Tipping coal wagons

[MaxB]

I have received an email which says "The railway coal wagons would come in onto the sidings and unload coal from the coal wagons and apparently the coal wagons had a metal wheel on the wagon which you would turn and tip the coal wagon sideways to empty the coal out. Then the coal would be collected by the coalman who would put the coal in 100 cwt sacks and would put it on his horse drawn coal cart to deliver to his customers for their coal fires in their homes. The coal wagons were pushed backwards into the sidings at Bromley South by a steam powered shunter."
I attach a picture from 1921. So far as I know only ordinary 16t side loading wagons were used (or existed). Does anyone have any ideas what the emailer is referring to? I believe it to be a yarn but has the wagon in the middle got some sort of central handle - maybe you know more? Help appreciated.

 

[PaulLothian]

Looks more like the end bracket of a tarpaulin rail, and, if so, not a coal wagon. I have never heard of the mechanical arrangement mentioned, and assume your correspondent meant a one hundredweight sack - more manageable!

 

[Wagonshop]

I have no knowledge of coal wagons of this type. I worked as station shunter visiting station yards all the wagons were unloaded by a grab bucket. Or the coal men would drop a door then bag it up in bags. Thats the 1960s
I then worked as depot foreman of a wagon repair shop . We did have coal wagons that had bottom discharge , but worked by a leaver.
The only vehicles that had wheels to discharge a load were ballast hoppers the wheel would control the flow.
I did shunt the coal yard at Petts Wood very near you photo

 

[Ploughman]

I have no knowledge of coal wagons of this type. I worked as station shunter visiting station yards all the wagons were unloaded by a grab bucket. Or the coal men would drop a door then bag it up in bags. Thats the 1960s
I then worked as depot foreman of a wagon repair shop . We did have coal wagons that had bottom discharge , but worked by a leaver.
The only vehicles that had wheels to discharge a load were ballast hoppers the wheel would control the flow.
I did shunt the coal yard at Petts Wood very near you photo

The side tipping ballast wagons would be MERMAIDS or predecessors.
These originally tipped to either side by use of a large hand wheel, later replaced in the 1980s with a portable powerpack to tip the body.
Photos available on Paul Bartletts wagon photo pages.

 

[MaxB]

Looks more like the end bracket of a tarpaulin rail, and, if so, not a coal wagon. I have never heard of the mechanical arrangement mentioned, and assume your correspondent meant a one hundredweight sack - more manageable!

Good thought, thanks.

I have no knowledge of coal wagons of this type. I worked as station shunter visiting station yards all the wagons were unloaded by a grab bucket. Or the coal men would drop a door then bag it up in bags. Thats the 1960s
I then worked as depot foreman of a wagon repair shop . We did have coal wagons that had bottom discharge , but worked by a leaver.
The only vehicles that had wheels to discharge a load were ballast hoppers the wheel would control the flow.
I did shunt the coal yard at Petts Wood very near you photo

This is what I would have thought - thanks for the information.

The side tipping ballast wagons would be MERMAIDS or predecessors.
These originally tipped to either side by use of a large hand wheel, later replaced in the 1980s with a portable powerpack to tip the body.
Photos available on Paul Bartletts wagon photo pages.

Thanks.

 

[Watford West]

My Dad owned a coal business during the 50s and 60s, and most of that time his coal came in by rail, and as Wagonshop said above, the coal merchant would simply open the side door of the wagon and unload the coal that way. This was always known as 'landing', and would entail getting his lorry as close as possible to the side of the wagon, dropping the door, then shovelling a truck full onto the lorry, then driving it over to the 'bays' where it was shovelled off. Talk about labour intensive!. Dad also used to tell me in the Winter, if it had been raining and ice had formed, you could open a wagon door, and the whole contents would just stay there looking at you as they were frozen solid. He had some pickaxes converted to what they called 'coal knockers' (more of a large coal hammer) and these were used to break the coal up. I remember reading about the same problem - albeit iron ore - on the Duluth Missabe and Iron Range Railway in the USA, but they used steam lances to thaw the wagons out. It would have been fun seeing my Dad with one of those!

 

[Wagonshop]

Frozen coal was a major problem with bottom discharge wagons.
MGR wagons would arr at power stn with 33t of solid coal grit/dust. A problem no more

 

[Irascible]

The only thing I can think of would be an actual wagon tippler, which is certainly not something you'd see in a random goods yard - but there's no location given for this.

 

[30907]

The only thing I can think of would be an actual wagon tippler, which is certainly not something you'd see in a random goods yard - but there's no location given for this.

If you mean the OP's description, then they specifically refer to Bromley South (shown in the photo) - and I agree, you wouldn't have found a tippler there!

 

[Gloster]

The tipplers for coal wagons were designed to empty the wagons through the end door by lifting one end of the wagon. They were mostly at ports, power stations and a few major industries, although a few very large coal depots had them. It is highly unlikely that Bromley South had a tippler.

The fitting on the end of the wagon does look like the mounting for a tarpaulin.

 

[Irascible]

There were a few rotary ones, but the only ones I can picture right now are related to coaling towers - I'm sure I've read about more at some point though. 1921 in Bromley you'd be lucky to get more than a shovel, I'd imagine...

 

[Wagonshop]

Looked at the photo in more detail on my laptop
The wagon in the distant under the high signal post I am sure is hybar high 5 plank goods wagon not used for coal more general goods the bar could be lifted up and the load tarped over.

 

[Flying Phil]

Some interesting stories of coal wagons on here. I am part of the "Windcutter" group on the Great Central Railway and we restore and look after 36 16T mineral wagons. Despite being a "Standard" design there are so many detail differences each one is slightly different!

In addition to the end "Tipping" of coal wagons, many were used to transport locomotive coal and were sent up those concrete "Coaling Towers" which were a prominent feature of many large engine sheds throughout the British Isles. At the top I believe they were turned over to unload into the coal storage hoppers.
I wonder if this rotation also helped to ensure that the bearings received some oil, when the oiler pads were old and clagged up?

 

[Wagonshop]

Wagons were reoiled after tipping.
Depots had oilers who would top up axles. Pad exams would be done at depots. Some wagon deopts had cleaning systems for axle boxs. New Pads were soaked then left on draining racks. Pre 1960 lots of wagons had grease boxs .
Oilers would chalk the date on the sole bar. If a Pad exam was done the date was panted on in the repair pannel in paint with depot no