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Why do passenger coaches in former Soviet republics have corrugated sides?

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Drsatan

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Good evening,

As the thread title suggests, passenger coaches in former Soviet republics (Russia, Ukraine, Latvia, Kazhakstan etc) as well as a few states allied to the USSR at one point or another (China, North Korea, Mongolia) have corrugated body sides, such as this

Was there any particular reason this template was adopted?

Thanks in advance
 
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Doppelganger

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It's not just former Soviet republics, the Amfleet trains in the US also have this feature and I'm sure there are plenty of other examples.
 

StephenHunter

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I think it's to strengthen the sides of the carriages due to the vastly varying temperatures in the former Soviet Union that you could encounter even on an overnight trip. Swedish carriages historically have that too.
 

edwin_m

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It's typical of stainless steel stock, such as that produced by the former Soreframe company in Portugal as well as many in North America. I speculate that this material allowed use of thinner skins, and the corrugation was to stiffen them.
 

John-H

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It's typical of stainless steel stock, such as that produced by the former Soreframe company in Portugal as well as many in North America. I speculate that this material allowed use of thinner skins, and the corrugation was to stiffen them.
In the North American case, the stainless steel cars built by Budd were built using a resistance welding technique, and I was told the resulting unevenness was less obvious in the corrugated sides.
 

edwin_m

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In the North American case, the stainless steel cars built by Budd were built using a resistance welding technique, and I was told the resulting unevenness was less obvious in the corrugated sides.
Thanks for this - anyone know if this applies to the European examples too? According to Wikipedia, Budd built the Pioneer Zephyr using corrugated stainless steel in 1934, which was probably before anyone else, and the other suppliers might have licensed or copied the technique.
 

Sm5

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Strength, wouldnt this be why we built tin huts in ww2 as well.

its lighter than its strengthened alternatives
 

Beebman

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duesselmartin

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Germany tried them in various stock in the 1970s.

In Ireland class 201 locos also have it.

In Sweden the X2000 sets.

Also DB locos class 143 and 189 has it.
One advantage is strenghtening light material.
 

XAM2175

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Commonwealth Engineering (Comeng) in Australia also licensed Budd's corrugated stainless steel technique and employed it with considerable success across all sorts of stock:

 

Taunton

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Budd was a US company, from Philadelphia, whose principal market had been making bodies for cars, in the times when the USA had a good number of manufacturers. Not a traditional builder of rolling stock at all until the 1930s, they devised, and patented (which they jealously protected), a stainless steel welding process, called "shotwelding". Anyone who has ever worked with welding stainless will know what a challenge it is to avoid distortion; when I supervised (though not did) it many years ago, welders were paid a premium per hour for working on stainless. It gave a range of construction benefits for weight reduction, corrosion protection, lowered centre of gravity, no need for painting, etc. There are, of course, downsides, such as initial cost, difficulty of repair - and the need to keep it polished.

USA railway passenger cars had traditionally been astoundingly heavy once steel construction came along, up to 100 tons each. When the first, inevitably underpowered, diesels like the Zephyr came along, weight reduction was important. Notably pre-stainless cars were commonly known as "Heavyweights" and Budd stainless ones as "Lightweights", although other builders developed cars called lightweight using regular steel. Later, comparable benefits were derived using aluminium instead of stainless.

Corrugation, or "ribbing", is one way to give additional longitudinal strength, even with regular steel. Of course, it has been used in Britain - the roofs of Mk 3 stock are an obvious example
 

Taunton

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No, and the USSR never used stainless. It's standard steel construction, ribbed for strength like Mk3 roofs. They even did it on Metro cars. Notably the original Moscow Metro cars DID have a US background; they were built to the drawings St Louis Car provided them with free, from the New York IND cars they had built in the 1930s (dimensions and layout were identical), but one of the changes the Soviets made was to use corrugation for strength, and thinner gauge steel.
 

leytongabriel

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Weren't the 'petit gris' SNCF electric surburban units built like this too? Light for reduced power consumption.
 

randyrippley

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I'm guessing, but soviet steel production never matched demand.
Corrugating would have reduced the demand
 

D6130

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Some types of Italian electric locos also have ribbed steel sides for extra strength....including classes E402b/403/412 and 464.
 

Peter Mugridge

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Weren't the 'petit gris' SNCF electric surburban units built like this too? Light for reduced power consumption.
You are correct - a whole generation of several classes had this style. Here is Z5165 at Paris Montparnasse at 19.21 on 6th July 1992.
 

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Taunton

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Budd licensed their technique to builders in France, Portugal and Australia, though I believe the large 1952 Canadian Pacific fleet were actually exports from Philadelphia, (unusually) not built in Canada. These vehicles are still in transcontinental use there, 70 years on, while the one large batch that Budd built in 1964 for the New York Subway were only finally withdrawn earlier this year, again after nearly 60 years of use. The Canadian ones are most impressive, because not until the 1990s were they converted from steam to electric heating/air-con, and thus ran with all the corrosion-inducing aspects of internal steam leaks for their first 40 years.

Recent pictures of both:


 

Gag Halfrunt

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Notably the original Moscow Metro cars DID have a US background; they were built to the drawings St Louis Car provided them with free, from the New York IND cars they had built in the 1930s (dimensions and layout were identical), but one of the changes the Soviets made was to use corrugation for strength, and thinner gauge steel.

The original type A Moscow Metro trains did not have corrugated sides. The type E from 1959 was the first to have them.
 

MarcVD

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Also to Belgium.
 
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