mattdickinson
Member
They stopped claiming Oyster was 'always cheaper' way back.
Although I don't think it was ever more expensive.
I think that stopped when PAYG to Grays was introduced.
They stopped claiming Oyster was 'always cheaper' way back.
Although I don't think it was ever more expensive.
Oyster is generally cheaper but be wary of the Travelcard / mix mode premium that used to occur. Not sure if it still does.
Briefly, I regularly have a zone 4-6 Travelcard and I made a journey from Stratford International to Slade Green using the DLR and changing at Woolwich Arsenal. I stupidly thought I would get charged the DLR fare from Stratford to Woolwich but because I continued to Slade Green on National Rail it cost me 10 pence more! - TfL initially said no to a refund as its a mix mode journey but I kicked up a bit of a stink as in my eyes I felt I was being charged 10p to use my Travelcard in the zones where it was valid!!!! (I got that 10p back!)
But it wouldn't surprise me if someone with a 1-6 Travelcard starting from a central London tube station got charged more than if they had started the journey to Gatwick from Victoria....with the mix mode fare!
Blakey
But it wouldn't surprise me if someone with a 1-6 Travelcard starting from a central London tube station got charged more than if they had started the journey to Gatwick from Victoria....with the mix mode fare!
Blakey
Oyster fares for stations to Gatwick Airport and the Gatwick Express are now shown on the 2016 fares tab of the TfL single fare finder.
1) the fares are for information only so don't apply immediately from 2 January
Is there a go live date announced yet? All I can find online is "later in January".
definitely something odd about the fares or their descriptions at least - for example Surbiton to Horley you'd do via Clapham Junction - yet it has the off peak fare at £8.60 or £6.50 "Using National Rail services only via Waterloo/Waterloo East" - which is an unlikely route!
If I've understood correctly, most people would change at Clapham Junction for Surbiton to Horley but those who want to save money will help clog up Waterloo and London Bridge a bit more. It's not like they have lots of passengers already!I don't think they'll make the go live date public until it's gone live. If there's a problem on launch day and have to postpone it, they won't want people turning up having previously told they can use Oyster going through the barriers with Oyster at Victoria and finding it isn't valid when they get to Gatwick!
Having looked at a few fares to Horley, it looks to me like the fares aren't route specific. It looks like there is a single set of fares that are being charged for off direct line of route journeys regardless of where your journey starts.
The avoiding Z1 National Rail only fare 11.40/8.60
The any zone LU/NR fare 12.70/8.70
Z1 National Rail only fare 10.50/6.50
Yes, it's very odd pricing. Is it the only Oyster fare where it's cheaper to go via zone 1 than avoid zone 1?
Yes, it's very odd pricing. Is it the only Oyster fare where it's cheaper to go via zone 1 than avoid zone 1?
I've been looking at the Gatwick fares, and they seem to me to be
National Rail* only from/thru Z1 14.00/8.00
National Rail* only avoiding Z1 11.40/8.60
LU/National Rail any zone 16.20/10.20
Gatwick Express 19.80
* excluding LO West Anglia stations which are charged the LU/NR any zone fare.
More odd pricing in that its cheaper to avoid Z1 in the peak, but more expensive off peak.
Is there a go live date announced yet? All I can find online is "later in January".
Has there ever been a journey for which you could use Oyster before that you can also get an Advance ticket for? Given there are loads from Gatwick Airport, can they still continue to claim that "The cheapest single fares are with Oyster" ?
GWR services between Redhill and Gatwick Airport don't appear in the 2016 tube and rail map.
It's unclear whether they'll actually accept Oyster and Contactless from 11th January.
GWR services between Redhill and Gatwick Airport don't appear in the 2016 tube and rail map.
It's unclear whether they'll actually accept Oyster and Contactless from 11th January.
They are obliged to accept it.GWR services between Redhill and Gatwick Airport don't appear in the 2016 tube and rail map.
It's unclear whether they'll actually accept Oyster and Contactless from 11th January.
That seems to directly contradict the following:In that scenario they will be charged the fare from BZ6 to Gatwick wherever they start. The mix mode would only make a difference if the travelcard didn't involve zones 1-2.
This is saying quite emphatically that "travelcards are not valid on Gatwick Express".. which I'm sure isn't true.GTR Fares Brief 2016/04 attached
My comment didn't explicitly refer to Gatwick Express. It does seem as though you are going to be screwed if you have a travelcard and use Gatwick Express. Better to use the almost identical Southern trains.That seems to directly contradict the following:
This is saying quite emphatically that "travelcards are not valid on Gatwick Express".. which I'm sure isn't true.
Quite. I do think that they are treading a very thin line by denying travelcards on Oyster being taken into consideration when travelcards on paper are allowed with BZ tickets. I'd be interested in a legal viewpoint on this point.The whole thing reads as expected really - "we really, really don't want people using oyster but we don't have a choice, so we're going to make it very complicated and expensive"
If the railcard discount is enabled on the Oyster card then it will be applied.I do wonder if oyster will automatically discount for railcards though....
That seems to directly contradict the following:
This is saying quite emphatically that "travelcards are not valid on Gatwick Express".. which I'm sure isn't true.
I wonder what happens if a customer with auto top-up and £11 credit touches in at Gatwick.
Or platform 13/14 at Victoria. I wonder if that scenario has been overlooked.
That is quite true. I needed something to be righteous about and apparently quoting you was the way to go about that..My comment didn't explicitly refer to Gatwick Express. It does seem as though you are going to be screwed if you have a travelcard and use Gatwick Express. Better to use the almost identical Southern trains.
Quite. I do think that they are treading a very thin line by denying travelcards on Oyster being taken into consideration when travelcards on paper are allowed with BZ tickets. I'd be interested in a legal viewpoint on this point.
Yes they should put that in their statement. I don't fully understand what you mean by 'leave it valid for most purposes' but again as to interpretation I read it as denial that a combination of travelcard + BZ ticket could be used.But travel cards 'on their own' still won't be valid. Should they put that in their statement, or leave it valid for most purposes?