Wifi on trains?

[jon0844]

That was I was meaning the 'essentials' plans prohibit it and it's only allowed on the 'advanced' plans, while even if you get the advanced plan with unlimited data there is a limit on how much you are allowed to use while tethering.

The essentials plans are poor value IMO (often deals on the normal ones make them no cheaper) and with no feel at home, anyone who travels wouldn't take that plan anyway.

It is worth noting that Three does throttle services much like train Wi-Fi, and video streaming and VPN use is actually stated as being unusable. Not that there aren't ways go bypass their controls!

 

[northwichcat]

The essentials plans are poor value IMO (often deals on the normal ones make them no cheaper) and with no feel at home, anyone who travels wouldn't take that plan anyway.

If you're abroad for one week per year how much data costs while you are abroad probably isn't a big factor in deciding which deal to get.

 

[jon0844]

If you're abroad for one week per year how much data costs while you are abroad probably isn't a big factor in deciding which deal to get.

That's why I guess it's good to have a choice, but I don't see them as good value because Three so often does better deals on the normal plans.

I suspect a lot is for marketing reasons. A way to upsell the full plans, perhaps even at the same price, so the customer goes away feeling happier.

It's a shame Three introduced them because with the 'make it right' campaign, it has come up with new plans that removed what was previously offered to all (Feel at Home), U-turned on not increasing bills in line with inflation, axed old tariffs and tried to double monthly bills by migrating people from a £15/m plan to £30/m - amongst other things.

(Off topic) A network that is desperately trying to make money (under great pressure from its financial backer) and has a rather unknown future after the O2 buyout wasn't allowed. Throw in a lack of spectrum that's affecting performance in congested areas, and .. well - not really relevant here perhaps.

Ultimately, I think a lot of people are now getting inclusive data when roaming both here and on networks abroad. So I still think that in most cases, you're better off using your own data connection. I realise this doesn't apply to all, but train Wi-Fi has always presented me with issues and thoughts of 'why did I bother?' when I invariably end up disconnecting and going back to 3G/4G.

 

[northwichcat]

(Off topic) A network that is desperately trying to make money (under great pressure from its financial backer) and has a rather unknown future after the O2 buyout wasn't allowed. Throw in a lack of spectrum that's affecting performance in congested areas, and .. well - not really relevant here perhaps.

In my area Three used to give the fastest data connection, now EE and Vodafone are faster. However, O2 are the slowest by a long way so a Three/O2 merger could have meant O2 customers in the area got a decent data connection.

 

[jon0844]

In my area Three used to give the fastest data connection, now EE and Vodafone are faster. However, O2 are the slowest by a long way so a Three/O2 merger could have meant O2 customers in the area got a decent data connection.

Three and O2 each lack spectrum so there wouldn't have been much difference unless they bid for more spectrum. Or refarm 3G to 4G, which they will both do (likewise EE and Vodafone).

 

[HowardGWR]

I haven't a clue what either of you are talking about. All a normal passenger wants to get on a train, or the station while he is waiting, is the ability to do normal internet searches, plus transact business, such as booking a hotel, and so on, this as part of a free WIFI service.

 

[jon0844]

That's fine. But if they want to watch iPlayer or YouTube, or screen share with another computer, expect to be disappointed.

Airlines and Virgin/Eurostar are realising the limitations with the external connectivity and opting to serve film and TV locally.

 

[HowardGWR]

That's fine. But if they want to watch iPlayer or YouTube, or screen share with another computer, expect to be disappointed.

Airlines and Virgin/Eurostar are realising the limitations with the external connectivity and opting to serve film and TV locally.

That seems sensible. May I assume it is possible that the TOC can programme its wifi package to prevent overloading requests, such as Youtube, within the software?

 

[jon0844]

That seems sensible. May I assume it is possible that the TOC can programme its wifi package to prevent overloading requests, such as Youtube, within the software?

Yes, the service can restrict any services or just impose a hard cap on speed to better share resources (effectively blocking data heavy services).

The problem then is that it doesn't become useful for much more than letting people update social media, and first class users would be unable to do much productive work (VPN connection to office, Dropbox, sending emails with large attachments etc).

4G/4.5G and then 5G will up speeds, but we've got a way to go. Think of everyone using their own connection, on one of four networks, and then all those users trying to use one single connection (or maybe a few that are amalgamated) over Wi-Fi.

It just isn't going to offer what people want, especially if free for all.

 

[northwichcat]

Yes, the service can restrict any services or just impose a hard cap on speed to better share resources (effectively blocking data heavy services).

The problem then is that it doesn't become useful for much more than letting people update social media, and first class users would be unable to do much productive work (VPN connection to office, Dropbox, sending emails with large attachments etc).

4G/4.5G and then 5G will up speeds, but we've got a way to go. Think of everyone using their own connection, on one of four networks, and then all those users trying to use one single connection (or maybe a few that are amalgamated) over Wi-Fi.

It just isn't going to offer what people want, especially if free for all.

Presumably that's why train operators like First are installing on board media servers so you can watch a selection of films and TV programs on board without needing to use the Internet. Although, hopefully they don't do like some airlines and only let you access the media server if you download their app.

 

[jon0844]

Presumably that's why train operators like First are installing on board media servers so you can watch a selection of films and TV programs on board without needing to use the Internet. Although, hopefully they don't do like some airlines and only let you access the media server if you download their app.

Yes, and I think you do need an app. Presumably various DRM issues for one.

 

[HowardGWR]

Yes, the service can restrict any services or just impose a hard cap on speed to better share resources (effectively blocking data heavy services).

The problem then is that it doesn't become useful for much more than letting people update social media, and first class users would be unable to do much productive work (VPN connection to office, Dropbox, sending emails with large attachments etc).

4G/4.5G and then 5G will up speeds, but we've got a way to go. Think of everyone using their own connection, on one of four networks, and then all those users trying to use one single connection (or maybe a few that are amalgamated) over Wi-Fi.

It just isn't going to offer what people want, especially if free for all.

Thank you for that information. I am probably out of date now, but I would have thought that most people who want to work on a file or files would have it or them already in their computer. A two hour journey, say, would keep one busy remotely, before uploading one's amendments or comments file back to the host. I suppose it depends on the kind of work one is engaged upon.

 

[jon0844]

I would keep files 'saved' for offline use but they're always synced in the cloud at the first available opportunity.

I work on the basis that if I went out today with my laptop and phone, and lost either or both for any reason, none of my data would be lost.

Many people do now collaborate on documents and work on the same file simultaneously. Then you need a fairly good connection, ideally low latency, if you want fluid working.

It's one thing you might reasonably expect someone travelling first class to want to do, in order to remain virtually as productive as being in an office. I am not sure we can quite provide that, but I think we can eventually - through improved 4G coverage on rail routes.