Would it be feasible for Transport for London to automate bus stop closure announcements on buses?

[infobleep]

Would it be feasible for Transport for London to automate bus stop closure announcements on buses? Could they make use of bus on board GPS for this?

Today I was on a K3 buys and two bus stops were closed due to roadworks. We weren't made aware of this, as frequently happens on buses, and the next bus stop where the bus did stop was an 11 minute walk away.

Passengers can of course join the next bus in the opposite direction, providing they aren't at the end of the bus hopper allowance. However, it would be far easier if they knew in advance not to proceed further and alight at the previous bus stop.

I don't know if bus stop closures can be feed to the online live departure boards, including those apps have, to alert people to closures. That would be helpful too.

Maybe the Internet of things and 5G may help once it's implemented across London. Obviously it might not work on rural buses, such as the 465 Kingston to Dorking.

For info the Internet of Things is whereby there are sensor in public to gather information and provide more accurate information. Speed of road traffic and delays for example might be one possible use.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I don't think iBus can do that, but I see no reason why a generic IT system couldn't do that. Somewhere TfL will have a list of closed bus stops. You just need to tie the two up.

 

[ANDREW_D_WEBB]

It’s a pity that it seems so difficult to just place a “dolly stop” close to the closed stop and allow passengers to use that

 

[Bletchleyite]

It’s a pity that it seems so difficult to just place a “dolly stop” close to the closed stop and allow passengers to use that

They often do, but it isn't always workable.

 

[Hophead]

I've certainly heard an automated "the next stop is closed" announcement, though these might be more useful in advance of leaving the stop before (though that complicates the announcement just a bit). It's possible that, in your case, these were short-notice works and TfL were not notified in time to sort out the iBus system.

 

[matt_world2004]

Believe it or not. There is not a centrally defined list of closed stops at Tfl. Its a combonation of notice of events posting which will be when there is advanced notice off a stop closure. For unplanned it goes onto an internal centrecomm website which can be accessed by the operators. For long term closures this is dealt with as a service change briefing to the operator . The problem is these defintions can be quite fluid and there is no consistency to how the information is relayed

Roadworks for a week may get a service change briefing. Or a notice of events posting

A protest may get a notice of events or a centrecomm report.

This is why diversions on London buses can be quite haphazard with different buses on the same route taking a slightly different diversion. Service change briefings detail the exact stops that are closed. Notice of events and centrecomm briefings dont always.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've certainly heard an automated "the next stop is closed" announcement, though these might be more useful in advance of leaving the stop before (though that complicates the announcement just a bit). It's possible that, in your case, these were short-notice works and TfL were not notified in time to sort out the iBus system.

I believe the driver presses a button to issue that announcement.

 

[matt_world2004]

I believe the driver presses a button to issue that announcement.

Some are automated and programmed. In by Ibus. If you are consistently getting the message the next stop is closed then it is likely that message has been programmed in. For most diversions/stop closures that require a service change briefing these will be programmed into Ibus. For those that are as part of an NOE these will be a mixture of manual and programmed(depending on how much notice of the NOE there is) and manual would be for any unplanned closures.

 

[infobleep]

I believe the driver presses a button to issue that announcement.

Some press the button but others don't. It's hit and miss to say the least but perhaps it relies on the drivers remembering which stops are closed.

Edit: actually scrap that. Perhaps is whether it's automated or not and that bit is hit and miss.

Today's closures didn't look sudden but they could have been.

 

[PeterC]

I have certainly heard notices that the bus will be diverted as well as the next stop closed.

The OP should try catching a bus in Bucks. Quite often first information that a driver has about a road closure is finding a "Road Closed" sign in front of him.

 

[Deerfold]

The iBus system needs diversions and stop closures to be entered manually. I believe the current policy is that this is only done for proposed changes of 6 weeks or more - there's a lot fewer staff doing these jobs than there used to be.

 

[infobleep]

The iBus system needs diversions and stop closures to be entered manually. I believe the current policy is that this is only done for proposed changes of 6 weeks or more - there's a lot fewer staff doing these jobs than there used to be.

It that partly due to the fares freeze?

It's interesting how they can afford for people to put up notices at bus stops For example planned diversions or bus stop closures.

The government would like to do more in terms of monitoring traffic and offering more advice to motorists about disruption and avoiding it.

However everything requires someone to programme it or input it. Not enough people to do the work then it went happen or will but maybe years after it otherwise could.

There is that phrase, Rolls-Royce ideas on a push bike income.

 

[Deerfold]

It that partly due to the fares freeze?

It's interesting how they can afford for people to put up notices at bus stops For example planned diversions or bus stop closures.

The government would like to do more in terms of monitoring traffic and offering more advice to motorists about disruption and avoiding it.

However everything requires someone to programme it or input it. Not enough people to do the work then it went happen or will but maybe years after it otherwise could.

There is that phrase, Rolls-Royce ideas on a push bike income.

The main problem is the loss of the former direct grant from Central Government (cut in stages from £700 million pa). The fares freeze won't have helped. Nor will the DoT not paying anything towards repairing roads in London.

I believe Countdown signs at many stops are now being removed as the 10-year maintenance contracts end. They were for approximately £10,000 each for 10 years.

 

[infobleep]

The main problem is the loss of the former direct grant from Central Government (cut in stages from £700 million pa). The fares freeze won't have helped. Nor will the DoT not paying anything towards repairing roads in London.

I believe Countdown signs at many stops are now being removed as the 10-year maintenance contracts end. They were for approximately £10,000 each for 10 years.

How interesting. I wonder how much it will cost to remove them and what will happen to them? Be recycled?

I'd forgotten that TfL are affected by cuts in gocernemrn funding, just like all local authorities were.

 

[Deerfold]

How interesting. I wonder how much it will cost to remove them and what will happen to them? Be recycled?

I'd forgotten that TfL are affected by cuts in gocernemrn funding, just like all local authorities were.

I'm not sure. They're not actually owned by TfL. When the contracts were put in place, I suspect the only expected options at the end of the contracts were extension or replacement.

 

[matt_world2004]

I believe tfl want to move to a System where standard tv screens will show a webpage with the bus stop countdowns are shown on the screen. These screens will be in businesses, hospitals and rail stations with the shortfall being made up by legacy countdown screens

 

[Deerfold]

I believe tfl want to move to a System where standard tv screens will show a webpage with the bus stop countdowns are shown on the screen. These screens will be in businesses, hospitals and rail stations with the shortfall being made up by legacy countdown screens

They've been promoting those for around 8 years now.
They were usually keen for them to be paid for by the institution where they were sited.
They are a lot cheaper than the Countdown screens.

 

[Be3G]

It’s a pity that it seems so difficult to just place a “dolly stop” close to the closed stop and allow passengers to use that

They often do, but it isn't always workable.

I've been thinking the same as ANDREW_D_WEBB: I remember years ago seeing those temporary stops all the time, but these days the only times I see them are to replace a traditional bus stop pole in a normal bus stop's location. I was on a bus recently where a stop was closed and it was quite a distance to the next stop with plenty of prime locations between for a temporary stop – but TfL didn't bother, and it got me pondering this subject because it's a situation I've witnessed countless times out here in outer London where the gaps between stops can be long. I do wonder how hard it really can be; what policy change has resulted in much-reduced use of the temporary stops?

 

[infobleep]

I've been thinking the same as ANDREW_D_WEBB: I remember years ago seeing those temporary stops all the time, but these days the only times I see them are to replace a traditional bus stop pole in a normal bus stop's location. I was on a bus recently where a stop was closed and it was quite a distance to the next stop with plenty of prime locations between for a temporary stop – but TfL didn't bother, and it got me pondering this subject because it's a situation I've witnessed countless times out here in outer London where the gaps between stops can be long. I do wonder how hard it really can be; what policy change has resulted in much-reduced use of the temporary stops?

Interestingly when there was roadworks outside the Kingston University earlier this year, they did have a temporary bus stop further down the road.

However last week when the same bus stop was closed, nothing.

I don't know if there is a set number of days the roadworks need to be active for a temporary bus stop to be added or whether in this case a temporary stop was considered too close to road works on the opposite side of the road.

Someone is putting up closer notices at the bus stops themsleves.

Needless to say I didn't know the bus stop was closed so had to run to the next one to ensure I caught a bus and got the train. By which point I probably done a third of the journey on foot.