Disruption/evacuation at Birmingham New Street (31OCT2022)

[Mcr Warrior]

Anyone know what's going on at New Street? Seems the concourse has been evacuated a little earlier and nothing is running through the station.

Link to local online news story...

Birmingham New Street evacuation live as police descend on station

No trains in or out of Birmingham New Street Station after an incident

www.birminghammail.co.uk

Extract...

Birmingham New Street evacuation live as police descend on station.
Birmingham New Street has been evacuated following a security alert today. All train services in and out of the station have been stopped.

 

[trentvalley]

Grenade found. Apparently fake

 

[CharlieSpotted]

Police have revealed what the 'suspicious item' was after it caused as mass evacuation at New Street Station. Officers said it appears to be a cannabis grinder designed to resemble a hand grenade.

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/birmingham-new-street-station-reopens-25400465

 

[skyhigh]

ffs!

Assuming that's aimed at the Police response, if they took no action and it turned out to be real and people were injured (or worse) I think they'd face at least a little bit of criticism...

 

[CharlieSpotted]

Assuming that's aimed at the Police response, if they took no action and it turned out to be real and people were injured (or worse) I think they'd face at least a little bit of criticism...

I should have been clearer, not aimed at the response at all, but at the item and the person who lost/discarded it at New Street, of all places!

I'm glad I wasn't commuting into Brum today, every day last week there was disruption for seemingly a different reason each day, and if I had been disrupted by someone's grinder today I would have been very grumpy indeed!

 

[GatwickDepress]

Not the first time it has happened either, although this was at an airport rather than a railway station.

 

[james_the_xv]

Allegedly a Cannabis Grinder shaped as a grenade

 

[gazzaa2]

Assuming that's aimed at the Police response, if they took no action and it turned out to be real and people were injured (or worse) I think they'd face at least a little bit of criticism...

Aimed at the idiot drug addicts.

 

[duncanp]

Here is the BBC article.

I like the way it says at the end

Avanti West Coast customers may also use their tickets on West Midlands Metro between Birmingham New Street and Wolverhampton.

Good luck with that, they are on strike again today () with services only running from Bull Street to Wolverhampton, and then only up to 6pm.

Birmingham New Street Station suspicious package turns out to be cannabis grinder

Birmingham New Street station reopens after grenade-shaped grinder causes security alert.

www.bbc.co.uk

Birmingham New Street Station suspicious package turns out to be cannabis grinder​

Hundreds of people were evacuated from Birmingham New Street Station after a security alert that turned out to be caused by a cannabis grinder.
All services in and out of the station were suspended after reports of a suspicious package at about 15:00 GMT.
Experts discovered the item, found on a platform, was actually a cannabis grinder in the shape of a grenade.
Commuters were allowed back in at about 16:40, but disruption is expected to last until the end of the day.
"The item has now been assessed by specialist officers and is no longer being treated as suspicious," British Transport Police said.
Birmingham New Street is the busiest station outside of London and the security alert saw commuters turned away, while others were left stuck on trains outside the station.

Posting on social media, one passenger wrote: "Birmingham New Street evacuation, been told to get as far away from building as possible. Undercover police vehicles and ambulances at the scene".
Another passenger said police officers at the main entrance had been shouting at people to move away immediately and to "get back onto New Street now".
Others said they were stuck on trains outside it.

West Midlands Ambulance Service, West Midlands Police and West Midlands Fire Service were also there working alongside British Transport Police.
National Rail said while lines had reopened, trains may still be "cancelled, revised or delayed by up to 100 minutes as services return to normal".
It added rail replacement bus services had been put on for:

• Coventry and Northampton.

• Redditch and Longbridge via Bromsgrove.

• Lichfield City and Lichfield Trent Valley.

• Walsall and Rugeley Trent Valley

• Wolverhampton and Shrewsbury

Avanti West Coast customers may also use their tickets on West Midlands Metro between Birmingham New Street and Wolverhampton.

 

[william.martin]

I should have been clearer, not aimed at the response at all, but at the item and the person who lost/discarded it at New Street, of all places!

I'm glad I wasn't commuting into Brum today, every day last week there was disruption for seemingly a different reason each day, and if I had been disrupted by someone's grinder today I would have been very grumpy indeed!

I had the broken 158 outside of Tipton the other day, made me miss my B'ham new Street connection.

I am glad that the grenade was fake, thank God that nobody was hurt

 

[iainbhx]

I was commuting back to Brum from Crewe today and LNR/WMT were pretty craven from the offset cancelling several services south from Crewe immediately including the one over the Stoke wobble which carries a fair bit of local traffic. I got on the 17:01 to New Street and we went forward to Wolves where we sat because of "Congestion at New Street" although according to Traksy there was nothing between us and New Street. We sat at Wolves for about 15 mins over time and then had a clear run through, but the Midland side platforms were full and seemingly at a stand-still. Lots of people on the concourse as well. To add to the fun, I'd missed the 18:31 Spring Road, the 19:10 disappeared into a Snow Hill black hole and I finally got the 19:31. LNR/WMT as usual failed on the comms side.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Allegedly a Cannabis Grinder shaped as a grenade

Readily available to purchase on Ebay, apparently. Surprised that the sale of such-shaped articles isn't generally prohibited.

 

[Nova1]

Caused an absolute monster levels of disruption, basically scuppered any local services for the rest of the evening, loads of XC cancellations with some running with 120+ minute delays

 

[Mugby]

Caused an absolute monster levels of disruption, basically scuppered any local services for the rest of the evening, loads of XC cancellations with some running with 120+ minute delays

Yes, apparently the 1227 HST from Plymouth to Edinburgh was terminated at Bromsgrove. Makes you wonder why they couldn't have switched it at Kings Norton onto the Saltley line. Taxi the relieving crew to Kings Norton, better than a cancellation or a two hour delay!

 

[popeter45]

Yes, apparently the 1227 HST from Plymouth to Edinburgh was terminated at Bromsgrove. Makes you wonder why they couldn't have switched it at Kings Norton onto the Saltley line. Taxi the relieving crew to Kings Norton, better than a cancellation or a two hour delay!

are HST's even cleared for that line?

 

[43055]

are HST's even cleared for that line?

They are cirtainly cleared into New Street from that way.

 

[DelayRepay]

There was a similar issue in Milton Keynes the other day, involving an umbrella.

Armed police swoop on train to seize 'samurai sword'... umbrella | ITV News

The passenger apparently admitted his fashion choice had missed the mark and handed it over to be destroyed. | ITV News Anglia

www.itv.com

Armed police dramatically swooped on a train - to seize a passenger's umbrella.

Officers from Thames Valley Police were called to Milton Keynes station following reports of a member of the public carrying a samurai sword.

But instead of the traditional Japanese weapon, they found a male passenger on a Friday afternoon journey carrying an umbrella with a "samurai sword looking handle".

Police said he had bought the item online but accepted his fashion sense had missed the mark and surrendered it so it could be destroyed.

Thames Valley officers urged people to think before buying imitation umbrellas or any other items that could cause concern.

 

[Jagdpanther]

Aimed at the idiot drug addicts.

What has a cannabis grinder got to do with drug addicts?

 

[class 9]

Yes, apparently the 1227 HST from Plymouth to Edinburgh was terminated at Bromsgrove. Makes you wonder why they couldn't have switched it at Kings Norton onto the Saltley line. Taxi the relieving crew to Kings Norton, better than a cancellation or a two hour delay!

Not all crews sign that route.
Also, what do you do with the Birmingham passengers?

 

[Mugby]

Also, what do you do with the Birmingham passengers?

Wouldn't be any worse than dumping them at Bromsgrove!

 

[Class172]

Yes, apparently the 1227 HST from Plymouth to Edinburgh was terminated at Bromsgrove. Makes you wonder why they couldn't have switched it at Kings Norton onto the Saltley line. Taxi the relieving crew to Kings Norton, better than a cancellation or a two hour delay!

It did indeed - https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:P89241/2022-10-31/detailed#allox_id=0

Which makes me ask, are the XC HSTs equipped with any form of SDO? I ask as the platforms at Bromsgrove can only accommodate 6 coaches so the entire train definitely would not have fit on the platform, perhaps adding a further slight complication for getting passengers off.

 

[louis97]

It did indeed - https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:P89241/2022-10-31/detailed#allox_id=0

Which makes me ask, are the XC HSTs equipped with any form of SDO? I ask as the platforms at Bromsgrove can only accommodate 6 coaches so the entire train definitely would not have fit on the platform, perhaps adding a further slight complication for getting passengers off.

Yep they are.

 

[trainophile]

What has a cannabis grinder got to do with drug addicts?

Isn't there a bit of a clue there?

 

[Dave1954]

Would be nice to know what happened to the HST Stock .

 

[Mugby]

Would be nice to know what happened to the HST Stock .

Yes, I wondered that, it surely didn't just sit at Bromsgrove indefinitely. it must have gone somewhere as ECS - in fact it may have gone via Camp Hill to avoid New St.

 

[louis97]

Yes, I wondered that, it surely didn't just sit at Bromsgrove indefinitely. it must have gone somewhere as ECS - in fact it may have gone via Camp Hill to avoid New St.

It went back south in service as 1Z60 to Plymouth.

 

[markymark2000]

Something that I hope someone may be able to explain but in situations like this, why doesn't the railway still run for the passengers? Rather than having trains backed up on lines and endlessly causing congestion, why couldn't some of the lines continue, albeit in a revised form, so that as many people as possible could still make their journeys.

Of course an exception to the rule here is the any trains which were too far stuck but it looks as if Avanti and TFW acted the best for keeping people moving. Avanti sending trains via Bescot and TFW likely getting off easily by terminating trains at Wolverhampton which is relatively easy for them being based where they are.

Cross Country though and West Midlands Rail. I presume in part due to their staff bases but their response seemed dismal. Cross Country had diversion routes that could have been taken. Anyone for Birmingham New Street, get off at [suitable station] nearby (and await the service to resume), anyone else, stay on the train and it diverts accordingly. Of course this couldn't have been done for all services but some could have been and it wouldn't have caused as many issues.

West Midlands Railway became a bit of a shambles and their inability to cope with any kind of disruption meant that rail replacement buses were 'requested' (whether any ran is a different matter) to run far, far beyond where they should have been. I am genuinely baffled as to how they thought the best course of action to deal with New Street closure was to keep sending trains into New Street and just queue them up outside until the station reopens and then cause chaos with all of the trains then sat in New Street awaiting new crew (which seems to have led to many more delays which didn't need to happen. Why couldn't trains have ran shuttles instead Redditch to Barnt Green, Lichfield to Four Oaks, Rugeley to Walsall. Maybe even Wolverhampton to Smethwick (with train then turning around in Soho Depot).
While primary demand at the time may well have to/from Birmingham people making local journeys should have tried to be accommodated. What is the difference if a train sits in a train jam near New Street or does a few shuttle runs back and forth then joins the train queue when New Street is reopened? Any buses which do then end up running, only have to link up to these shuttle trains and the shuttle trains would link people into other trains which are running. Thinking specifically people Walsall-Rugeley or Four Oaks to Lichfield could instead choose to make their journey via Trent Valley. Wolves to Smethwick would have enabled people to change onto the Snow Hill lines to head westwards (basically continue their journey with less disruption) for their normal connections or change to get into the centre of Birmingham.
Instead of using logic, West Midlands Railway showed that it's not a railway ran for passengers but ran for operational convenience having a good number of trains in a queue, not moving for an hour then when the lines reopened, blocked the station for goodness knows how long trying to find crew to run everything.

West Midlands Railway running things as they did meant that the Redditch line having almost no service after 15:32. The next train being (from Redditch) 18:18, 21:42, 22:02 and 23:30. Hereford/Worcesters could have thrown in an extra stop at Barnt Green then as long as 1 train was on Redditch shuttles, all passengers could have gotten where they were going pretty smoothly. Also the Rugeley Trent Valley line (via Walsall) had nothing after 15:58. The next ones (from Rugeley TV) 19:23, 20:20, 21:25, 22:58. 2 units would have provided a train every hour (with 50 min break in Walsall between trips).

I could go onto each line but I could be here a while. The point being that as soon as you stop trying to run full services and go for shuttles which conveniently link into the rail replacement or National Express buses (where there was ticket acceptance), suddenly, the work you are then trying to cover is significantly reduced. Four Oaks to Redditch, under how I have done it, drops from 5 units to 1. 1 driver and guard shuttling until end of service or until such time that they can be replaced by a meaningful through service as staff become available.


I really think that West Midlands Railway massively messed up the network. I appreciate disruption happens and closing New Street will always cause huge amount of issues but WMR really did not help matters and seemingly, nor did they make any attempt to get services back up and running quickly and get as many people moved as quickly as possible. Instead, seemingly threw their toys out of the pram and as they couldn't deal with resolving the network, they decided that no one else should be able to run services either so they blocked New Street with loads of trains with no crew.

 

[Surreytraveller]

Something that I hope someone may be able to explain but in situations like this, why doesn't the railway still run for the passengers? Rather than having trains backed up on lines and endlessly causing congestion, why couldn't some of the lines continue, albeit in a revised form, so that as many people as possible could still make their journeys.

Of course an exception to the rule here is the any trains which were too far stuck but it looks as if Avanti and TFW acted the best for keeping people moving. Avanti sending trains via Bescot and TFW likely getting off easily by terminating trains at Wolverhampton which is relatively easy for them being based where they are.

Cross Country though and West Midlands Rail. I presume in part due to their staff bases but their response seemed dismal. Cross Country had diversion routes that could have been taken. Anyone for Birmingham New Street, get off at [suitable station] nearby (and await the service to resume), anyone else, stay on the train and it diverts accordingly. Of course this couldn't have been done for all services but some could have been and it wouldn't have caused as many issues.

West Midlands Railway became a bit of a shambles and their inability to cope with any kind of disruption meant that rail replacement buses were 'requested' (whether any ran is a different matter) to run far, far beyond where they should have been. I am genuinely baffled as to how they thought the best course of action to deal with New Street closure was to keep sending trains into New Street and just queue them up outside until the station reopens and then cause chaos with all of the trains then sat in New Street awaiting new crew (which seems to have led to many more delays which didn't need to happen. Why couldn't trains have ran shuttles instead Redditch to Barnt Green, Lichfield to Four Oaks, Rugeley to Walsall. Maybe even Wolverhampton to Smethwick (with train then turning around in Soho Depot).
While primary demand at the time may well have to/from Birmingham people making local journeys should have tried to be accommodated. What is the difference if a train sits in a train jam near New Street or does a few shuttle runs back and forth then joins the train queue when New Street is reopened? Any buses which do then end up running, only have to link up to these shuttle trains and the shuttle trains would link people into other trains which are running. Thinking specifically people Walsall-Rugeley or Four Oaks to Lichfield could instead choose to make their journey via Trent Valley. Wolves to Smethwick would have enabled people to change onto the Snow Hill lines to head westwards (basically continue their journey with less disruption) for their normal connections or change to get into the centre of Birmingham.
Instead of using logic, West Midlands Railway showed that it's not a railway ran for passengers but ran for operational convenience having a good number of trains in a queue, not moving for an hour then when the lines reopened, blocked the station for goodness knows how long trying to find crew to run everything.

West Midlands Railway running things as they did meant that the Redditch line having almost no service after 15:32. The next train being (from Redditch) 18:18, 21:42, 22:02 and 23:30. Hereford/Worcesters could have thrown in an extra stop at Barnt Green then as long as 1 train was on Redditch shuttles, all passengers could have gotten where they were going pretty smoothly. Also the Rugeley Trent Valley line (via Walsall) had nothing after 15:58. The next ones (from Rugeley TV) 19:23, 20:20, 21:25, 22:58. 2 units would have provided a train every hour (with 50 min break in Walsall between trips).

I could go onto each line but I could be here a while. The point being that as soon as you stop trying to run full services and go for shuttles which conveniently link into the rail replacement or National Express buses (where there was ticket acceptance), suddenly, the work you are then trying to cover is significantly reduced. Four Oaks to Redditch, under how I have done it, drops from 5 units to 1. 1 driver and guard shuttling until end of service or until such time that they can be replaced by a meaningful through service as staff become available.


I really think that West Midlands Railway massively messed up the network. I appreciate disruption happens and closing New Street will always cause huge amount of issues but WMR really did not help matters and seemingly, nor did they make any attempt to get services back up and running quickly and get as many people moved as quickly as possible. Instead, seemingly threw their toys out of the pram and as they couldn't deal with resolving the network, they decided that no one else should be able to run services either so they blocked New Street with loads of trains with no crew.

Who's going to reorganise the service? You say you would be here a while going into each line - that's a bit of a clue as to why it didn't happen. There's no one sitting around doing nothing waiting to reorganise the train service when a major location gets shut down

 

[markymark2000]

Who's going to reorganise the service? You say you would be here a while going into each line - that's a bit of a clue as to why it didn't happen.

Take what I said in context. "I would be here a while going into each line" is clearly referring to highlighting the gaps in the service. I would be there a while working out the gaps in the Wolves and International stoppers and the Lichfield line.

There's no one sitting around doing nothing waiting to reorganise the train service when a major location gets shut down

No but if planners can't handle times of disruption or management are advising planners to act in the way they did on Monday, they shouldn't be in a job.

 

[zwk500]

Take what I said in context. "I would be here a while going into each line" is clearly referring to highlighting the gaps in the service. I would be there a while working out the gaps in the Wolves and International stoppers and the Lichfield line.

There simply isn't the capacity for every train to avoid Birmingham New Street. Trying to do so would lead to delays poisoning the entire country as trains turned up late at Bristol, Reading, Rugby, Leicester, Derby, Stafford, Shrewsbury, etc. Drivers would end up out of hours in random places, units would end up being dumped in platforms, etc.
Turning services either side of Birmingham is necessary, but if a Bristol driver gets sent back towards Derby you're going to have a headache later on getting them home.

No but if planners can't handle times of disruption or management are advising planners to act in the way they did on Monday, they shouldn't be in a job.

It wasn't in the plan for New Street to be shut completely during passenger services, so it's not the fault of the planners at all. Control will have contingency plans, but no 2 incidents are the same in terms of lines closed, length of disruption, services impacted etc so they will have been thinking on their feet.

There's only so much you can ask of people when a major node gets shut down. You've got fleet, crew and signallers all trying to manage as best they could. Similar chaos has been observed when the WCML gets shut south of Watford, or when the Signalling at Windmill Bridge Jn went down a couple of years ago. Considering how much Control do right on a daily basis to keep people moving, if you ever meet them in person you should buy them a drink instead of telling them they're rubbish.