX. The only Sprinter vehicles in the 55XXX series are the two prototype 150s.

As others have said, the carriage numbers on Sprinters make the unit easy to identify as each unit has a 52XXX carriage number and a 57XXX number, the last three digits of which correspond to the set number. The exceptions are the two prototype 150s, and the centre cars of 158s which having been split from their original sets and added to others in some instances are now all mixed up, plus they never quite matched up that obviously anyway.

There is one exception to this rule: The 159s, which still carry their originally allocated class 158 series carriage numbers before they were converted and renumbered as 159s.

Some Pacers do have a sort of recognisable scheme that links the carriage number to the unit number: For 142051 to 142096, one vehicle has a 557XX number which corresponds to the set number minus 50, and the other vehicle has a 557XX number corresponding to the set number minus four.

For the 144 units, one DMS vehicle of each unit is numbered up from 1 to 23 through the class, which corresponds to the unit number, and then goes back to the start for the second DMS vehicle of 144001 and counts upward from 24 to 46, essentially being the set number plus 23.

So overall, familiarisation with the Pacer numbering series is the only way to confidently identify them from their carriage numbers without resorting to the Platform Five DMU book, which I would say is an essential aid to identifying multiple units from carriage numbers.

With the vast majority of the class 170 and 171 Turbostars the last three digits of each carriage number is the same as the set number, just like the Sprinters.

On two carriage 175s (175/0s) the last two digits of each carriage number are the same as the set number, while on the three carriage units (175/1s) the last two digits of the carriage number equals the set number plus 50.

The last two digits of the carriage number on class 180 Adelantes are the same as the last two digits of the set number, and on the class 185 Desiros the last three digits of each carriage number correspond to the set number.

The Voyagers and Pendolinos have already been covered by other posters.

 

[driver9000]

For example carriage 57468 is the DMSL of unit 156468.

The 57 car is the DMS. The DMSL is the 52 car, the L standing for Lavatory. Just to add further confusion to the scheme class 156 vehicles are also designated 57 DMS(A) and 52 DMS(B).

 

[D6975]

There's a very useful website called The Junction
You'll find lists of all units and their side numbers there.

ps Locos are there too.

 

[driver9000]

There's a very useful website called The Junction
You'll find lists of all units and their side numbers there.

I have included a link to Thejunction in an earlier post - saves buying a Platform 5 book

 

[CumbrianSausag]

I have included a link to Thejunction in an earlier post - saves buying a Platform 5 book

Thanks for all your help people, it makes alot more sense now. That website seems to have all the answers!

cheers.

 

[strange6]

It's a pity that site isn't kept up-to-date now

 

[Techniquest]

Welcome back to the hobby, indeed welcome to the unit game!

Most things have been covered already, can't think of anything obvious that needs adding, although I will say that a copy of a Platform 5 book would be extremely useful. The NREA version is cheaper and covers most things (not track machines), £8.95 last time I looked for a book that covers locos, DMUs, EMUs and carriages. A lot cheaper than the Platform 5 equivilent (around £18 last time I looked)!

Hope you're making good progress so far, and again welcome from a fellow unit guy!