Upgrading a Standard Advance to a First Advance

Status
Not open for further replies.

Huntergreed

Established Member
Joined
16 Jan 2016
Messages
2,089
Location
Coach J Seat 39
I purchased a standard class advance ticket from Dumfries - Aberdeen (Dumfries - Carlisle with Scotrail, Carlisle - Haymarket with Avanti and Haymarket - Aberdeen with LNER) for Thursday 20th May.

I'm looking to upgrade this and I see that the 1st advance is a good price just now. Am I able to upgrade (for the difference in price between the two) a standard advance to a first advance or is this not possible?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

Bletchleyite

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Oct 2014
Messages
70,739
Location
"Marston Vale mafia"
AIUI yes this is done as a simple "change of journey" the same as changing the day/time, though I recall some TOCs (certainly XC) charge the tenner and some don't.
 

Huntergreed

Established Member
Joined
16 Jan 2016
Messages
2,089
Location
Coach J Seat 39
I’ve contacted both Avanti and LNER and both of them told me that this is not permitted and that I’ll simply need to upgrade to a 1st anytime single or purchase a new ticket valid in 1st class, is this true?
 

Haywain

Established Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
6,704
I’ve contacted both Avanti and LNER and both of them told me that this is not permitted and that I’ll simply need to upgrade to a 1st anytime single or purchase a new ticket valid in 1st class, is this true?
No.
 

alistairlees

Established Member
Joined
29 Dec 2016
Messages
2,706
Possibly a few things are getting confused in this thread

I think (and I am happy to be corrected):
- you can do a Change of Journey through the retailer from which you bought the ticket, before you travel, and this will mean that you can get a 1st Class Advance ticket for just the difference in price between the two tickets. So far as I can see the retailer is still entitled to charge you a £10 admin fee though
- you can do an upgrade at the station before you travel, and this will mean you will get a 1st Class Single (not Advance) for the difference in price between the two tickets, and no fee is payable
- you can do an upgrade on the train as you travel, in which case the full price of the 1st Class Single is payable (and the existing Advance cannot be used as credit towards it).
 

SickyNicky

Established Member
Joined
8 Sep 2010
Messages
2,647
Location
Ledbury
Like alistairlees, I don't recall a source that says fees should not be charged. I'm really happy to be corrected on that one though. I have no objection to waiving fees, but it'll need to go through the correct channels.
 

Haywain

Established Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
6,704
It's in Knowledgebase, under Excess Fare procedures for 'station ticket offices':
Advance (travelling on correct reserved train)Charge the difference between the fare already paid and the appropriate First Single fare for the journey. No fee is charged.
 

SickyNicky

Established Member
Joined
8 Sep 2010
Messages
2,647
Location
Ledbury
Ah - an excess fare rather than a change of advance. I shall have to seek authority to see if we can do a "change of advance" as a third party on the same terms.

Thanks Haywain.
 

Haywain

Established Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
6,704
Ah - an excess fare rather than a change of advance. I shall have to seek authority to see if we can do a "change of advance" as a third party on the same terms.

Thanks Haywain.
Sometimes, however, you can look to deeply into things! Elsewhere in Knowledgebase is the Advance tickets FAQs, where this can be found:
e.g.4: Change of class. A Standard Advance holder wishes to upgrade to First Class for the following day. First Advance is available. Charge the difference plus £10 fee.
In a station ticket office a change to an Advance ticket should be processed as an excess fare, whether on the day or a month ahead of travel. These instructions are obviously contradictory, leaving the matter as clear as mud!
 

janb

Member
Joined
16 Jul 2008
Messages
534
This is also in the FAQs to complement the above, for ticket offices, change on same train - no fee, change to a different train - £10 fee. That's what the various sections are trying to say, perhaps not well expressed.

Q: Can customers upgrade to First Class?

A: In most cases, yes. However;

1) Remember that changes to travel plans can only be done at a station before departure of the first booked train, so once on board, either the ticket is valid on that train, or it is not.

2) Where the customer joins the correct train and wishes to upgrade to First Class on board, or wishes to upgrade at a station beforehand between Standard and First Class on the correct train on which their Advance ticket has been reserved, this is not classed as a change of travel plans.



Weekdays: All TOCs allow upgrade to First Class in the above circumstances. As with other ticket types, charge the difference between the fare already paid and the appropriate First Single (dedicated or inter-available) fare for the journey. No £10 fee should be charged for doing this.
 

voyagerdude220

Established Member
Joined
13 Oct 2005
Messages
2,880
So to summarise (and double check I've understood the above correctly) :

If a person who currently holds a Standard Advance single wishes to upgrade it to a First Advance single at a ticket office, traveling on the same train they originally booked, they'd just be charged the difference between the two fares?

However if they wanted to both upgrade and change the time of travel, it would be £10 admin fee as well as the difference in price?
 

Haywain

Established Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
6,704
If a person who currently holds a Standard Advance single wishes to upgrade it to a First Advance single at a ticket office, traveling on the same train they originally booked, they'd just be charged the difference between the two fares?
Yes or, possibly, no, depending on interpretation of the rules around excess or change. I firmly believe that you shouldn't be charged an admin fee but as highlighted above it isn't as clear as it should be.
However if they wanted to both upgrade and change the time of travel, it would be £10 admin fee as well as the difference in price?
Definitely.
 

Bletchleyite

Veteran Member
Joined
20 Oct 2014
Messages
70,739
Location
"Marston Vale mafia"
Yes or, possibly, no, depending on interpretation of the rules around excess or change. I firmly believe that you shouldn't be charged an admin fee but as highlighted above it isn't as clear as it should be.

The way I read it seems to imply that the fee is not chargeable if excessing on the day (to a walk-up, effectively, though I guess it'd be endorsed to remain train-specific?) but it is if done in advance.

This is a bit silly, because the railway will lose, not gain, money from that, because people will be angered by it and not upgrade.
 

liam456

Member
Joined
6 May 2018
Messages
232
In future, wouldn’t it be best to purchase advance tickets from XC’s website, since they don’t charge the tenner? (If you didn’t split of course)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top