WCRC loses judicial review in High Court

[68000]

I can't imagine NR are happy with WCR about the reliability of the kit they are sending out for this and the contingencies

 

[12LDA28C]

I can't imagine NR are happy with WCR about the reliability of the kit they are sending out for this and the contingencies

Locos fail, it happens. If the 47 had been on the rear though, the outcome would most likely have been rather different.

 

[800001]

I can't imagine NR are happy with WCR about the reliability of the kit they are sending out for this and the contingencies

No different to a freight or passenger failing on mainline and nearest rescue loco being about 2 hours away.

When was the last time a steam train failed on the Mallaig line? It’s just unfortunate it happened on the day they restarted services.

 

[Brush 4]

Did it fail mechanically or just slip to a stand?

 

[12LDA28C]

Did it fail mechanically or just slip to a stand?

Slipped to a stand, hence why if the 47 had been left on the rear it could have assisted.

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Slipped to a stand, hence why if the 47 had been left on the rear it could have assisted.

Should it be regarded as an operator failure (not enough tread on the tyres so to speak) or an infrastructure failure (rails not degreased)? It is suggested that a MOM was on site putting sand down by hand (insert picture of Darjeeling Railway here, men sat on bufferbeam each side throwing sand) but that apparently didn't work.

I remember being on the Nightrider travelling south from Aberdeen many years ago, same thing happened with a 47 up front. Perhaps BR should have banned itself from the network for that!

 

[matchmaker]

Spotted this morning passing through Stirling. Two Black Fives, a rake of (mostly) WCRC aircon Mk2s with a few Mk1s, tailed by a WCRC 47.

 

[spyinthesky]

Spotted this morning passing through Stirling. Two Black Fives, a rake of (mostly) WCRC aircon Mk2s with a few Mk1s, tailed by a WCRC 47.

Looks like that is going to Kyle from Inverness tomorrow

Realtime Trains | 1Z37 0625 Inverness to Kyle of Lochalsh | 17/04/2024

Real-time train running information for 1Z37 0625 departure from Inverness to Kyle of Lochalsh on 17/04/2024. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

 

[12LDA28C]

Spotted this morning passing through Stirling. Two Black Fives, a rake of (mostly) WCRC aircon Mk2s with a few Mk1s, tailed by a WCRC 47.

That'll be the 1Z36 RTC Great Britain tour with 47802 on the rear.

 

[ejstubbs]

When was the last time a steam train failed on the Mallaig line?

Is the Jacobite the only steam-hauled train on the main line to run without a diesel on the back? Most off the videos I see of steam-hauled railtours seem to have one.

 

[Iskra]

Is the Jacobite the only steam-hauled train on the main line to run without a diesel on the back? Most off the videos I see of steam-hauled railtours seem to have one.

The NYMR don’t run with a diesel attached to Whitby. Most tours do have a diesel but it’s not mandated so it does happen occasionally

 

[12LDA28C]

Is the Jacobite the only steam-hauled train on the main line to run without a diesel on the back? Most off the videos I see of steam-hauled railtours seem to have one.

That's because the diesel is needed for train supply, ECS and shunt movements.

 

[mike57]

The NYMR don’t run with a diesel attached to Whitby.

But it wouldn't take long to summon rescue from Grosmont

 

[Greybeard33]

Slipped to a stand, hence why if the 47 had been left on the rear it could have assisted.

An extra vehicle would surely have made the train too long for the infrastructure, if it already consisted of the loco plus seven carriages?

 

[12LDA28C]

An extra vehicle would surely have made the train too long for the infrastructure, if it already consisted of the loco plus seven carriages?

The Statesman goes to Mallaig with load 9 and top-and-tail 47s so I don't think that's an issue.

 

[D6130]

An extra vehicle would surely have made the train too long for the infrastructure, if it already consisted of the loco plus seven carriages?

According to the TOPS consist quoted up thread the train already had eight vehicles....and nobody has yet worked out where the power supply for the air-con and CDL was coming from.

 

[Iskra]

The Statesman goes to Mallaig with load 9 and top-and-tail 47s so I don't think that's an issue.

That’s because with top and tail there’s no need for space for a loco run round, which is not possible if you want the same steam loco to work both ways by running around.

 

[renegademaster]

According to the TOPS consist quoted up thread the train already had eight vehicles....and nobody has yet worked out where the power supply for the air-con and CDL was coming from.

CDL could have be done off battery, air con very well could have not be on

 

[12LDA28C]

CDL could have be done off battery, air con very well could have not be on

Air con wouldn't have been on without an ETS-fitted loco in the consist

 

[Iskra]

But it wouldn't take long to summon rescue from Grosmont

It could do, because they only have one diesel loco available currently for the mainline and only a handful of steam locomotives that can do it, which may not be all in steam and if one has failed and your next nearest suitable loco is in Pickering, that’s still going to be a substantial wait. Plus, you’d also be then disrupting internal NYMR passengers and potentially Northern passengers and NYMR do operate a delay repay scheme so it could be costly.

 

[bleeder4]

Is the Jacobite the only steam-hauled train on the main line to run without a diesel on the back? Most off the videos I see of steam-hauled railtours seem to have one.

No, the Shakespeare Express between Birmingham and Stratford on Avon never runs with a diesel, apart from times of high fire risk during exceptionally hot days.

 

[Greybeard33]

That’s because with top and tail there’s no need for space for a loco run round, which is not possible if you want the same steam loco to work both ways by running around.

The Sectional Appendix shows a siding branching off the run around loop at Mallaig. Would it not be possible to uncouple the diesel and run it into that siding? Then bring it back out to couple on the other end after the steam loco has run around?

 

[Bertie the bus]

Slipped to a stand, hence why if the 47 had been left on the rear it could have assisted.

If the driver of the steam loco had to return to Fort William to fetch the rescue loco then all a loco on the rear would have done is add additional weight as it couldn't be used to assist if there was only 1 available driver.

 

[Iskra]

The Sectional Appendix shows a siding branching off the run around loop at Mallaig. Would it not be possible to uncouple the diesel and run it into that siding? Then bring it back out to couple on the other end after the steam loco has run around?

Possibly, but there may be further constraints with passing other services at loops to consider too. All in all, operational simplicity seems sensible.

 

[12LDA28C]

If the driver of the steam loco had to return to Fort William to fetch the rescue loco then all a loco on the rear would have done is add additional weight as it couldn't be used to assist if there was only 1 available driver.

It appears that the driver who was sent to fetch the rescue loco was travelling on the train, not driving the steam loco. I'm sure there's usually a minimum of two footplate crew on the steam loco anyway.

 

[Iskra]

A nice bit of bonus 37 haulage for those on board then

 

[Greybeard33]

Possibly, but there may be further constraints with passing other services at loops to consider too. All in all, operational simplicity seems sensible.

According to the SA, the Glenfinnan loop length is only 139m, so the Jacobite must foul the points in any case. Presumably it pulls forward once the ScotRail train is in the station and has relinquished the token.

The Arisaig loop is 180m, so the Jacobite cannot exceed this length if it has to pass the Statesman there and the latter is too long to fit in the loop, as stated in post #1215 above.

 

[Essan]

I think the Jacobite does somerimes run with a diesel on the rear at times of high fire risk.

Slightly OT but I remember in 1999 the Jacobite broke down in Lochailort - and a lot of the passengers descended on the pub for lunch.... Landlord was still hungover from the night before and none to pleased, but everyone else rallied round and everyone was happy in the end (I think the menu was fish & chips, fish & chips or fish & chips)

 

[6Gman]

Well you shouldn't laugh but in this case I think I will

The phrase "start as you mean to go on" comes to mind for some reason.

Naughty, I know.

 

[Bill57p9]

I have seen a photograph of the Jacobite crossing Glenfinnan Viaduct this afternoon. I don't have permission to share the photo however it clearly shows consist of 7 coaches mk2, mk1, mk2, mk1, mk2, mk1, mk2 with no generator van or second loco. I am very curious.