Three Minutes Past The Hour

[bb21]

Really? When I complained to Uno (a bus operator in Herts) that it had buses leaving 3-5 minutes early, I was told by them in an email (which I must still have archived) that they're allowed to leave up to 3 minutes early. I thought this was quite unlikely.

If it is a big problem then that needs to be reported to the Traffic Commissioner. As you know, this is definitely not permitted so if it is part of the operational culture then they might suddenly find that they are in a dodgy place with the authorities.

 

[Welshman]

I remember the days before D-Reg when buses running early, would often wait one stop before the terminus until they were on time then go into the terminus, which nowadays doesnt happen when drivers do arrive early at the terminus.

Some drivers take unofficial extended layover breaks, & still end up on time or early at the other end of the route.

I'm afraid I'm old enough to remember the timing clocks situated at a bus stop in an attempt to regulate the running of the bus.
They were like the old "clocking-in" clocks, and the conductor had a card which was inserted into the machine and the time was stamped on it.

They didn't seem to be very effective though. At quiet times, the bus would run past all the previous bus stops, wait at the timing-point [usually the driver and conductor having a quick smoke], and then continue to run fast into town, still arriving early!

 

[jon0844]

If it is a big problem then that needs to be reported to the Traffic Commissioner. As you know, this is definitely not permitted so if it is part of the operational culture then they might suddenly find that they are in a dodgy place with the authorities.

Uno was one of the (if not THE) first operators to get a GPS based system that tracks the buses - and tells drivers when to depart, when they're running early and how many minutes they're late. Since this system has been used (for over a year now), I've not seen buses running early - and have also been on buses that have waited at timing stages.

I had written to Herts County Council to complain before, so perhaps this helped Uno get to be the first one fitted with the system. Meanwhile, Uno solved its problem of having a bus leaving people at the train station because it ran early - it adjusted the timetable to make it so the bus called one minute after the train is scheduled to arrive. Given the time needed to leave the station (over a bridge), it's now impossible to use that particular service at all!

Given HCC subsidises the service, I guess they're not bothered about picking anyone up. But, it's odd that the timetable change was approved in the first place.

 

[bb21]

Given HCC subsidises the service, I guess they're not bothered about picking anyone up. But, it's odd that the timetable change was approved in the first place.

The cynic in me thinks it is a way to dumb down the service and then legitimately withdraw the route claiming that no one uses it.

 

[jon0844]

The cynic in me thinks it is a way to dumb down the service and then legitimately withdraw the route claiming that no one uses it.

The service concerned (602) is a very popular service for Uno, but Hatfield station is only a few stops from the end of the route (the depot - which happens to be at the end of my road). As a result, drivers often get there very early at night and most or possibly all passengers have alighted in the town or back at the University.

Drivers never want to wait if they are 5 or even 10 minutes early - and many even skipped the stops completely. How do I know they did this? Because I'd been on the same buses when coming home from St Albans and been the last passenger on it by the time it reached Hatfield town centre, where the drivers asked if I wanted the station - and upon saying no, proudly said they'd get me home quicker - by taking a short cut back to the business park/depot.

Obviously they just wanted to get back and sign off quicker (after 10pm I'm certain every driver was clocking off from this service) and I bit my lip as I didn't fancy arguing about going to the station for the benefit of people - like me - who might have been waiting. I never said anything about the speed of the buses either, which explains why they were often so early at night. 45-50mph in a 30mph (Wellfield Road) was standard. Those speedos aren't exactly small when you're sitting with the dash in full view!

Still, the early running problems have seemingly gone away now thanks to the new technology - and the fact the bus is no longer timed around any trains means the driver can probably get away without waiting too long. I'm sure the speed of the driving is recorded too, so I bet that's why the buses don't race along anymore.

However, I can definitely see Uno arguing to curtail the bus service from the University and skipping the town/station - although that might mean a bit less subsidy from Herts County Council!

 

[Schnellzug]

The service concerned (602) is a very popular service for Uno, but Hatfield station is only a few stops from the end of the route (the depot - which happens to be at the end of my road). As a result, drivers often get there very early at night and most or possibly all passengers have alighted in the town or back at the University.

Drivers never want to wait if they are 5 or even 10 minutes early - and many even skipped the stops completely. How do I know they did this? Because I'd been on the same buses when coming home from St Albans and been the last passenger on it by the time it reached Hatfield town centre, where the drivers asked if I wanted the station - and upon saying no, proudly said they'd get me home quicker - by taking a short cut back to the business park/depot.

Oh, that was another thing they were notorious for, in Watford they'd sometimes, when (not if) they were running late, take a short cut down the main road rather than go round past Watford High St and Bushey stations.

 

[jon0844]

As I said before, I don't regard them as a proper bus company. It's a company that ran buses for the University and suddenly managed to grab loads of contracts from HCC - often forcing out Arriva by bidding just a few quid less.

A conspiracy theorist might wonder if someone within Herts County Council was giving them some sort of guidance on what to bid.

This is the same company that told me that they were going to stop accepting my PlusBus season ticket as they didn't make enough money and told me to buy one of their season tickets. This was despite having at least one bus driving all covered in vinyls to promote the PlusBus scheme and Intalink partnership!

It's also the same company that had one driver getting out to start kicking at an Arriva bus that wasn't moving (it was picking up passengers) and another that got really angry when I said another driver had left early - so he told another passing driver to run me over when I got off! Thankfully the other driver was 'what the hell?' and after my complaint, he's no longer working for them - apparently due to a short temper that had got him into trouble with other incidents.

Anyway - sorry for taking this a bit off topic now!

 

[Schnellzug]

Well, on the subject of either overly precise or rather vague timetables, the "First" bus company round our way seem to have decided to go for the latter approach, and I can't say I blame them considering how difficult they find it to keep to a timetable. In the new timetable beginning later in July, they're saying, for our local route, "0900, 0910, then at frequent intervals until 1300," then "about every 12 minutes" until 1900. Meanwhile service 1 is 0838, 0847, 0856, "then a frequent service" until 1619. But coming back, it's "at frequent intervals" until 1805. Is there a subtle difference between the two, I wonder?

 

[trentside]

Had an interesting experience with a local independent bus company today.

They have a few runs that they use as positioning for school contracts and list the timetables on their website as 'available for public use'. Despite this, the driver was adamant that he was only allowed to carry the public to a point short of my destination - he was very polite and friendly, and his duty sheet backed him up. The timetable on the companies website and on Traveline disagree though.

 

[Schnellzug]

Had an interesting experience with a local independent bus company today.

They have a few runs that they use as positioning for school contracts and list the timetables on their website as 'available for public use'. Despite this, the driver was adamant that he was only allowed to carry the public to a point short of my destination - he was very polite and friendly, and his duty sheet backed him up. The timetable on the companies website and on Traveline disagree though.

i have wondered abotu that, actually. You will see schools shown as destiantions in the public timetable; so does that mean that any passenger is entitled to expect to be able to go there? Should there not be a note saying "School children only" at these points?

 

[trentside]

i have wondered abotu that, actually. You will see schools shown as destiantions in the public timetable; so does that mean that any passenger is entitled to expect to be able to go there? Should there not be a note saying "School children only" at these points?

The destination I wanted to go to was before the bus actually reached the school, but apparently it served another school not shown in the timetable. My issue was more that the whole timetable was listed as a normal public service on their website.

Stagecoach allow normal passengers to travel on all their school routes for which they publish timetables as far as I'm aware. My village has a secondary school in it that is served by a variation of our local route, which takes a more circuitous route into town - I've used this on several occasions now with no problems at all.

 

[gnolife]

I know that Stagecoach Manchester tend to turf people off the morning 312 (Stockport to Handforth Dean) that instead terminates at St James' School on Stanley Road, where the bus would normally turn off to go to Handforth Dean.