What's going on on the North Warwick (Stratford-upon-Avon) line?

[Cherry_Picker]

Stratford upon Avon has been massively disrupted since Tuesday with signalling problems. Just glanced at the Twitter this morning and both LM and Chiltern say they anticipate problems to continue again today until end of service. At the moment it seems trains can make it to Stratford from Birmingham if they go via Shirley but are still unable to go via the single line between Hatton and Bearley Junction. It's better than it was a couple of days ago but it's still hugely disruptive. Anyone on here know what caused it and why it's taking so long to fix?

 

[Bald Rick]

Complete signalling system failure, with a difficult to identify fault.

 

[iainbhx]

The North Warks is basically operating an hourly service, although cancellations happen at a drop of a hat. There is rail-replacement from Shirley to Stratford, but first you have to get to Shirley and that is in the lap of NXWM who mainly honouring tickets. Commuters are wondering if the problems are all down the Stratford end, why the Whitlock's End terminators can't run.

 

[0B00]

Having provided buses vice trains since Tuesday afternoon, LM have now officially stated the above, due to a signalling problem.

One LM train per hour has ran each way albeit around 20 minutes late each trip, and no Chiltern service has ran to Stratford On Avon since Tuesday.

Buses arranged for the rest of the week.

Must be some serious signalling problem !

 

[djo]

Does anyone know what signaling system is on this line? Just trying to comprehend how a complete failure can happen.

Perhaps a data flaw or something in an upgrade? Or a hard to source component?

Thanks
David

 

[Philip Elliott]

Have they remembered to switch the power on....?

 

[Robson689]

Have they remembered to switch the power on....?

Cleaner probably pulled the plug out to use the vacuum!

 

[The Planner]

18 odd miles of cable to check and token working from Yardley Wood i had heard.

 

[iainbhx]

18 odd miles of cable to check and token working from Yardley Wood i had heard.

They have now completely pulled trains until further notice.

 

[causton]

Key number quoted being 36 hours to check the rest of the cable (from early this afternoon)... ouch.

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Key number quoted being 36 hours to check the rest of the cable (from early this afternoon)... ouch.

My sympathies to the commuters of south Birmingham - just how long does the journey now take at peak hour by replacement coach then NXWM No. 6 bus?

Let's move to around a dozen Regional Signalling Centres! When the WCML accident happened at Lambrigg / Grayrigg it knocked out the signalling for the Windermere branch (cables from Carlisle box severed) - a line unrelated to the incident from the public viewpoint. Similar problems with the recent Dawlish Sea Wall collapse.

At least if a lever framed box burns down you can lock out a short section or install some men with flags!

What future when the whole network is controlled from a dozen locations and an incident happens at one of those locations - as it inevitably will? Just abandon all trains over a large part of the network for a few days?

I note LM website has two conflicting messages about what services are / aren't operating (journey check pages), whilst NRES is as vague and unhelpful as ever and conflicts with both of the former.

No advice on what tomorrow may bring.

Interestingly, RTT shows trains as having run today.

 

[Bald Rick]

My sympathies to the commuters of south Birmingham - just how long does the journey now take at peak hour by replacement coach then NXWM No. 6 bus?

Let's move to around a dozen Regional Signalling Centres! When the WCML accident happened at Lambrigg / Grayrigg it knocked out the signalling for the Windermere branch (cables from Carlisle box severed) - a line unrelated to the incident from the public viewpoint. Similar problems with the recent Dawlish Sea Wall collapse.

At least if a lever framed box burns down you can lock out a short section or install some men with flags!

What future when the whole network is controlled from a dozen locations and an incident happens at one of those locations - as it inevitably will? Just abandon all trains over a large part of the network for a few days?

I note LM website has two conflicting messages about what services are / aren't operating (journey check pages), whilst NRES is as vague and unhelpful as ever and conflicts with both of the former.

No advice on what tomorrow may bring.

Interestingly, RTT shows trains as having run today.

Trains have run today. By using "men with flags" (Temporary Block Working).

First time I have ever known a complete SSI comms failure for this long due to a fault. Very unusual.

 

[causton]

Well, I am currently working in Central Birmingham (last day tomorrow) and one colleague who lives in Stratford-upon-Avon had to leave before 6am to catch a bus to Redditch and get the train in from there, as that was the quickest way apparently! This is for an 8:30 start!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Trains have run today. By using "men with flags" (Temporary Block Working).

First time I have ever known a complete SSI comms failure for this long due to a fault. Very unusual.

The thing is, Network Rail still have some 'men' with flags, sufficient to deal with localised incidents such as this. Once the number of signal boxes (and therefore trained signalling and maintenance staff) is significantly reduced there will not be sufficient staff with the appropriate knowledge to go out there and provide an interim solution (such as is happening today). I can't see many software engineers being willing to stand lineside for 8 hour shifts, even if they had red-zone certification.

I'm sure Network Rail have a contingency plan and all potential incidents have been modelled, exercised and refined. But, like the Breckland Line, a lot of faith is being put on the technological solution and galloping at full speed towards that solution.

Is the back-up plan a reserve fleet of step entrance ex public service buses (available come January 1st) - parked up alongside the strategic reserve of steam locos inside Woodhead Tunnel (or wherever)

 

[Trainfan344]

Twitter has confirmed the disruption will affect trains today.

 

[High Dyke]

Complete signalling system failure, with a difficult to identify fault.

Hmmm. I understand that rodent damage has been identified in one location on the route. Unless there is significantly more cable damage along other parts of the line it does seem protracted to effect repairs or replacement of the cable.

 

[Robertj21a]

Well, I am currently working in Central Birmingham (last day tomorrow) and one colleague who lives in Stratford-upon-Avon had to leave before 6am to catch a bus to Redditch and get the train in from there, as that was the quickest way apparently! This is for an 8:30 start!

Tell him to catch the X20 express bus from Stratford direct to Birmingham.

 

[edwin_m]

Modern signalling normally has diverse routeing of cables so a single failure should only affect a small number of devices nearby. Possibly a case of the second route being affected before someone got round to fixing a fault in the first one?

 

[dysonsphere]

I guess we will see more of this as everything is centralized in a few centres, remember if it can go wrong it will. Are they having back up gennys or hoping 2 seperate grid feeds will be ok, because if its gennys you need a twin setup feeding a common busbar to be sure.

 

[Elecman]

The 2ROCS that I have dealt with have 2 diverse DNO supplies a standby Generator and a connection for a mobile generator, they are also looking at a Traction Supply feeder as well.

 

[L&Y Robert]

Hmmm. I understand that rodent damage has been identified in one location on the route. Unless there is significantly more cable damage along other parts of the line it does seem protracted to effect repairs or replacement of the cable.

They weren't two legged rodents, were they?

 

[iainbhx]

Now reported as fixed, thank goodness, as an Spring Road-Crewe commuter, it wasn't an enjoyable week.

 

[Cherry_Picker]

At the risk of sounding flippant, did you not just walk to Tyseley or Acocks Green and get the train from one of those places instead? I'll admit I'd not noticed how severe the knock on effects for other local trains in Birmingham have been but Spring Road is definitely a place where you have options.

 

[iainbhx]

At the risk of sounding flippant, did you not just walk to Tyseley or Acocks Green and get the train from one of those places instead? I'll admit I'd not noticed how severe the knock on effects for other local trains in Birmingham have been but Spring Road is definitely a place where you have options.

On the Tuesday the knock-ons were horrific, not so bad on the Wednesday and yesterday. Didn't notice on Thursday, made the 18:31 with about 20 seconds to spare.

Tyseley is a little too far, 25-30 mins walk, may as well get the bus.

For Acocks Green, the timings going out aren't right, the 06:21 gets me on the same train as the 06:23 bus and the bus goes from outside my house rather than a 15 minute walk. That 06:21 to 07:07 gap is just annoying. The 06:39 from Spring Road is just perfect.

I did return to Acocks Green - one gripper let me off, the other gripper sold me a Tyseley-Acocks Green single.

The main probably I had was the lack of communication about cancellations, conflicting information between the website and the phone app and LM cancelling the 06:39 very late (as in after 06:30) on Thursday and Friday.

 

[The Planner]

Failure of the data links in the SSI and took considerable time to determine and fix. 8273 minutes delay, 75 cancellations, 248 part cancellations, 796 trains delayed as part of the incident.

 

[reb0118]

They weren't two legged rodents, were they?

Latro Dacio perchance?

 

[hassaanhc]

These issues continue. Current message on LM website:

Due to ongoing problems with Network Rail signalling equipment on the Snow Hill lines, it is with regret that London Midland will be unable to run services between Shirley and Stratford-upon-Avon from the start of service on Monday 1 December until further notice.

Replacement bus services will be in operation for passengers travelling between Shirley and Stratford-upon-Avon in both directions. Departure times for the replacement bus services mirror the train timetable.

An hourly train service will run between Stourbridge Junction (via Birmingham Snow Hill) and Stratford-upon-Avon in both directions throughout the day. However, there will be changes to calling patterns, so please check before you travel.

Passengers travelling to/from Shirley, Yardley Wood, Hall Green, Spring Road, Tyseley and Small Heath are advised that ticket acceptance has been arranged with National Express West Midlands on the following bus services: 1, 3, 6, 8a, 8c, 11a, 11c, 31, 37, 59 and 76.

In addition to the above routes, tickets will also be accepted on the 49 route between Shirley and Solihull. Trains will be running between Solihull and Birmingham Snow Hill.

Passengers are advised to check journey planning information for updates before they travel.

London Midland apologises for the inconvenience this will cause and thanks you for your ongoing patience while this problem is resolved.