Euston departure board to be moved

[Bletchleyite]

One of them is in place, albeit not working yet.

Horrid, horrid clutter. They clear it out, then they fill it with obstructions again.

Could removing the location of the main one count as a listed buillding offence?

 

[duncanp]

I don't think there's anything wrong with the location of the displays at New St, and I'm sure in due course they'll be replaced by colour ones. The layout is otherwise the same.

I also think there is nothing wrong with the main departure board at Birmingham New Street.

There are several other depature boards at New Street, most notably when you come in from Smallbrook Queensway, but also when you enter the station from where the tram stop is.

 

[Mordac]

I will happily continue using Marylebone when I have to go to London, which mercifully ain't that often!

 

[SynthD]

Could removing the location of the main one count as a listed buillding offence?

Yes, if the building was listed and the main one was in the description. It’s not listed because it’s Euston. Only the old systems are listed, eg Earls Court, and that was not working for a long time.

 

[Hadders]

Horrid, horrid clutter. They clear it out, then they fill it with obstructions again.

Could removing the location of the main one count as a listed buillding offence?

Agreed. Just replace the existing board with the new colour style board.

 

[high camera]

The cynic in me would suggest that keeping passengers in the concourse is all about holding up revenue for the shops (and a slice going to the station operator) once passengers are on the platforms that is lost. Its what airports do.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

Surely I can’t be the only one who finds these tacky multi-coloured new boards at Victoria harder to read than the orange LED ones? I think they look a mess. A sea of bright fluorescent colours on which the text doesn’t show up hugely well… and I speak as someone with good eyesight.

 

[louis97]

This is a good point. Reservations could be downloaded after the last stop rather than waiting to Euston.

I'm fairly sure this used to happen under Virgin. Fairly sure the inward working had the relevant information on the train crew diagram to allow them to get the train setup for its next working.

 

[Hadders]

The departure boards at St Pancras are an absolute disgrace for what is arguably the country’s flagship station. There isn’t even a clock showing the time to the second!

Surprised they are spending money at Euston before looking at St Pancras.

 

[londonmidland]

I don’t get why they don’t just replace the current ones with these new style ones instead of completely changing the location of it?

It looks cluttered and ‘messy’ with it randomly being placed in the middle of the concourse. The current location is perfect as you can see the departures from a distance, thus not having to go into the middle of the concourse causing additional congestion.

As the saying goes, ‘If it ain’t broken, don’t fix it’…

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

The departure boards at St Pancras are an absolute disgrace for what is arguably the country’s flagship station. There isn’t even a clock showing the time to the second!

Surprised they are spending money at Euston before looking at St Pancras.

St Pancras is a disgrace full stop. Everything miles apart from each other, ridiculous operation of the escalators up to EMR (and awkward staff when you get there), better signage for the shops than the actual railway facilities and the fact that everything is impossible to find because it's been designed as a shopping centre with railway platforms in it rather than the reverse. Though rants like that should be saved for another thread, I'll admit.

The Euston board is easily viewable when walking towards platforms. Now, one will have to make a diversion via the new boards in order to know where to depart from.

 

[michael8]

Surely I can’t be the only one who finds these tacky multi-coloured new boards at Victoria harder to read than the orange LED ones? I think they look a mess. A sea of bright fluorescent colours on which the text doesn’t show up hugely well… and I speak as someone with good eyesight.

I agree.. The orange LED ones "matched" with my brain, and at a glance I could find what I wanted to know, even without stopping walking. The new ones are just so counter-intuitive and I have to actively read the text (whereas before I recognised the information without having to make conscious effort). I have good eyesight too !

 

[londonmidland]

St Pancras is a disgrace full stop. Everything miles apart from each other, ridiculous operation of the escalators up to EMR (and awkward staff when you get there), better signage for the shops than the actual railway facilities

For a London terminal, the EMR side of St. Pancras is embarrassingly poor. Regarding its PIS, the white LED text is so small.

The manual announcements made by the gateline staff are even worse. Frequently cutting out to due poor equipment and/or if if needed by a passenger. A missed opportunity not to install an automated announcement system when the new screens were installed.

 

[tomuk]

I don’t get why they don’t just replace the current ones with these new style ones instead of completely changing the location of it?

Is the change of location something to do with HS2 and the station redevelopment?

 

[SCDR_WMR]

Is the change of location something to do with HS2 and the station redevelopment?

Bit early for that. Though it could be considered as a test for when that does happen

 

[Bletchleyite]

If it is an abject failure I wonder what they'll do with their £1.5m toys? Not admit they were wrong, or move them to e.g. Paddington to update those, as Paddington already has that layout?

 

[Hadders]

If it is an abject failure I wonder what they'll do with their £1.5m toys? Not admit they were wrong, or move them to e.g. Paddington to update those, as Paddington already has that layout?

Move them to St Pancras where something different is desperately needed.

 

[zwk500]

If it is an abject failure I wonder what they'll do with their £1.5m toys? Not admit they were wrong, or move them to e.g. Paddington to update those, as Paddington already has that layout?

The screens themselves can presumably be remounted where the current boards are.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The screens themselves can presumably be remounted where the current boards are.

Good point. That may be more useful. The present board has 17 panels, moving the new ones up there would give 22 panels which would add flexibility though at the expense of reducing ad space - though are they tall enough to be readable from higher up?

(That the new ones only have 11 panels is one reason they're unsuitable - to be fair, they are moving the Overground out which reduces the need by 3, but that still means 3 fewer usable panels than the main board).

 

[Hadders]

The new departure boards are now switched on. Observations:

1. Both old and (part) of the new boards are in use
2. Only the inner face of the boards is in use. I assume this will change as otherwise you will have to zig-zag via the middle of the concourse to see the departure boards
3. Fewer train services are shown on the new boards compared to the old board
4. Look at the photo I took from the mezzanine level that shows which board passengers were looking at. No-one is looking at the new boards, everyone seems to be looking at the old one!

I am not convinced these boards are a good idea. They spoil the openness of the concourse, and passengers don’t appear to be using them. Why not simply replace the existing departure board with the new style one?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I too think this is going to prove a very costly mistake.

 

[londonmidland]

So the new screens can only show six full sized departures whereas the old ones can show 13+...

It just seems a case of 'Hey, looks at these fancy new departure screens' over anything practical.

'If it ain't broke, don't fix it'

 

[ScottGallagher]

Of all the things wrong with Euston and there are many, the positioning of the departure board wasn't one of them, this is just a mess.

 

[Bletchleyite]

So the new screens can only show six full sized departures whereas the old ones can show 13+...

They're expensive, too bright to stand close to, and show only 6 departures. Even if doing this layout, a run of standard 50" (or whatever they are) LED monitors would be better.

The layout does work at Paddington but the screens are smaller and show more departures.

 

[thomalex]

I can never look at these screens without thinking they are telling me to exit the station. Something about the green, the man and the arrow.

 

[zwk500]

The new departure boards are now switched on. Observations:

1. Both old and (part) of the new boards are in use
2. Only the inner face of the boards is in use. I assume this will change as otherwise you will have to zig-zag via the middle of the concourse to see the departure boards
3. Fewer train services are shown on the new boards compared to the old board
4. Look at the photo I took from the mezzanine level that shows which board passengers were looking at. No-one is looking at the new boards, everyone seems to be looking at the old one!

I am not convinced these boards are a good idea. They spoil the openness of the concourse, and passengers don’t appear to be using them. Why not simply replace the existing departure board with the new style one?

Another observation is that the destination 'Avanti' appears in the 'next fastest train' section twice.

 

[dosxuk]

A few points from the original press release which some posters may be needing reminding of:

Computer modelling has taken place to analyse how shifting passengers’ focus from the front to the centre of the concourse can improve people flow at the West Coast main line’s London terminus.

Flow modelling is an established science - and generally gives accurate results - they haven't decided to do this on a whim.

But over the coming months this will be tested live when the new screens are put into action for trials.

This is a trial - and not guaranteed to be the final solution.

State-of-the-art LIDAR cameras will monitor passenger movements in real time and the data collected will be studied to see how repositioning the boards affects the routes people take between the concourse and trains.

They are intending to get real data to back up their proposal.

Further banks of the same electronic passenger information screens are also due to be put up outside of the station on the piazza in early 2023.

So these won't be the only screens at the entire station - moving people away from the concourse and into the wider area if their train is not due to leave imminently.


Furthermore, the big advantage of this type of screen over individual screens or the old fixed format LED displays is that they can have their layout altered quickly and easily - and those layouts can be finessed for different circumstances.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Are these screens owned or leased? That is, if this is a failure have Network Rail spent £1.5m on a pup?

Flow modelling is an established science - and generally gives accurate results - they haven't decided to do this on a whim.

However people who use the station and work there on a daily basis often have insights into behaviour that models don't.

 

[185]

This is a trial

I have to say it's the wrong place for someone's little experiments. Perhaps trials that are close to a poor GCSE project should take place at somewhere like Sugar Loaf (Powys) where there is no impact on passengers in a major, class one station - trials which should occur before the rollout of an expensive system that probably will may not work in a major station.

 

[dosxuk]

Are these screens owned or leased? That is, if this is a failure have Network Rail spent £1.5m on a pup?

Does it actually matter - I'm sure they can find somewhere else on their estate to use them if the trial is deemed a failure - or they could incorporate the expensive bits (the actual LED panels) into the current screen's position and keep them at Euston. The bit of steelwork holding up the screens is going to be the cheap bit of this project, and probably the only bit that can't be easily reused elsewhere.

However people who use the station and work there on a daily basis often have insights into behaviour that models don't.

However, people who use the station can only have insight into the existing layout. It's not possible for them to have knowledge of a flow for a layout that doesn't currently exist, only an opinion (which will invariably be one of either "well it can't be any worse than now" or "it all works fine now, no need to change things ever"). The computer models can of course see into the way things will work with any number of designs and layouts - it won't know that one of the options modelled will be what exists in reality.