What defines a heritage railway (as opposed to a fairground ride)

[Ste37]

Hi all newbie on here.i was told by a miniature railway operator that if the railway only has one station it can be registered as either a railway or a fairground ride,if it has two or more stations it can only be registered as a railway.

 

[py_megapixel]

But a wristband is a form of railway ticketing.

What you mean is it is not a traditional form of railway ticketing. It seems you cant cope with that.

For what it's worth - in Vancouver, Canada, you can get "Compass wristbands" - a wristband version of their equivalent to Oyster cards. I believe they were so popular that the first production run of them ran out within a few days.

So yes, wristbands can be and are used as a valid format for "proper" railway ticketing - and passengers like them.

 

[xotGD]

For what it's worth - in Vancouver, Canada, you can get "Compass wristbands" - a wristband version of their equivalent to Oyster cards. I believe they were so popular that the first production run of them ran out within a few days.

So yes, wristbands can be and are used as a valid format for "proper" railway ticketing - and passengers like them.

So that is a smart wristband that stores your ticket.

Presumably they are the sort of wristband that comes on and off, rather than the permanent variety you get at Club Tropicana.

 

[Worf]

Doesn't the Welsh Highland Railway have slow acting sprung points on the loops? That is clearly not a fairground ride. I assume it has a light railway order.

Unfortunately, the WHR/FFR is being run just like a fairground ride at the moment. No travel between intermediate stations, just an "out and back" operation, complying with covid legislation that is no longer in force. No "proper" timetable with every train a "named train". Profitable, I expect, but hardly in the spirit of a "heritage railway". Only one train from Caernarfon a day. No buffet cars. Hardly what the generations of volunteers strived for.

 

[John Luxton]

Unfortunately, the WHR/FFR is being run just like a fairground ride at the moment. No travel between intermediate stations, just an "out and back" operation, complying with covid legislation that is no longer in force. No "proper" timetable with every train a "named train". Profitable, I expect, but hardly in the spirit of a "heritage railway". Only one train from Caernarfon a day. No buffet cars. Hardly what the generations of volunteers strived for.

Yes and that is why I have not yet visited this year. I did support the operation in 2020 and 2021 as what was offered was better than nothing and went quite a few times.

But Monday last week I arrived on the Conwy Valley line to see the booking office at Blaenau shuttered and a coating of rust on the rails at a time when the railway should be building up to high season it is just not acceptable.

As an FR and WHR life member to say I am angry would be an understatement. The railway should be providing a link between Conwy Valley and Cambrian Lines as it always advertised it did.

I hope by July common sense will have taken over but if not I will be cancelling my already booked accommodation for July 30/31 and will not be attending the WHR 100 weekend.

This is just NOT acceptable. Please I don't want to see defensive excuses.

 

[6Gman]

Is not the subject of this thread what defines a heritage railway as opposed to a fairground ride?

Fairgrounds do wristbands do they not?

I really can't see why my comment as caused such a stir. As I have said I am not against modern forms of ticketing be they mobile phone / Digi tickets or whatever but wristbands have fairground associations.

I really still can't see how people find exception to my comments I really thought most would agree.

Hospitals use wristbands.

Does that make a heritage railway a hospital?

If I was offered a wristband rather than a ticket (proper Edmondson please) I'd be slightly, slightly peeved.

But since on my rare visits to heritage railways I tend to find a loco carrying a name it didn't carry in service, hauling Mk I coaches in pseudo Big Four livery, and the Guard is wearing his personal LBSCR uniform . . .

(I exaggerate but few of our heritage railways seem at all authentic to me)

 

[gswindale]

We went to Studley Grange Butterfly World a few weeks back and got wristbands, so is that now a Fairground or Hospital or is the SVR now a Butterfly farm?

Makes it so much easier to show you've already paid than having to faff about finding your "proper" ticket that could be in your pocket or handbag or phone case.

My main concern would be as to how recyclable they are compared to the more traditional card/paper tickets.

 

[John Luxton]

Hospitals use wristbands.

Does that make a heritage railway a hospital?

If I was offered a wristband rather than a ticket (proper Edmondson please) I'd be slightly, slightly peeved.

But since on my rare visits to heritage railways I tend to find a loco carrying a name it didn't carry in service, hauling Mk I coaches in pseudo Big Four livery, and the Guard is wearing his personal LBSCR uniform . . .

(I exaggerate but few of our heritage railways seem at all authentic to me)

Not had much in the way of dealing with hospitals myself but as far as I am aware from relatives that have had to spend time in hospitals it is a different sort of wristband for patient ID.

I take your point that a visit to many a heritage line is something of a compromise - but the aim is to capture the sprit of times. Having you ticket be it Edmondson, Computer or even stored on your phone by a guard / TTI is still part of the experience. Hold your wrist up to display a band is "non railway". I have no issue with moving ticketing forward to allow for developments in technology providing it remains true to the normal railway environment.

 

[Llanigraham]

I take your point that a visit to many a heritage line is something of a compromise - but the aim is to capture the sprit of times. Having you ticket be it Edmondson, Computer or even stored on your phone by a guard / TTI is still part of the experience. Hold your wrist up to display a band is "non railway". I have no issue with moving ticketing forward to allow for developments in technology providing it remains true to the normal railway environment.

Is it? I suspect that only applies to the rivet counting "enthusiast"!
From my experience most customers on any heritage railway are tourists wanting a day out and they couldn't care less what form their ticket takes and don't even know what the "spirit of the times" is.

 

[Runningaround]

What do you want from a heritage line? The bigger more successful lines have to combine travel on an authentic train with modern booking systems and leave in the past the parts that don't matter like format of tickets. If you want to go full on heritage then pop up a cliff face and hack away at some slate as they weren't built for tourists in the first place but some have been a tourist attraction longer than serving a mine or quarry. They have taken ideas off successful amusement parks as that's what they basically are with some history thrown in for the parents.

Some lines seem to exist solely for the benefit of the operators(Who can't have a play on the fun jobs on the big operations) to have a go at playing with trains with nothing to do withy the history of the line, why have they brought in a load of pacers to run a mile up and down if it's anything other? The ''outsider normal tourist'' is seen as a hindrance needed to pay for it's running. And are inevitably a disappointment for anyone outside a niche enthusiast who won't keep you going unless they have deep pockets.

 

[Mike Machin]

With all this talk of tickets, I hadn’t realised that physical/printed tickets still existed. When my partner unexpectedly had to travel by train recently, whilst talking to her from home I purchased her ticket online, sent the QR code to her mobile and she used it to exit the station at the end of her journey.
Surely nobody would want the inconvenience of a paper ticket for anything nowadays would they?

 

[Dai Corner]

With all this talk of tickets, I hadn’t realised that physical/printed tickets still existed. When my partner unexpectedly had to travel by train recently, whilst talking to her from home I purchased her ticket online, sent the QR code to her mobile and she used it to exit the station at the end of her journey.
Surely nobody would want the inconvenience of a paper ticket for anything nowadays would they?

E-ticketing on the national network has been discussed at length in other threads but on a heritage railway a paper/card ticket is a (minor) part of the experience. Recently I booked online and at the ticket office my QR code was scanned and a card ticket issued.

 

[Worf]

With all this talk of tickets, I hadn’t realised that physical/printed tickets still existed. When my partner unexpectedly had to travel by train recently, whilst talking to her from home I purchased her ticket online, sent the QR code to her mobile and she used it to exit the station at the end of her journey.
Surely nobody would want the inconvenience of a paper ticket for anything nowadays would they?

Err. Yes

 

[AM9]

With all this talk of tickets, I hadn’t realised that physical/printed tickets still existed. When my partner unexpectedly had to travel by train recently, whilst talking to her from home I purchased her ticket online, sent the QR code to her mobile and she used it to exit the station at the end of her journey.
Surely nobody would want the inconvenience of a paper ticket for anything nowadays would they?

Well buying a ticket, putting it in a pocket/wallet/handbag is quite convenient, nothing needs batteries to do that and it is valuable proof of purchase. Then there's all the problems of optical scanned tickets anywhere on TfL and maybe other areas. Many people don't have smartphones or even a computer so what's inconvenient about a paper ticket?

 

[D6968]

Well buying a ticket, putting it in a pocket/wallet/handbag is quite convenient, nothing needs batteries to do that and it is valuable proof of purchase. Then there's all the problems of optical scanned tickets anywhere on TfL and maybe other areas. Many people don't have smartphones or even a computer so what's inconvenient about a paper ticket?

Absolutely this, my phones battery isn’t that good, a simple paper ticket isn’t going to need charging halfway through a long journey!

 

[Runningaround]

Well buying a ticket, putting it in a pocket/wallet/handbag is quite convenient, nothing needs batteries to do that and it is valuable proof of purchase. Then there's all the problems of optical scanned tickets anywhere on TfL and maybe other areas. Many people don't have smartphones or even a computer so what's inconvenient about a paper ticket?

Or issue a convenient weather proof, tear resistant wristband that not only is extremely handy but can be kept as momento. Come to think of it I don't know why it wasn't thought of sooner.

 

[eldomtom2]

You can keep paper tickets as a momento as well...

 

[xotGD]

You can keep paper tickets as a momento as well...

Then fetch them out of the drawer 10 years later and sell them!

 

[Llanigraham]

Then fetch them out of the drawer 10 years later and sell them!

Just as people do with concert and festival wrist bands.

 

[Paul Hitchcock]

Is it? I suspect that only applies to the rivet counting "enthusiast"!
From my experience most customers on any heritage railway are tourists wanting a day out and they couldn't care less what form their ticket takes and don't even know what the "spirit of the times" is.

Absolutely so.