Labour could be planning to allow public sector to bid for franchises

[Railsigns]

Have you got any stats for the size of this majority? I was under the impression the majority of the public didn't care enough or understand fully the way the railways are run to make such a statement but I am open to be shown otherwise.

See this. Even 52% of Tory voters support rail renationalisation.

 

[muddythefish]

The Conservatives will earnestly hope that this will be the case, as the "Communist under the bed" adage will be milked for all it is worth.

Just as much as they hope that the current Labour Leader of the Opposition will stay in power.

Only by the right wing press.

Like the electricity, water and gas industries, sensible folk regret the day the railways were sold off to the private sector.

I wouldn't underestimate Ed Miliband by the way.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Only by the right wing press.

Like the electricity, water and gas industries, sensible folk regret the day the railways were sold off to the private sector.

I wouldn't underestimate Ed Miliband by the way.

What would you classify as the left-wing press ? Do you ever remember the Reynolds News and its original link to the Co-operative movement ?

I still think that the wrong Miliband was made the leader of the Labour Party.

 

[muz379]

See this. Even 52% of Tory voters support rail renationalisation.

That is actually pretty encouraging , never realized the majority was so clear across the board . I thought if there was a majority it would be labour voters that would skew the stats . Thanks

 

[Squaddie]

Have you got any stats for the size of this majority ? , I was under the impression the majority of the public didn't care enough or understand fully the way the railways are run to make such a statement but I am open to be shown otherwise.

It's almost certainly true that the public doesn't understand the way in which the railways are run - and, to be fair, who does? - but they know a failing system run by profit-hungry private companies when they see one and they want it to change.

 

[muz379]

It's almost certainly true that the public doesn't understand the way in which the railways are run - and, to be fair, who does? - but they know a failing system run by profit-hungry private companies when they see one and they want it to change.

Oh I agree cue the calls for the renationalisation of the utilities industry . I just never realized that people beyond those that commute on the railways realized it was an important national asset or cared enough about the railway .

 

[muddythefish]

What would you classify as the left-wing press ? Do you ever remember the Reynolds News and its original link to the Co-operative movement ?

I still think that the wrong Miliband was made the leader of the Labour Party.

I don't remember Reynolds News but is that relevant ?

As for the "Reds under the Beds" tag no doubt the Daily Mail and Sun and the Telegraph to a lesser degree will trot out that sort of line in the run-up to the election but with union membership on the rise they will be swimming against the tide.

After 30 plus years of employers having their own way it's time organised labour made a comeback.

Agree about Miliband but I still wouldn't underestimate Ed.

 

[Manchester77]

Would be interesting if we see some kind of renationalisation under a labour government; it'd probably make them one of the busiest governments since Attlee's!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Here we go. A whole fleet of nationalised narrow boats to look forward to..

 

[fowler9]

I don't remember Reynolds News but is that relevant ?

As for the "Reds under the Beds" tag no doubt the Daily Mail and Sun and the Telegraph to a lesser degree will trot out that sort of line in the run-up to the election but with union membership on the rise they will be swimming against the tide.

After 30 plus years of employers having their own way it's time organised labour made a comeback.

Agree about Miliband but I still wouldn't underestimate Ed.

Completely agree. Some of the things I have seen and heard with recent employers are shocking.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

As for the "Reds under the Beds" tag no doubt the Daily Mail and Sun and the Telegraph to a lesser degree will trot out that sort of line in the run-up to the election but with union membership on the rise they will be swimming against the tide.

Perhaps once this utopian heaven comes to pass, will all males of voting age be expected to have Ed Miliband haircuts ?.....

The England cricket team will have be careful when they decide to bat in the early matches....Remember "All out May Day"....

 

[muz379]

Here we go. A whole fleet of nationalised narrow boats to look forward to..

as oppose the privatized fleet of narrow boats

 

[Dave1987]

See this. Even 52% of Tory voters support rail renationalisation.

Most people are also naive to the consequences of public ownership and believe the railways will run perfectly under state control. Ow the dreamland they are in!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

as oppose the privatized fleet of narrow boats

I am enjoying this repartee...All off to the Norfolk Broads for a communal ride on the SS Pol Pot, captained by Captain Putin...

 

[muz379]

I am enjoying this repartee...All off to the Norfolk Broads for a communal ride on the SS Pol Pot, captained by Captain Putin...

Thats if the privatised railbusses can get all the poor down to Norfolk

 

[yorksrob]

Most people are also naive to the consequences of public ownership and believe the railways will run perfectly under state control. Ow the dreamland they are in!

No more so than those with a messianic belief that private ownership is the solution to all ills.

 

[Railsigns]

Most people are also naive to the consequences of public ownership and believe the railways will run perfectly under state control. Ow the dreamland they are in!

Everyone's out of step apart from you, eh?

When did anyone ever claim the railways will run "perfectly" under public ownership? Just one reference will do, thanks.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

No more so than those with a messianic belief that private ownership is the solution to all ills.

To make a comparison of what is happening in real life in the Middle East, would any of the forum membership have a British ISIS-run state, when making decisions between public or private ownership ?

 

[Gareth Marston]

To make a comparison of what is happening in real life in the Middle East, would any of the forum membership have a British ISIS-run state, when making decisions between public or private ownership ?

As a leading member in the Campaign for Real Ale Montgomeryshire branch ISIS is wholly rejected no matter what they did with the railway

 

[Dave1987]

No more so than those with a messianic belief that private ownership is the solution to all ills.

Seems to be doing pretty dam well at the moment, I read recently that there's been another big rise in passengers numbers this year. If passenger numbers were dropping I could maybe give you some credence.

 

[SS4]

Seems to be doing pretty dam well at the moment, I read recently that there's been another big rise in passengers numbers this year. If passenger numbers were dropping I could maybe give you some credence.

The age old question to that is are passenger numbers rising because of privatisation or because of other factors like population increase, petrol costs increase, environmental choice or all of the above?

 

[Railsigns]

Seems to be doing pretty dam well at the moment; I read recently that there's been another big rise in passengers numbers this year. If passenger numbers were dropping I could maybe give you some credence.

Passenger numbers are also rising in Northern Ireland, where the railways remain in public ownership. It's funny how you always cite the rise in passenger numbers as "proof" of privatisation's success but fail to mention the massive increase in subsidies that taxpayers are contributing to the privatised railway (contrary to Tory promises that subsidies would fall).

 

[Dave1987]

The age old question to that is are passenger numbers rising because of privatisation or because of other factors like population increase, petrol costs increase, environmental choice or all of the above?

Yes I will give you that, but when you get into public ownership extra costs come into play like having to have at least three bidders for every contract that might be given out instead of just going to a local supplier. I think giving DOR that chance to bid for franchises gives the private sector a real challenge to provide value for money without having all the caveats that come with public ownership. I'm startled but I actually agree with Labour this one.

 

[Squaddie]

Seems to be doing pretty dam well at the moment, I read recently that there's been another big rise in passengers numbers this year. If passenger numbers were dropping I could maybe give you some credence.

Tens of millions of people have bank accounts and use electricity every day. By your logic, that must mean that the banks and power companies are more popular than any other organisations in the entire country...

 

[yorksrob]

Seems to be doing pretty dam well at the moment, I read recently that there's been another big rise in passengers numbers this year. If passenger numbers were dropping I could maybe give you some credence.

It has, but look where we've had to come from to get there. Up until Hatfield, the privatised railway was effectively sweating the assets and its only since then that the Government has been coughing up the necessary funds to keep it ticking over. But fortunately, as you say, the industry has managed to get a grip on things since then.

I could perhaps give you some credence if publicly owned railways such as LU and NIR had been experiencing falling passenger numbers over the same time.

 

[Simon11]

What is needed is a big piece of analysis, to compare the UK Railways to the German railways which are similar- large changes in NIR railways, similar to Spain's over the past few years.

We should then exclude one off major changes and then remove the impact of population increases, employment % etc.

Only then, can we identify over the last 15 years, whether there has been an positive uplift.

To Yorksrob post- We would be looking to see if the UK growth in journeys/ revenue is higher than Germany's, rather than seeing UK having positive growth & another country negative growth= Private operators doing a better job.

 

[al.currie93]

The Labour proposal is a step towards nationalisation so I approve of that

However, it is essentially the same as letting the government enter their own competition... effectively like Alan Suger entering himself into The Apprentice...

No more so than those with a messianic belief that private ownership is the solution to all ills.

There does seem to be a lot of that, the whole Private = Good and State = Evil... I just wonder why?!

And don't get me started on the private electricity companies!

 

[David Barrett]

There was something of a boom in passenger numbers in the second half 1980s associated with the increase of economic activity at the time, followed to an extent by freight. I hadn't realised that we were privatised as long ago as 1986!

Cause and correlation are two different things altogether and the observation of one does not necessarily imply the other.

 

[Manchester77]

I think numbers started to go up as things like sprinterisation and ECML electrification started to happen.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

The Labour proposal is a step towards nationalisation so I approve of that

Why is it never the airlines that they seek to nationalise ?