What could happen to the Class 144 "Evolution" unit?

[py_megapixel]

Does anyone know what is happening to 144012?
I assume it will be last to be withdrawn from Northern, being the only PRM-compliant Pacer, but has anything else been planned for it? When there are TOCs struggling to get their fleet PRM compliant well past the deadline, it seems an awful waste to simply scrap it immediately.

 

[DarloRich]

it will be scrapped if it doesn't get preserved surely

 

[Bletchleyite]

Does anyone know what is happening to 144012?
I assume it will be last to be withdrawn from Northern, being the only PRM-compliant Pacer, but has anything else been planned for it? When there are TOCs struggling to get their fleet PRM compliant well past the deadline, it seems an awful waste to simply scrap it.

Is there a low volume branch line that would be workable with one unit like that somewhere? They're not exactly hard to maintain and have a significant commonality of parts (for the driveline) with 15x. If it failed a 150 or 153 could presumably be subbed.

I'd say it'd be ideal for the Conwy Valley were it not for the steep curves where Pacers have got stuck before, and Ormskirk-Preston is no longer a single unit. Where is there a single-unit branch line on Northern territory now? Must be another one somewhere.

 

[DarloRich]

Is there a low volume branch line that would be workable with one unit like that somewhere? They're not exactly hard to maintain and have a significant commonality of parts (for the driveline) with 15x. If it failed a 150 or 153 could presumably be subbed.

I'd say it'd be ideal for the Conwy Valley were it not for the steep curves where Pacers have got stuck before, and Ormskirk-Preston is no longer a single unit. Where is there a single-unit branch line on Northern territory now? Must be another one somewhere.

I will have it down here on the Marston Vale - but it is too long at 3 cars i suspect!

 

[mervyn72]

Is there a low volume branch line that would be workable with one unit like that somewhere? They're not exactly hard to maintain and have a significant commonality of parts (for the driveline) with 15x. If it failed a 150 or 153 could presumably be subbed.

I'd say it'd be ideal for the Conwy Valley were it not for the steep curves where Pacers have got stuck before, and Ormskirk-Preston is no longer a single unit. Where is there a single-unit branch line on Northern territory now? Must be another one somewhere.

Morecambe to Lancaster would be suitable. Not sure if the crew out there sign 144 though

 

[Bletchleyite]

Morecambe to Lancaster would be suitable. Not sure if the crew out there sign 144 though

Didn't think of that one. Decouple it from the Leeds services and just have the one unit go back and forth on a half hourly service, with a couple of hour gaps for running to Heysham?

 

[johnnychips]

It is a grotty unit with damp stains coming through the cracks in the shiny white ceiling, the windows leak, the new seats are rock-hard and last time I was on it the toilet was broke. It needs to do a farewell trip from Keighley to Rotherham.

 

[43096]

I will have it down here on the Marston Vale - but it is too long at 3 cars i suspect!

It’s a 2-car......

 

[DarloRich]

It’s a 2-car......

is it?????? wow. Total brain fade. I have been on the thing often enough!

I would still be happy with a couple of pacers down here. I bet they are more reliable than the 230's

 

[43096]

Is there a low volume branch line that would be workable with one unit like that somewhere? They're not exactly hard to maintain and have a significant commonality of parts (for the driveline) with 15x. If it failed a 150 or 153 could presumably be subbed.

I'd say it'd be ideal for the Conwy Valley were it not for the steep curves where Pacers have got stuck before, and Ormskirk-Preston is no longer a single unit. Where is there a single-unit branch line on Northern territory now? Must be another one somewhere.

Micro fleet alert!

Given the OP is clearly not aware all Northern 14x units are out of service it is a somewhat pointless debate.

It’ll either be preserved - some rancid ironing boards on a pres line - or better would be an appointment with the cutter’s torch.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Micro fleet alert!

There are two branch lines at present with microfleets - Stourbridge Town and the Marston Vale. There's about to be another one - the Borderlands line.

They are not a problem in and of themselves in this sort of context.

 

[43096]

There are two branch lines at present with microfleets - Stourbridge Town and the Marston Vale. There's about to be another one - the Borderlands line.

They are not a problem in and of themselves in this sort of context.

Train maintenance is contracted out to a specialist in those cases, though. They are not part of a bigger fleet maintained by the TOC.

 

[py_megapixel]

Micro fleet alert!

Given the OP is clearly not aware all Northern 14x units are out of service it is a somewhat pointless debate.

Oops! I'm tired.
It hadn't clicked that the North was finally rid of their Pacers. Ah well, looks like this discussion was pretty pointless then.

 

[DB]

Train maintenance is contracted out to a specialist in those cases, though. They are not part of a bigger fleet maintained by the TOC.

Isn't the whole Stourbrige operation (maintenance and actual running of the service) cointracted out to a division of the company who built the units? It's a self-contained branch with its own maintenance shed, which is suitable for the needs of light rail vehicles - none of this would apply to an old and decrepit heavy-rail train.

Agree with the various negative comments above about the Pimped-up Pacer - it's thoroughly unpleasant and I can see no logic at all in anyone trying to use and maintain it as a micro-fleet of one unit.

 

[hacman]

I suppose there is every chance of one of the larger heritage railways being interested in it, as it would allow them to provide a PRM compliant offering. Whilst they are not under the same obligations as TOCs, having a modernised unit could be an asset.

That said, it will not find further use at Northern, and isn't so much a waste as it were, seeing as the project was done speculatively by the ROSCO to demonstrate options - such investments are part of their business model. As with all the ex-BR stock, the owners of this unit have had a superb return on their initial investment over the years.

 

[D365]

Also worth pointing out that aside from the aforementioned quality issues, I’ve read that 012 is not actually fully compliant...

 

[richard1976]

Would it be any good for the Cardiff bay line ?

 

[Zooty]

Morecambe to Lancaster would be suitable. Not sure if the crew out there sign 144 though

Apart from pacers can only just manage with a crush peak load. Plus you'd have to train crew from three depots. What's the point when there's a 156 available and allocated?

 

[D365]

Apart from pacers can only just manage with a crush peak load. Plus you'd have to train crew from three depots. What's the point when there's a 156 available and allocated?

That Class 144 unit is the latest RailUK “solution” looking for a problem!

 

[Bob Price]

Would it be any good for the Cardiff bay line ?

It's being converted to run tram trains and currently has a 153 which seems to cope. Not a bad idea on paper though.

 

[richard1976]

What about for Romford - Upminster line? (Yes I know it's ever head electronic)

 

[Energy]

It is probably going to storage or scrappers, no franchised or open access TOC will use it as the DfT are unlikely to approve any more operators to use pacers.

 

[43096]

What about for Romford - Upminster line? (Yes I know it's ever head electronic)

What about it?

 

[class26]

Oops! I'm tired.
It hadn't clicked that the North was finally rid of their Pacers. Ah well, looks like this discussion was pretty pointless then.

Still didn`t stop a labour MP on TV yesterday saying it was a disgrace that pacers were still running "all over the north"

 

[randyrippley]

Is there a low volume branch line that would be workable with one unit like that somewhere? They're not exactly hard to maintain and have a significant commonality of parts (for the driveline) with 15x. If it failed a 150 or 153 could presumably be subbed.

I'd say it'd be ideal for the Conwy Valley were it not for the steep curves where Pacers have got stuck before, and Ormskirk-Preston is no longer a single unit. Where is there a single-unit branch line on Northern territory now? Must be another one somewhere.

Dedicated Lancaster-Morecambe-Heysham shuttle?

 

[JonathanH]

Still didn`t stop a labour MP on TV yesterday saying it was a disgrace that pacers were still running "all over the north"

Isn't that because they think 150s, 153s, 155s and 156s (and maybe even 158s) are also 'pacers'?

Using 144012 wouldn't go down well with the people who think retaining any 2-car (or 1-car) unit from the 1980s, no matter how much work has been done on it, is not acceptable.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Dedicated Lancaster-Morecambe-Heysham shuttle?

That option is suggested above. I do think that would be a good idea, though maybe a couple of 3-car 230s in Tube layout (so there's a spare most of the time, and a second unit for the Heysham runs) would be better. I do think that service has more potential with a dedicated unit and strong "Bay Metro" type branding. The 144 would work, but it isn't exactly being talked up in this thread!

 

[61653 HTAFC]

A few have suggested this unit will be the last pacer in use on the national network due to its (partial) compliance with PRM. However as a non-standard unit with different maintenance and stabling requirements (tanking for example) I'd argue that it is less likely to return than any of its classmates.

It may get bought further down the line, but comments on this thread suggest that corners may have been cut during refurb, and as a result the quality, reliability and durability isn't great. A fair handful of 144s are already reserved for preservation, but 012 will probably be more expensive to buy, and definitely more expensive to run. Most preserved lines don't have toilet tanking facilities, I presume.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Still didn`t stop a labour MP on TV yesterday saying it was a disgrace that pacers were still running "all over the north"

Which Labour MP was this? (Not that there are that many left, mind!)

 

[DB]

A few have suggested this unit will be the last pacer in use on the national network due to its (partial) compliance with PRM. However as a non-standard unit with different maintenance and stabling requirements (tanking for example) I'd argue that it is less likely to return than any of its classmates.

It may get bought further down the line, but comments on this thread suggest that corners may have been cut during refurb, and as a result the quality, reliability and durability isn't great. A fair handful of 144s are already reserved for preservation, but 012 will probably be more expensive to buy, and definitely more expensive to run. Most preserved lines don't have toilet tanking facilities, I presume.

I would agree - and why would preserved railways want one with those awful ironing-board seats with no padding, and a complicated swing-door bog to maintain?

I really can't see any logic in all these arguments for using it somewhere as a one-off. What would be the point? It's been tarted up a bit but is still a decrepit Pacer, as a one-off there would be nothing the same to cover when it was unavailable, it would require specific crew training, and it would probably have to make long ECS movements for depot work - e.g. where would it go from Lancaster? Leeds? Allerton? Newton Heath? None of them are exactly nearby!