Derailment near Grange Over Sands

[paul1609]

I saw the crane move earlier and one of the derailed 195s move earlier through Grange. I assume the 195s are going to be stored at Barrow until the line reopens?

Id imagine they will run to the nearest place they can be transferred to road.

 

[randyrippley]

The guided walks across the bay to Grange from Arnside will be starting soon.

Don't try it on your own....

Id imagine they will run to the nearest place they can be transferred to road.

Are there still any sidings at Barrow docks with sunken tram rails? Would be a lot easier if there are.

Following up in addition to my previous reply, towards the end of the latest video it suggests the wall has been damaged in a few places.

If you watch that security cam video of the derailment, as the lights go out you can a series of sparks as the front left wing scrapes the wall

 

[mbonwick]

Are there still any sidings at Barrow docks with sunken tram rails? Would be a lot easier if there are.

Yes, on the Fisher nuclear berth (I believe they're still in use but probably haven't seen a train in a long time since the last load of waste was returned to Japan).

Getting them onto road transport is the easy bit, getting them out of Barrow might be slightly harder and disruptive....not sure I'd like to try and fit a 195 coach on a low loader through Greenodd Bends!

 

[snowball]

Getting them onto road transport is the easy bit, getting them out of Barrow might be slightly harder and disruptive....not sure I'd like to try and fit a 195 coach on a low loader through Greenodd Bends!

Not quite sure which bit you mean by Greenodd Bends. Admittedly some of the roads in the area, including parts of the A590, are very dodgy, but Greenodd village was bypassed in 1983 for traffic going from Barrow to any of Lancaster, Carnforth, Kendal, or the M6 for Carlisle.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

I wish I could muster up even a fraction of her infectious enthusiasm!



MARK

Very good for an amateur but one with a future perhaps. However, somewhat surprised they were allowed that close when a lifting operation was being performed

 

[Pinus contorta]

Yes, on the Fisher nuclear berth (I believe they're still in use but probably haven't seen a train in a long time since the last load of waste was returned to Japan).

Getting them onto road transport is the easy bit, getting them out of Barrow might be slightly harder and disruptive....not sure I'd like to try and fit a 195 coach on a low loader through Greenodd Bends!

There was a Pendolino carriage that went all the way up to Eskmeals by road around 20 years ago. There should be no problem getting these out.

 

[thenorthern]

Was the 195 being hauled with the crane? Or moving under its own power?

Under it's own power.

 

[Ash Bridge]

Very good for an amateur but one with a future perhaps. However, somewhat surprised they were allowed that close when a lifting operation was being performed

Now you mention it, I must confess I was rather concerned when I saw that too!

 

[Trackman]

Very good for an amateur but one with a future perhaps. However, somewhat surprised they were allowed that close when a lifting operation was being performed

I've just found the video, I was very surprised. It was not as if they didnt know where they are. If it was me, considering the nature of the derailment, never mind the re-railing, I would have watched this from for a considerable distance.

 

[PyrahnaRanger]

There was a Pendolino carriage that went all the way up to Eskmeals by road around 20 years ago. There should be no problem getting these out.

I’m intrigued - what was the reason for this? Are there any photos available?

I’d imagine it’s not going to be fun getting out of Barrow by truck. Could they get it out at Carnforth, given it works be so much closer to the motorway?

 

[Pinus contorta]

I’m intrigued - what was the reason for this? Are there any photos available?

I’d imagine it’s not going to be fun getting out of Barrow by truck. Could they get it out at Carnforth, given it works be so much closer to the motorway?

I was told it was to test for bomb proofing. That's why it had to go to the Eskmeals complex.

They get things to the BAE Shipyard so why is it likely to be such a problem ?

 

[Winthorpe]

Under it's own power.

Thank you. I was wondering how they were going to move away from the accident site.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Under it's own power.

Not that badly damage then if they could do that ie driveshafts and braking systems intact or only need slight attention.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

There were lots of cynical mutterings “if this was the London line they’d have it repaired overnight” on the bus

 

[driverd]

Not that badly damage then if they could do that ie driveshafts and braking systems intact or only need slight attention.

Edited edit: turns out the info was duff and the units are still in situ - so my guess was:

I'm going to hazard a guess that it was likely the rear half of the formation (the one that appears to have remained on the rails at all times). It'd make sense to move that one under its own power - the only damage visible on that one was the excessive movement of the coupler and (possibly though I can't say I noticed it) some front end damage from such movement.

Could be entirely wrong but that'd be my bet.

I would suspect (though, again, this is just my speculation), the derailed unit will either be dragged from the front (as the coupler was unaffected) or attached to an otherwise undamaged unit to be removed. Its pure speculation here and I could be entirely wrong, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if caution was being taken about using the coupler that was in use at the time of derailment. Looking at the pictures it moved well beyond its normal range - so may have suffered twist/deformation damage.

 

[thenorthern]

Thank you. I was wondering how they were going to move away from the accident site.

It was moving very very slowly although I think that was due to the status of the line.

Not that badly damage then if they could do that ie driveshafts and braking systems intact or only need slight attention.

Nope and it was the leading trains which was the one that was derailed.

 

[driverd]

Nope and it was the leading trains which was the one that was derailed.

Shows how wrong I was there!

Very surprised they took it out under its own power! Never thought I'd be saying this but, impressive build quality and resilience from CAF!(?!?!)

 

[randyrippley]

I’m intrigued - what was the reason for this? Are there any photos available?

I’d imagine it’s not going to be fun getting out of Barrow by truck. Could they get it out at Carnforth, given it works be so much closer to the motorway?

Carnforth is on the wrong side of the hole

And actually it's not that easy to get stuff out through the town - when Dr Beet's German and French locos were taken out 30-odd years ago they had to do it by running the wrong way up (one way street) Haws Hill, then down the A6 into Lancaster. And when they got to M6 J34 the turn onto the slip road proved too tight and the signs and bollards got demolished.....
Taking the normal routes through Carnforth to the M6 aren't options: either the turn onto the northbound A6 is too tight, or if you use the Over Kellet road you're faced with a weak narrow canal bridge with sharp turns at each end.

 

[SouthernR]

There was a Pendolino carriage that went all the way up to Eskmeals by road around 20 years ago.

Perhaps it was tilted round the bends?

 

[Winthorpe]

Perhaps it was tilted round the bends?

Some TASS beacons were installed along the road route

 

[mikel543]

Not quite sure which bit you mean by Greenodd Bends. Admittedly some of the roads in the area, including parts of the A590, are very dodgy, but Greenodd village was bypassed in 1983 for traffic going from Barrow to any of Lancaster, Carnforth, Kendal, or the M6 for Carlisle.

I think they are referring to the twisty section of the A590 between Greenodd roundabout and the Rusland pool

 

[norbitonflyer]

It was moving very very slowly although I think that was due to the status of the line.



Nope and it was the leading trains which was the one that was derailed.

Did they run both units together? In which case the front one may not have been under power.

Are there still any sidings at Barrow docks with sunken tram rails? Would be a lot easier if there are.
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If it can get to Barrow Docks, could it be shipped out?

 

[randyrippley]

If it can get to Barrow Docks, could it be shipped out?

hiring a ship would be expensive, and even then you'd still have a road haul from whichever port you landed them at.

 

[norbitonflyer]

hiring a ship would be expensive, and even then you'd still have a road haul from whichever port you landed them at.

Don't CAF have a factory at Newport?

 

[randyrippley]

Don't CAF have a factory at Newport?

I don't know, but wouldn't these just go to Northern's workshops?

 

[Neptune]

I don't know, but wouldn't these just go to Northern's workshops?

It will depend on whether the repairs can be handled at one of our depots. Most likely Wolverton or CAF Newport if it can’t.

 

[zwk500]

Did they run both units together? In which case the front one may not have been under power.

If it can get to Barrow Docks, could it be shipped out?

Assuming it was safe to move without skates or whatever, surely it'd be easier to get DRS or somebody to haul it out via Carlisle?

 

[ScottGallagher]

What a pity that the Cumbrian Coast still cant get cleared for 195s

 

[Bletchleyite]

Assuming it was safe to move without skates or whatever, surely it'd be easier to get DRS or somebody to haul it out via Carlisle?

I think it'd clout the wall at the narrow point, they certainly aren't normally cleared that way. Unless removing the stepboards would be enough.

 

[156421]

I think it'd clout the wall at the narrow point, they certainly aren't normally cleared that way. Unless removing the stepboards would be enough.

I am unaware of them ever travelling north of Millom on that route (other than trivially just north of the station to "run around" to the down platform for Millom terminators).