Arriva using minibuses in Hemel Hampstead

[spuddie]

It appears this week that Arriva Hemel have converted services 3, 4 and 5 to minibus services using new Mercedes minibuses to a higher frequency. I don't know how many there are but the lowest fleetnumber I've seen so far is 1005 and the highest is 1017.

They certainly seem to be noticable as a couple of people in the office who wouldn't normally be interested in transport have mentioned them and walking past a couple of bus stops in the town earlier passengers were certainly talking about them.

Will be interesting to see how they get on but I've already noticed some bunching up on the 3 but that's also common with the B7's on the 2.

 

[alex397]

Well, Twitter user 'Bus and Train User', aka Roger French, former MD of Brighton & Hove, is not impressed.

Unlike in Ashford, the frequencies have not been radically increased - instead the routes are at a similar frequency, which can be problematic on busy jourrneys. Also, one of the Mercedes buses has all-over contravision for advertising, meaning it literally looks like a van with a destination display - hardly going to encourage passengers, especially giving a horrible view from the windows. When i've travelled on vehicles with all-over contravision, I can't look out the window otherwise I get a headache.

Worth noting that they are using the Mercedes Benz City 45 vehicles, the same as Stagecoach are using in Ashford - except Stagecoach offer high-backed e-leather seating, compared to Arriva using using bus seats.

Stagecoach's 'Little & Often' network feels like quite a modern step. But Arriva seem to be going back in time.

 

[overthewater]

But Arriva seem to be going back in time.

Thats nothing new..

 

[Bletchleyite]

Arriva copying a concept from Stagecoach then doing it worse is hardly a new thing...

 

[class387]

I will sample it on Saturday, but I don't seem very impressed so far. They should have ordered Mellor Stratas like in Macclesfield, which look like proper buses, not Sprinters, which are just vans.

 

[ag51ruk]

The Mellor Stratas often appear on route 6 in Crewe as well, and have actually grown on me now that I end up on one several times a week. No increase in frequency for us though - still every 30 minutes but with a 50/50 chance of a minibus or an Optare Solo

 

[6Gman]

The Mellor Stratas often appear on route 6 in Crewe as well, and have actually grown on me now that I end up on one several times a week. No increase in frequency for us though - still every 30 minutes but with a 50/50 chance of a minibus or an Optare Solo

Or SB200/ Wright Pulsar 2950 on Monday!

 

[Busaholic]

Apologies, my error, looking closer at the branding it appears to be "your usual bus, but smaller"

Would their Rail Division come up 'we've improved your train service by decreasing the number of carriages on the same timetable'? I think we all know the answer - who's going to be impressed by this?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Would their Rail Division come up 'we've improved your train service by decreasing the number of carriages on the same timetable'? I think we all know the answer - who's going to be impressed by this?

Don't give them ideas.

 

[radamfi]

Is there a view yet whether the Ashford service is a success? I notice the evening frequency is soon to be cut.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Is there a view yet whether the Ashford service is a success? I notice the evening frequency is soon to be cut.

Ask Harry Blundred? There's nothing new under the sun...

 

[Tetchytyke]

Sprinter minibuses on the 3? Gordon Bennett. When I lived up towards Long Chaulden the MPDs often couldn't cope with the loads, especially at peak twirlie times.

Still, shouldn't complain about Hemel getting new buses!

 

[carlberry]

Also, one of the Mercedes buses has all-over contravision for advertising, meaning it literally looks like a van with a destination display - hardly going to encourage passengers, especially giving a horrible view from the windows. When i've travelled on vehicles with all-over contravision, I can't look out the window otherwise I get a headache.

Any company using contravision has already decided that passengers are an inconvenience it can do without.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Any company using contravision has already decided that passengers are an inconvenience it can do without.

Quite. It is perfectly possible to do a good advertising livery without covering the windows.

 

[spuddie]

I've just seen the one in the advertising livery....but only because my first thought was why is their a van in the buses only section of the highstreet! It's probably passed me several times this week and I wouldn't have noticed.

 

[alex397]

Is there a view yet whether the Ashford service is a success? I notice the evening frequency is soon to be cut.

The high evening frequencies always seemed a bit ambitious, so its not really surprising to see that cut. The daytime frequencies were also slightly reduced a while back. However, the frequencies are still very impressive, including in the evenings and Sundays - especially when compared to other parts of Kent, and the UK.
I think it has largely been a success - it all seems to work well, and they have got positive feedback about it on Twitter (which makes a change from all the abusive comments that any company would get on Twitter). It perhaps hasn't been as successful as Stagecoach hoped, but its still early days - it was only introduced this year. Any major increases in custom will take a long time to generate, so I hope Stagecoach have some patience.

 

[radamfi]

The high evening frequencies always seemed a bit ambitious, so its not really surprising to see that cut. The daytime frequencies were also slightly reduced a while back. However, the frequencies are still very impressive, including in the evenings and Sundays - especially when compared to other parts of Kent, and the UK.
I think it has largely been a success - it all seems to work well, and they have got positive feedback about it on Twitter (which makes a change from all the abusive comments that any company would get on Twitter). It perhaps hasn't been as successful as Stagecoach hoped, but its still early days - it was only introduced this year. Any major increases in custom will take a long time to generate, so I hope Stagecoach have some patience.

It would be surprising if there weren't more people using the services given the increase in frequency. It would be hard to be a failure in that respect. But presumably Stagecoach will only consider it a success if the extra patronage pays for the additional cost of running a more frequent service, albeit with minibuses.

 

[overthewater]

Stagecoach are expanding the concept in the town.

 

[alex397]

Stagecoach are expanding the concept in the town.

Indeed. They are due this month to convert the E and G routes to 'Little & Often' operation. However, it isn't really anything as radical as the B and C. The G route will improve from 30 min frequency to 15 min (and only operate between town and Godington Park). The E will extend to South Willesborough (currently served by the G), and increase from every 30 to every 20 minutes.

 

[class387]

Used the minibuses on routes 3 and 5 today. The legroom is poor and the bus was full even mid-afternoon on a Saturday - as expected on a 13 seat bus. Acessibility is also not good with only two priority seats and buses do not lower themselves. The plug doors take far too long to close. On the plus side, the seats are comfortable, they are well built with no rattles and good ride quality (better than an Enviro200) and acceleration is spectacular. Overall, they are a good idea with a frequency increase or to prevent the closure of a route, but should not replace proper buses with no frequency increase.

 

[Busaholic]

Used the minibuses on routes 3 and 5 today. The legroom is poor and the bus was full even mid-afternoon on a Saturday - as expected on a 13 seat bus. Acessibility is also not good with only two priority seats and buses do not lower themselves. The plug doors take far too long to close. On the plus side, the seats are comfortable, they are well built with no rattles and good ride quality (better than an Enviro200) and acceleration is spectacular. Overall, they are a good idea with a frequency increase or to prevent the closure of a route, but should not replace proper buses with no frequency increase.

It could be said the introduction of these minibuses runs contrary to the spirit of greater accessibility for all enshrined in recent bus transport legislation. If more such schemes are introduced expect an outcry from what used to be known as the 'disability lobby'.

 

[Rob T]

Arriva Southern Counties already have "form" here!

One vehicle arrived in Maidstone [1000], but suffered from overcrowding and is now rarely used in service. When last heard of, it had been relegated to the "Reserve Fleet".

Three more turned up at Guildford [smaller vehicles, same frequency] for Route 3 [1001-1003], but after numerous well documented complaints of overcrowding these vehicles have now been switched to the X1 Guildford-Horsham service. Latest news here:

http://www.getsurrey.co.uk/news/surrey-news/reduced-size-bus-service-guildford-13873753

Tunbridge Wells is next in line.

The problem, as clearly stated above, is that if you remove mid or full size buses, replace them with minibus sized vehicles - and then leave the frequency unaltered you are asking for an adverse reaction from passengers. Any busy period of the day, or if bunching occurs for any reason, then the complaints will start to roll in.

It will be interesting if this experiment is considered a success in any way and whether further such schemes are introduced.

 

[class387]

“The X1 has shown continuous growth since its introduction in May and we feel that the minibuses will be the perfect fit for this express service between Guildford and Horsham.”

Surely that would be a reason not to use the minibuses? Using them on a trunk express route seems even less appropriate than on a town service.

 

[Rob T]

The Guildford - Horsham route X1 started in May with route branded 49 seat Volvo B9R/Plaxton Panther coaches, which were then replaced, primarily, by 37 seat Versas.

In turn these have now been replaced by the displaced 17 seat Mercedes Sprinters!

I will leave you to draw your own conclusions as to the merits of the Arriva "continuous growth" quote. It possibly means less fresh air is being transported around.

 

[ChathillMan]

Arriva have previous form for copying another idea and thinking that is all you have to do ( see Stagecoach Gold / Arriva Sapphire)

Strike that, they just need to speak to some old times at ARRIVA Darlington about how to run a frequent minibus service around a small to medium sized town.

Having used L&O myself, i would prefer those mini Mercedes Benz over a clapped out ARRIVA MPD any day

 

[Tetchytyke]

In Hemel the Solos couldn't cope on the 3 at busier times even when the frequency was 4bph. It's down to 3bph and they're using microbuses instead. One can only assume they're trying to kill the operations in the town.

 

[Bletchleyite]

In Hemel the Solos couldn't cope on the 3 at busier times even when the frequency was 4bph. It's down to 3bph and they're using microbuses instead. One can only assume they're trying to kill the operations in the town.

I'm not sure what they're doing. The best I can think of is mindless cost-cutting on behalf of Berlin.

 

[Hophead]

The Guildford - Horsham route X1 started in May with route branded 49 seat Volvo B9R/Plaxton Panther coaches, which were then replaced, primarily, by 37 seat Versas.

In turn these have now been replaced by the displaced 17 seat Mercedes Sprinters!

I will leave you to draw your own conclusions as to the merits of the Arriva "continuous growth" quote. It possibly means less fresh air is being transported around.

Time to draw conclusions..... A change is coming to the X1 from 9th March, the upshot of which will be to (and I paraphrase) "improve efficiency" and "provide a reliable service for customers". Yep - the route's going!

Full story on the Arriva Kent & Surrey news pages, but here's most of the words:

The bus currently runs to Horsham via Shalford, Bramley, Alford, Clemsfold and Broadbridge Heath, and the decision to discontinue the service has been made as a result of the route being particularly quiet.

Passengers will still be able to travel between Guildford and Horsham by using the 63 and 63X bus routes.

Andy Isbell, General Manager Guildford said: “Our routes reflect customer need and the X1 service is particularly underused. The discontinuation of the X1 service will improve efficiency on the remaining bus routes, which will continue to provide a reliable service for customers.”​

The minibuses are off to work their magic in Sevenoaks & Tonbridge, I understand.

 

[Typhoon]

The minibuses are off to work their magic in Sevenoaks & Tonbridge, I understand.

I believe it includes the imaginatively numbered new routes 1 and 2. Route 1 will replace part of 402 (double decker, reduced frequency), 2 will replace current 452 (single decker, same frequency). 452 serves some fairly affluent villages with older residents. Of course, demand may well dictate the use of a smaller bus; however, I have been on the 452 recently during the middle of the day and it was fairly full (and I believe Go-Coach are dropping their journeys). I wouldn't want to travel at school times!

 

[A0wen]

One can only assume they're trying to kill the operations in the town.

To what end though? I suspect they're trying to stem declining revenue which means looking for more cost effective ways to operate services.

If they wanted to kill the services, surely the easier way would be give 90 days notice to the traffic commissioner and just pack up operations - that way they'd stop losing money in one hit, if that's the problem.