Restriction on break of journey on return super off-peak

[Stargull]

I have an Oxford-Torquay super off-peak return, purchased as a mobile ticket from GWR. On the way back, I want to break my journey in Reading and return to Oxford the next day. I assumed that break of journey was ok on a return - National Rail say that

Break of journey is permitted on the return portion of a Super Off-Peak Return unless otherwise indicated by a restriction shown against the ticket's Restriction Code.

The restriction code is YP, which makes no mention of break of journey. However, the mobile ticket says 'A break of journey at intermediate stations is not permitted'. Am I right in thinking this means I can't stop in Reading?

Second, am I right in thinking that if I'd been sensible and bought a paper ticket, this restriction wouldn't have been added?

 

[Bletchleyite]

The only regular tickets that have BoJ restrictions on the return half are those with restriction 8A, which is a bizarre "non-restriction" that needs something to differentiate it from an Anytime.

I suspect this is wrong - but expect arguments...

 

[DaiGog]

YP does not restrict break of journey, so the only restriction is the departure time from Torquay (valid from 0905) on the return leg. Reading has an outward time restriction in that it's only valid 1010-1500 and after 1900, so while the return portion is valid, I would expect an argument if you travel before 1010 or between 1500 and 1900 from Reading.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

I have an Oxford-Torquay super off-peak return, purchased as a mobile ticket from GWR. On the way back, I want to break my journey in Reading and return to Oxford the next day. I assumed that break of journey was ok on a return - National Rail say that

Break of journey is permitted on the return portion of a Super Off-Peak Return unless otherwise indicated by a restriction shown against the ticket's Restriction Code.

The restriction code is YP, which makes no mention of break of journey. However, the mobile ticket says 'A break of journey at intermediate stations is not permitted'. Am I right in thinking this means I can't stop in Reading?

Second, am I right in thinking that if I'd been sensible and bought a paper ticket, this restriction wouldn't have been added?

Having just gone through the process of booking myself, no such restriction is advertised when buying the ticket, so there is no way it can be enforced - it simply isn't a term of the contract and any attempt to add it to the ticket is a unilateral variation of the contract, to which you have no obligation to agree.

Breaking your journey where it isn't permitted is purely a civil matter so even if you had been advised of the restriction prior to purchase, nothing more could be done than charging you the difference to the cheapest ticket available for immediate purchase that allows break of journey there... which would be the very Super Off-Peak ticket you hold!

Basically, they are on a hiding to nothing.

 

[yorkie]

I have an Oxford-Torquay super off-peak return, purchased as a mobile ticket from GWR. On the way back, I want to break my journey in Reading and return to Oxford the next day. I assumed that break of journey was ok on a return - National Rail say that

Break of journey is permitted on the return portion of a Super Off-Peak Return unless otherwise indicated by a restriction shown against the ticket's Restriction Code.

The restriction code is YP, which makes no mention of break of journey. However, the mobile ticket says 'A break of journey at intermediate stations is not permitted'. Am I right in thinking this means I can't stop in Reading?

Second, am I right in thinking that if I'd been sensible and bought a paper ticket, this restriction wouldn't have been added?

It sounds like the retailer has made an incorrect statement on the e-ticket. I suggest contacting GWR about this. I'd be curious to learn their response.

 

[Stargull]

I will do so...probably after I travel, though!

 

[Stargull]

It took more than a month, but GWR say (in an email to me):

You can take a break in your return journey, as long as the break is en-route and that you still travel on a Super Off-peak service.

So it looks like the e-ticket statement is incorrect. I've replied asking if they intend to fix this. There must be many less aware people than me who believe what the ticket tells them...

 

[Bletchleyite]

It's wrong. It is possible to restrict BoJ on the return half of (Super) Off Peaks, but the only restriction code I know of that does it is 8A, and even that might be a drafting error.

 

[northken]

This has been happening with the GWR app for over a year now. It says BoJ is prohibited on Anytimes as well. It's best ignored.

 

[Deerfold]

This has been happening with the GWR app for over a year now. It says BoJ is prohibited on Anytimes as well. It's best ignored.

Or, even better, corrected.

 

[Stargull]

GWR now say they may not be wrong after all.

I’m glad we were able to assist. To clarify, the statement on the m-ticket may not have actually been incorrect. Typically Super Off Peak Returns do allow a break of journey, but there are different rates of tickets which are more restrictive i.e. cheaper fares. If you are planning a break of journey, I would recommend speaking with our Customer Relations team on the above number, or speak to someone at the station who will be able to check your individual booking and confirm any restrictions.

I’ve replied asking them to check the booking I had and confirm it was eligible (it was a standard super off peak). It really annoys me they can misstate the conditions knowing the vast majority of people will believe their ticket.

 

[Gerald Fiennes]

Oh dear, 0/10 to GWR on this one. There are practically no super off peak return fares with BoJ restrictions on the return anywhere on the network, so the advice from Customer Services is unnecessarily complex. The Ticket Restriction code is all you need to work out what the restriction (if any is), and this is all the staff have to go on as well.
But the more fundamental error is, of course, the advice that there are such things as 'Super Off Peak Services' and, in theory, there are not. This is an ongoing problem. It's a simplification: most flows do indeed have common restrictions which create a bank of 'Super Off Peak Services' -- which is where this notion comes from. But the actual restriction on any journey is of course governed by the restrictions for the actual ticket bought, which aren't always the same as the common ones. Ie. the restrictions follow from the flow, not the train. This has been a fundamental principle for decades.
This problem of 'more restrictive conditions' with M-Tickets is the reason I am very reluctant to use them, on GWR or any operator, until the train companies unambiguously sort this issue out.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'm not convinced that there are any Super Off Peaks with BoJ blocked on the return half. The only restriction code I know of that still has it is 8A, which is the "unrestricted Saver" one used very rarely these days, mostly by TfW. This code is never used for Super Off Peak, only Off Peak.

The only ones I used to know of were some LM long distance fares, but these were changed to permit it on the return half years ago.

 

[Gerald Fiennes]

I'm not convinced that there are any Super Off Peaks with BoJ on the return half.

I stand corrected! Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I stand corrected! Thanks for the clarification.

I did of course mean "I'm not convinced that there are any Super Off Peaks with BoJ blocked on the return half." - have amended my post.