Should they make more Single carriage Trains like the 153?

[PYROOGOBBO]

they do look fun, But i do wonder if theres any lines or places that could use like, Single carriage trains maybe with more performance than 153's, or take any existing DMU and turn some into single carriage trains.

(i am very ignorant so forgive me :') )



Maybe the "Jigsaw" train could be something akin to a renewed 153, with a more powerful Engine (100mph Capability?) that can be joined together in times of higher usage on more rural lines, and then run single carriage when usage isn't as higher, Kinda like the 153, But maybe with more power And Cleaner, Maybe it could use something like the 185 has with an eco mode for when the power isn't as needed, and More powerful mode for like, Say if it could be used in times when a DMU is needing rescued/dragged? (mini locomotive?, heck maybe for the odd freight working thats like.. one or two containers)

I noticed in traveling from glasgow queen street to falkirk grahamston a few years ago when it was 156 operated that a single carriage easily could have carried the 10 or so people that were using it, So maybe the "jigsaw" train could be handy in times where there isnt as many passengers, thus allowing a lighter/more economical train to be used?

(please dont make fun of me ._.;; )

 

[30907]

No problem.
There are two reasons why single cars don't really work.
First, they now (rightly) need to be fully accessible and have two cabs, and that increases cost and reduces seating per vehicle.
Second, there are very few lines where the peak load can be conveyed in one car (there are some, certainly) so you would have to couple and uncouple at least twice a day and store the spare vehicles, both of which create staff costs and complicate working. That's out of favour now because most city termini are simply too busy to have trains sat around.
(By the way, that applies to any length unit - back in the 30s, the Southern routinely left 5 cars of an 8 coach train in the platforms at Victoria between the peaks - to the annoyance of passengers!)

 

[Dai Corner]

It's worth remembering that 153s started life as 2-car 155s and were converted to run as single cars.

TfW are running them in trains of three now.

 

[hexagon789]

Maybe the "Jigsaw" train could be something akin to a renewed 153, with a more powerful Engine (100mph Capability?) that can be joined together in times of higher usage on more rural lines, and then run single carriage when usage isn't as higher, Kinda like the 153,

Sounds similar to the original Class 175 plan, some of those were, in the initial stages of planning, going to be single car!

 

[Bevan Price]

Sounds similar to the original Class 175 plan, some of those were, in the initial stages of planning, going to be single car!

That would have been "fun", when, almost inevitably, a single 175 was sometimes provided for a peak hour Manchester - North Wales service.

 

[Whistler40145]

I can't think of many lines where a single unit would be of great benefit

 

[hexagon789]

That would have been "fun", when, almost inevitably, a single 175 was sometimes provided for a peak hour Manchester - North Wales service.

At least it would've a 100mph 'skateboard' rather than a 75mph one!

 

[markymark2000]

I don't think many more should be made for the reasons which others have stated about capacity at peak times. They could be used as doubles at peak and then split for off peak trips which don't take many passengers (with a 2 car unit then being sent to the depot for maintenance). Alternatively we probably have one or two examples of routes where 2 cars are needed but then they could split off to serve different destinations 1 car each. It just complicates things and very few lines could use a single 153 all day.

 

[Harpers Tate]

added to which....those routes where a single car might (at times, or always) be sufficient, are typically routes where the track isn't maintained for 100mph running. Much of what's left in Lincolnshire, for example. Even 75mph 153s often aren't allowed to run at their max.

 

[SeanG]

Furthermore, there may be lines where single 153s aelre suffucient (eg Heart of Wales or Bleanau Ffestiniog - don't shoot me down if these are incorrect), but by virtue of their low loadings, they have infrequent services and therefore few units are required.
I imagine that it is currently more operationally convenient and indeed cheaper to have a 2 car 150 (for example) carting around fresh air, than to have a further subfleet

 

[bussnapperwm]

I can't think of many lines where a single unit would be of great benefit

I can think of one (which is a single car unit, every 10 mins and a 23m platform) which works happily.

Stourbridge Town!

 

[Whistler40145]

I can think of one (which is a single car unit, every 10 mins and a 23m platform) which works happily.

Stourbridge Town!

That's not a DMU though

 

[Energy]

I can think of one (which is a single car unit, every 10 mins and a 23m platform) which works happily.

Stourbridge Town!

But could Stourbridge Town be better of with a tram train?

 

[D365]

But could Stourbridge Town be better of with a tram train?

Why fix something that isn’t broken? Unless you’re going to tack it on to the Midland Metro somehow.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Why fix something that isn’t broken? Unless you’re going to tack it on to the Midland Metro somehow.

If I was going to swap it for anything some sort of battery LRV charging at each end would be what I'd do. There's not a lot of point in having it street running as it already goes pretty much to the town centre as it is.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

But could Stourbridge Town be better of with a tram train?

Why fix something that isn’t broken? Unless you’re going to tack it on to the Midland Metro somehow.

Tram-trains seem to be the "flavour of the month" solution in search of a problem at the moment... even for places where the tram part has no prospect of being utilised. Not sure why, as the Rotherham trial hasn't exactly set the world on fire!

(To be fair it hasn't been a complete failure either, it just isn't the magic bullet).

 

[Energy]

Why fix something that isn’t broken? Unless you’re going to tack it on to the Midland Metro somehow.

It isn't broken, the PPMs are working fine, I'll be interested how they are later on in life as spare parts could be hard to source with so few PPMs in existence.
This is purely if new stock was needed a tram train could work better than a single car unit, especially as tram trains exist and nobody seems to want to build single car units.

If I was going to swap it for anything some sort of battery LRV charging at each end would be what I'd do. There's not a lot of point in having it street running as it already goes pretty much to the town centre as it is.

Yeah, it's such a short journey you could have it charge at each station quickly before making the journey.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It isn't broken, the PPMs are working fine, I'll be interested how they are later on in life as spare parts could be hard to source with so few PPMs in existence.
This is purely if new stock was needed a tram train could work better than a single car unit, especially as tram trains exist and nobody seems to want to build single car units.

Single car units no, but a 2-car Stadler FLIRT would have a similar capacity to a non-PRM 153.

 

[Energy]

Single car units no, but a 2-car Stadler FLIRT would have a similar capacity to a non-PRM 153.

Yeah, and they offer battery flirts.

 

[D365]

It isn't broken, the PPMs are working fine, I'll be interested how they are later on in life as spare parts could be hard to source with so few PPMs in existence.

The Parry People Mover company is responsible for operating the Class 139s, so unless the company goes under I'm sure it won't be a problem.

 

[Energy]

The Parry People Mover company is responsible for operating the Class 139s, so unless the company goes under I'm sure it won't be a problem.

Yeah, if they weren't operating the service I doubt they would be doing to well right now.

 

[D365]

Yeah, if they weren't operating the service I doubt they would be doing to well right now.

I've just been having a read through their newsletters, they have some very interesting proposals for the coming decade. So in terms of manufacturing single car trains, if a serious proposal can be developed (e.g. new services on reopened lines in the West Midlands), PPM could be a contender.

 

[Energy]

I've just been having a read through their newsletters, they have some very interesting proposals for the coming decade. So in terms of manufacturing single car trains, if a serious proposal can be developed (e.g. new services on reopened lines in the West Midlands), PPM could be a contender.

Maybe but train lines are expensive to build, nobody would want to fund building a train line which doesn't have enough demand for 2 carriages.

 

[bussnapperwm]

Maybe but train lines are expensive to build, nobody would want to fund building a train line which doesn't have enough demand for 2 carriages.

The one line that PPM have been proposing only needs platforms. It usually only sees 3 freight a day at the moment. (Stourbridge to Round Oak - although there would no doubt be some permissive working at Stourbridge required in order to work around either the WMR services or the 139s!

And it also depends on how frequent the proposed Service would be too (a double PPM every 20 minutes would be different to a 153 every hour for instance.)