Super off peak day travelcard

[trainclueless]

Have to travel into London tomorrow from Stevenage. Normally I buy a Stevenage to London Blackfriars ticket which would cost be approximately £30+ open return, and then hop on a tube and pay as I go with a debit card.

Played around with fares on TrainLine, and looked at fares from Stevenage to Finsbury Park (my closest London zone station) and see if I could get a travel card instead as I will be doing a few tube journeys tomorrow. I saw that there is an option to buy a Super Off Peak day travel card instead for a lovely price of £31.70, why would this be cheaper than my Thameslink/train only ticket to Blackfriars?

What is the difference between this and the more expensive Anytime Day Travelcard? Can I go for this cheaper off peak version - is it due to a quirk that I am not travelling into any London Terminals at peak time?

I plan to leave London after 9pm so I know that leg of the journey will be off peak. Just not sure if that ticket will be valid for my travel into London in the morning.

 

[Hadders]

Stevenage is my local station so I am vary familiar with the ticketing options.

What time are you departing Stevenage?

A Stevenage to London Thameslink (valid to Blackfriars) ticket costs:
Anytime £29.60
Off Peak £23.80 (valid any train after 09:30)
Super Off Peak £23.50 (not valid on trains due to arrive at London Terminals before 10:55, evening restrictions apply to the return portion)

A Stevenage to London Zones 1-6 Travelcard costs:
Anytime £41.10
Off Peak £32.70 (valid any train after 09:30)
Super Off Peak £31.70 (not valid on trains due to arrive at London Terminals before 10:55, evening restrictions apply to the return portion)

Travelcards on a weekday from Stevenage are generally poor value, depending on how many journeys and the zones you're travelling to when in London.

For completeness if I'm doing a 'split' with a ticket from Stevenage to London and then using PAYG then I normally get a ticket to London Terminals (same restrictions as above) that costs:

Anytime £27.60
Off Peak £21.80
Super Off Peak £21.50

You can 'split' at Finsbury Park where the cost is Anytime £27.60/Off Peak £21.10 (no super off peak option). I avoid buying tickets to Finsbury Park because while it is a good option to interchange to the Underground, you're better off with a London Terminals ticket as this gives you the option to cartch a train to/from Kings Cross/St Pancras without having to alight at Finsbury Park to touch out.

Finally, all the above fares are valid on bothe GTR and LNER trains. LNER do have some slightly cheaper LNER only fares but I avoid these because there are relatively few LNER trains and given the very small saving my view is theyt are best avoided given their lack of flexinility.

 

[trainclueless]

Thanks @Hadders

For tomorrow, I’m looking at the 7:31 train that gets into Finsbury Park (which I don’t think counts as a London terminal) at 7:52. I am planning to get the super off peak travel card for travel on the tube but I think this is where my plans will come unstuck - I want to go from Finsbury to London Victoria on the tube but I think my super off peak travel card won’t let me do this as it terminates at a London Terminal? Or I can do so as I am getting off at the tube station, not national rail station?

Just to be clear I am looking at the Stevenage to London zone 1-6 card, super off peak at £31.70

 

[Hadders]

You can't use the super off peak travelcard at 07:30 on a Friday morning from Stevenage.

I'd purchase an Anytime Day return from Stevenage to London Terminals then use contactless from Finsbury Park to Victoria.

Finsbury Park to Victoria will be off peak rate all day on Friday due to the current TfL promotion.

 

[trainclueless]

You can't use the super off peak travelcard at 07:30 on a Friday morning from Stevenage.

I'd purchase an Anytime Day return from Stevenage to London Terminals then use contactless from Finsbury Park to Victoria.

Finsbury Park to Victoria will be off peak rate all day on Friday due to the current TfL promotion.

Thanks, I did think it’s too good to be true for a weekday rate! I was just confused as to why I have the option of buying the super off peak travel card despite stating that I wish to travel at peak times on a weekday. I thought it was because I am getting off the Thameslink train at Finsbury Park (so not a London Terminal and so perhaps qualifying for some weird discount….)

I am glad I checked because most people would just go for the cheaper option without questioning.

 

[Hadders]

Interestingly, Trainline is misbehaving because it is selling the Super Off Peak Travelcard for the 07:31 train from Stevenage.

Officially if you have an itinerary then teh ticket is valid. That said, good luck in getting through the gate line at Stevenage with a Super Off Peak Travelcard at 07:31 on a Friday morning.

 

[trainclueless]

Interestingly, Trainline is misbehaving because it is selling the Super Off Peak Travelcard for the 07:31 train from Stevenage.

Officially if you have an itinerary then teh ticket is valid. That said, good luck in getting through the gate line at Stevenage with a Super Off Peak Travelcard at 07:31 on a Friday morning.



View attachment 157881

Yes that’s the ticket I see online as well on the National Rail website which was why I thought I could potentially save some money.

You’re right though, very likely for the gates to not open and I’ll need to ask the staff…. And then find out I had the wrong ticket all along!

Maybe I’ll wait till I get to the station tomorrow and buy it there…

 

[Watershed]

The reason why the Super Off-Peak Day Travelcard is offered is because Thameslink have made some quite significant omissions in the way they've set up the time restrictions in the industry data, used by journey planners to determine when tickets are valid.

Essentially, restrictions can be set based on the time you depart a particular station, the time you alight at a particular station, or the time a train you use reaches its destination. In this case, the 07:31, 08:31 etc. services from Stevenage are - unusually - terminating at Three Bridges today (due to Thameslink's "industrial action short of a strike" timetable), and you're alighting at Finsbury Park.

The data for outward portion of a ticket with this restriction code (TN) only has restrictions on arrivals at a handful of stations; as you can see, there are no restrictions on departing Stevenage, alighting at Finsbury Park, or on the arrival time of trains that terminate at Three Bridges. Presumably they have overlooked the fact that Thameslink services through London may terminate at places other than Brighton, Horsham, Sevenoaks or East Croydon...



This therefore has nothing to do with Trainline - they are acting entirely in accordance with the industry data, which doesn't apply any time restrictions to this particular scenario. Indeed, any other online retailer would offer you the same ticket - for example TrainSplit:


Or even Thameslink's own website:


If you bought a ticket in conjunction with an itinerary for one of those trains, you'd be contractually entitled to use them. In practice, as @Hadders says, you are highly likely to encounter issues at the barriers but if you were charged for a new ticket, you'd be entitled to claim this back from Thameslink (as well as Delay Repay, if you were sufficiently delayed through being forced to miss a train).

 

[Hadders]

The reason why the Super Off-Peak Day Travelcard is offered is because Thameslink have made some quite significant omissions in the way they've set up the time restrictions in the industry data, used by journey planners to determine when tickets are valid.

Essentially, restrictions can be set based on the time you depart a particular station, the time you alight at a particular station, or the time a train you use reaches its destination. In this case, the 07:31, 08:31 etc. services from Stevenage are - unusually - terminating at Three Bridges today (due to Thameslink's "industrial action short of a strike" timetable), and you're alighting at Finsbury Park.

The data for outward portion of a ticket with this restriction code (TN) only has restrictions on arrivals at a handful of stations; as you can see, there are no restrictions on departing Stevenage, alighting at Finsbury Park, or on the arrival time of trains that terminate at Three Bridges. Presumably they have overlooked the fact that Thameslink services through London may terminate at places other than Brighton, Horsham, Sevenoaks or East Croydon...

View attachment 157884

This therefore has nothing to do with Trainline - they are acting entirely in accordance with the industry data, which doesn't apply any time restrictions to this particular scenario. Indeed, any other online retailer would offer you the same ticket - for example TrainSplit:
View attachment 157886

Or even Thameslink's own website:
View attachment 157885

If you bought a ticket in conjunction with an itinerary for one of those trains, you'd be contractually entitled to use them. In practice, as @Hadders says, you are highly likely to encounter issues at the barriers but if you were charged for a new ticket, you'd be entitled to claim this back from Thameslink (as well as Delay Repay, if you were sufficiently delayed through being forced to miss a train).

That's interesting. I had a quick look at a webtis site last night and couldn't get me to offer the Super Off Peak Travelcard which is why I suspected Trainline were up to something.

As well as the issue of getting through the barriers at Stevenage the OP would also face the issue of getting out at Victoria.

 

[Watershed]

the OP would also face the issue of getting out at Victoria.

I think they might be OK on that front, as whilst the TfL off-peak "trial" doesn't officially include paper tickets, I believe Tube ticket machines (POMs) are issuing Off-Peak Day Travelcards (ODTs) all day on Fridays. So you'd assume that National Rail-issued ODTs would also be accepted by LU barriers all day on Fridays?

 

[Hadders]

I think they might be OK on that front, as whilst the TfL off-peak "trial" doesn't officially include paper tickets, I believe Tube ticket machines (POMs) are issuing Off-Peak Day Travelcards (ODTs) all day on Fridays. So you'd assume that National Rail-issued ODTs would also be accepted by LU barriers all day on Fridays?

Good point! I'm losing track of the days this week....