How long do GWR appeals take

[pulsfordmiles]

Yesterday I got a train from Reading to London via GWR, i bought a ticket for the 1700 train but got the 1712 train as was a bit late, my ticket stated that i can use any service to london at any time so i didnt think anything of it however the ticket inspector refused to scan my ticket and didnt believe me so i was unfairly issued with a penalty fair, i told the ticket office this at london and they said to do an appeal and that i am not in the wrong. I put through an appeal but i am very paranoid about this as being a student £72 is a lot and with exams coming up this is on my mind, does anyone know how long the appeal process takes. Many thanks

 

[island]

Exactly how much did you pay for your ticket?

Please can you upload a picture of the "fine" you were issued with? Block out any personal details.

 

[pulsfordmiles]

I havent paid the fine yet, the ticket i paid for was £12.60 but fine was 75.10

 

[tspaul26]

You have left the notice number visible.

Did you hold a physical ticket? How did you pay for it?

 

[father_jack]

I havent paid the fine yet, the ticket i paid for was £12.60 but fine was 75.10View attachment 157748

£12.60 is a pay as you go single price so you never had a ticket but touched in to enter at Reading ? GWR revenue don't (AFAIK) have the facility to check bank cards. The £75.10 is made up of an off peak day single Reading to Paddington plus £50 penalty fare.

 

[The exile]

If you travelled on the 17.12, how come the document was issued on train at 17.07? Did you perhaps mean it the other way around?

 

[furlong]

That says it was issued at 17.07 on the train. Do you know which train were you on - or which platform it left from and whether it stopped at any intermediate stations - it must have left Reading before 17.12.

Please would you also show us an image of your ticket and confirm where you bought it from? If it was an e-ticket - which website or app sold you it?

 

[pulsfordmiles]

That says it was issued at 17.07 on the train. Do you know which train were you on - or which platform it left from and whether it stopped at any intermediate stations - it must have left Reading before 17.12.

Please would you also show us an image of your ticket and confirm where you bought it from? If it was an e-ticket - which website or app sold you it?

what i meant was i was getting the 1712 train but ended up boarding the 1700 train, my ticket says it is valid any route, and got it via trainline.

You have left the notice number visible.

Did you hold a physical ticket? How did you pay for it?

it was an e ticket i got through my card, like any trip to london but i just got an earlier train

 

[tspaul26]

Do you have a 16-17 Saver railcard?

If so, were you asked to show it and did you do so?

When did you purchase this ticket?

 

[AlterEgo]

They have stated on the notice it was for “no ticket”. When was it purchased, and was it displayed to the RPI?

 

[father_jack]

They have stated on the notice it was for “no ticket”. When was it purchased, and was it displayed to the RPI?

A railcard discounted ticket without a supporting railcard is "no ticket" so I'd reckon that's the direction this is heading.

 

[pulsfordmiles]

A railcard discounted ticket without a supporting railcard is "no ticket" so I'd reckon that's the direction this is heading.

I have a railcard but he didn’t ask for it, I had a ticket but he wouldn’t accept it as he didn’t realise it was an open ticket I’m assuming

Do you have a 16-17 Saver railcard?

If so, were you asked to show it and did you do so?

When did you purchase this ticket?

I purchased it about 20 mins before the train - I have a railcard but he didn’t ask to see it

 

[Watershed]

Why did the ticket inspector refuse to scan your ticket? Surely there must have been a bit more to that conversation - what did each of you say?

 

[island]

A railcard discounted ticket without a supporting railcard is "no ticket" so I'd reckon that's the direction this is heading.

That's incorrect. Missing Railcard would be 04 No supporting documentation.

 

[furlong]

The image you've shown us does not show any time on it, so what made you think it was because of the time on it that he wouldn't scan it?

 

[pulsfordmiles]

Why did the ticket inspector refuse to scan your ticket? Surely there must have been a bit more to that conversation - what did each of you say?

I told him that I got an earlier train then what I got, and then he said to me it won’t work on the train so I said ok I’ll buy a new one but he wouldn’t let me, then I was looking at my ticket while he was issuing the fine and I said this ticket should work it says it’s valid any route reading to Paddington (which is correct) but he said it wouldn’t scan - what I’m concerned is about is when there will be a decision regarding my appeal as £75 is a lot of money for a student

 

[Watershed]

I told him that I got an earlier train then what I got

I'm confused - what do you mean by this? If you were on a train when this happened, surely the inspector would have known what train you were both travelling on?

then he said to me it won’t work on the train

Did he explain what he meant by this?

I said this ticket should work it says it’s valid any route reading to Paddington (which is correct) but he said it wouldn’t scan

Did he explain what the problem was when trying to scan it? Was there a problem with your phone's screen, e.g. it being cracked?

what I’m concerned is about is when there will be a decision regarding my appeal as £75 is a lot of money for a student

The appeals body can take up to 21 days to make a decision. There are three stages of appeal, so do not worry about this for the moment.

 

[island]

Did the inspector attempt to scan the ticket?

Can you post up the ticket barcode in full as we will be able to decode it? It does not contain personal identifiable information.

 

[pulsfordmiles]

I'm confused - what do you mean by this? If you were on a train when this happened, surely the inspector would have known what train you were both travelling on?


Did he explain what he meant by this?


Did he explain what the problem was when trying to scan it? Was there a problem with your phone's screen, e.g. it being cracked?


The appeals body can take up to 21 days to make a decision. There are three stages of appeal, so do not worry about this for the moment.

I really don’t know why he didn’t scan it, the lady sitting next to me said she was listening and was equally as confused, if im being fully honest the ticket inspector was quite old and English clearly wasn’t his first language - also if I pay the reduced fine , and my appeal ends up being accepted would I get my money back?

 

[island]

also if I pay the reduced fine , and my appeal ends up being accepted would I get my money back?

Yes, but if you are sure you had a valid ticket, why are you offering to pay the Penalty Fare?

 

[Brissle Girl]

Yes, but the clock stops when you appeal in terms of the discounted penalty, so there is no need to pay until you have exhausted all three stages of the appeal process.

 

[pulsfordmiles]

Did the inspector attempt to scan the ticket?

Can you post up the ticket barcode in full as we will be able to decode it? It does not contain personal identifiable information.

I must also add, I was very defensive in the process, at first I refused to hand my ID as I was not in the wrong and told him that it was unfair and i wanted to speak to someone else, he then told me that if I don’t give him ID there will be police waiting for me at Paddington which I said I don’t really care, he then told me he was recording me and it was on camera and I could be bothered to deal with it so just gave him my ID - that may have provoked him to not scan my ticket

Yes, but if you are sure you had a valid ticket, why are you offering to pay the Penalty Fare?

Only because I am a massive worrier and from what I’ve read it’s unlikely to win the appeal, also my father works with lawyers so they are sending a seperate Letter just stating that the inspector acted beyond his power and against policy - I doubt this would go anywhere but I am hoping to complain against the inspector mainly because I get very anxious over things like this and i had me worrying the whole day

 

[skyhigh]

What time, exactly, did the ticket purchase go through according to your purchase confirmation email?

 

[pulsfordmiles]

What time, exactly, did the ticket purchase go through according to your purchase confirmation email?

It went through at 1700 right as I boarded

 

[MrJeeves]

I'm confused - what do you mean by this? If you were on a train when this happened, surely the inspector would have known what train you were both travelling on?

I interpret it as OP got a flexible ticket with an itinerary for train X but actually boarded train Y which departed earlier than train X.

GWR staff then took OP's comment to assume they bought an advance and refused to even look at the ticket under the false assumption cast by the OP's comment.

 

[skyhigh]

I purchased it about 20 mins before the train

It went through at 1700 right as I boarded

Surely you can see the contradictions in these statements? You bought the ticket 20 mins before the train, but it went through right as you boarded.

If you wanted to PM a screenshot of the ticket without the blacking out I could check precisely what time it says the ticket was purchased, which might help to explain what has happened here.

We have seen incompetence from staff before but I would be fairly surprised if a revenue inspector didn't know that an Off-peak Return wasn't restricted to one train.

 

[Brissle Girl]

It also begs the question how you got through the gateline at Reading, as I doubt it was open and unmanned at that time.

But as @skyhigh says, seeing whether the ticket was purchased before or after departure (which according to RTT was 1700 3/4) will help us assist you, and hopefully rule out one important issue.

 

[Kite159]

It also begs the question how you got through the gateline at Reading, as I doubt it was open and unmanned at that time.

But as @skyhigh says, seeing whether the ticket was purchased before or after departure (which according to RTT was 1700 3/4) will help us assist you, and hopefully rule out one important issue.

The barriers at Reading were wide open (at least the set alongside the stairs from the overbridge) at 19:45 yesterday, so it was possible they were open at 17:00 if there was a staff shortage

 

[AlterEgo]

What a bizarre case. Why wouldn’t the RPI even look at or scan the ticket?

 

[furlong]

he then told me he was recording me and it was on camera

Perhaps the obvious thing to do is to obtain a copy of this recording and invite your lawyer contacts (or willing forum members) to review it.

I think the most common reason for an inspector not to scan a ticket would be because the passenger was unable to show it in a reasonable amount of time and so the decision to impose a penalty had already been taken, after which point scanning the ticket would serve no immediate purpose. I take the view, in common with some others on this forum, that the regulations allow a Penalty Fare to be issued if the passenger isn't in possession of a valid ticket at the point in time when they are asked to present it, for example when the inspector says "Tickets, please!" to the carriage. If for any reason you didn't complete the purchase until after the inspection was announced, then unfortunately for you they are allowed to impose a Penalty Fare.

1) Please show us the time ticket was issued (or send an image of the 2-D code in a private message to one of us for us to check).
2) Please tell us how you entered Reading station. (The train company already has your image from the inspector's recording, so will be able to look on the station CCTV to find this out.)

Separately, the Penalty Fares signage is poor at Reading station, so an appeal on that basis might have some chance of success.