Everyone to their own, if I wanted to drive trains for enjoyment or a hobby I would go to a heritage railway and go when I wanted to, maybe the therapy bit was a bit harsh but I just hate working and anything I did, except possibly sitting about making notes on female behaviour on a beach would be a good job for me as long as it paid £50k a year. I don't like getting up at silly o'clock, I don't like abuse from passengers, I don't like the cold, I don't like walking on eggshells and to sum it up I haven't got a passion for trains. If you are a spotter (enthusiast) and work on the railway as a driver then fair enough maybe you enjoy it but for me I am counting down the years, months, weeks, days, minutes and seconds till I can afford to retire. There isn't anything wrong with enjoying your work but in the mess rooms I attend I would say 90% of the drivers are always moaning about this and that so maybe there is a 10% that go to work for love and not money. Are there any of you on here that would do the job for no pay if you were really rich?
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Drivers pay increases
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Everyone to their own, if I wanted to drive trains for enjoyment or a hobby I would go to a heritage railway and go when I wanted to, maybe the therapy bit was a bit harsh but I just hate working and anything I did, except possibly sitting about making notes on female behaviour on a beach would be a good job for me as long as it paid £50k a year. I don't like getting up at silly o'clock, I don't like abuse from passengers, I don't like the cold, I don't like walking on eggshells and to sum it up I haven't got a passion for trains. If you are a spotter (enthusiast) and work on the railway as a driver then fair enough maybe you enjoy it but for me I am counting down the years, months, weeks, days, minutes and seconds till I can afford to retire. There isn't anything wrong with enjoying your work but in the mess rooms I attend I would say 90% of the drivers are always moaning about this and that so maybe there is a 10% that go to work for love and not money. Are there any of you on here that would do the job for no pay if you were really rich?
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RailUK Forums
In all the jobs I;ve ever done, on and off the railway, I'd say 90% of the people employed spent at least 50% of their time moaning about their job.
I don't think it's very unusual. As far as I've seen over the course of my working life, very few people enjoy whatever it is that they do, and even fewer do their job because they love it.
The reality is that people work for the money, to be able to live and buy the things they need and want. There are some good points to every job, and many bad points. From an outsider's perspective, I'd say that one of the good things about train driving is the pay, and I don't object to the salaries drivers receive at all, given the numerous downsides to the job that you've touched on here.
I don't think it's very unusual. As far as I've seen over the course of my working life, very few people enjoy whatever it is that they do, and even fewer do their job because they love it.
The reality is that people work for the money, to be able to live and buy the things they need and want. There are some good points to every job, and many bad points. From an outsider's perspective, I'd say that one of the good things about train driving is the pay, and I don't object to the salaries drivers receive at all, given the numerous downsides to the job that you've touched on here.
mtbox
Member
If it was working on steam, yes.
But on modern boring dmu/emu, even locos, not a chance.
Even shunting in a yard with a steamer is more interesting than 100mph class 1 work.
And I know from experience, not from a computer game
Here you go, below is a list of "my fors and againsts" to train driving:
For!
1. Salary
2. You are your own boss to a certain degree
3. Responsibility
4. 35 hour week
5. 28 days annual leave
6. long weekend every 3 weeks
7. Scope for overtime
8. A lot of rest breaks
9. You get a certain respect from fellow workers.
10. Seeing the scenery that others may not see.
11. Satisfaction from when you do your job right (probably the same as any job)
12. You meet some wonderful and pleasant people working on the railway and also make good friendships (as long as you are on the same RD pattern)
13. You don't need any educational qualifications to land a job
Against:
1. Getting up at silly o'clock
2. If you are late for work it affects more than just you (not that I am ever late)
3. You need your own transport
4. You have to pay to park your car.
5. Mentally tiring
6. Not good for your metabolism or health
7. Sacrifice your social life
8. Your kids ask who you are
9. You are being continually monitored 24/7
10. You have to put up with abusive people.
11. You are on your own most of the day (I quite enjoy that bit)
12. You get aches and pains from continually sitting that you normally wouldn't
13. Night shifts
14. Carrying around a heavy kit bag.
15. Fatalities
16. Listening to 90% of the others moaning about their job.
17. Getting asked why you have lost 2 minutes in leaf fall
18. Having to sleep in the spare room when you are on early shifts
19. High proportion of marriage and relationship break ups.
There are more and of course many jobs have their bad points but any of you wanting this job and will go to extreme measures to get it please take note that the honeymoon period soon diminishes and you may end up doing something you will regret. Okay, there are many who really enjoy the role and many who would do it for nothing but that is only because they are enthusiastic about trains and the railway.
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If it was working on steam, yes.
But on modern boring dmu/emu, even locos, not a chance.
Even shunting in a yard with a steamer is more interesting than 100mph class 1 work.
And I know from experience, not from a computer game
Yes, but that is your hobby and not your job! Hence the reason I would (if I was interested) work for nothing on a heritage railway, I won't because it doesn't interest me.
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That's a comprehensive list! I think the main point is that there are those who want to be a driver for the money, and there are those that want to do the job because they love trains. Both need to know the reality behind the dream!
Minilad
Established Member
The problem with that list is that it's just your opinion. Some of those against arguments I don't recognise and some of the fors do not apply. Everyone will choose to do this job for different reasons. And everyone will have a different list. If you don't enjoy it then fair enough. Keep turning up and taking the money. But please don't make the mistake of thinking everyone feels the same and for the same reasons
Minilad
Established Member
To be fair he did say it was his list, not a peer reviewed document stating facts.
Yes I know that
Isn't the main reason for doing that on the tube so that they get used to the whole culture, unsocial hours etc? Obviously training somebody to be a driver only for them to then decide the job isn't for them is rather expensive, that happens a lot on the buses.
So what is the problem with the list? Someone asked for drivers opinions, he gave his. There is no problem with it. Not having a go at you of course.
Minilad
Established Member
There is no problem with the list per se. As it is a personal opinion. I am just saying that don't read the list and think that they always apply. Some are not opinions but facts. Such as working nights. Not everyone has to do this. My list would be different entirely based on my particular work patterns
Indeed mate. And in my personal opinion 99.99% of the railways employees do a brilliant job in often challenging circumstances. I don't particularly like my work patterns but they are nothing compared to what you folks do.
Minilad
Established Member
The work patterns can be seen as a good thing though. I like the early starts. Because you get an early finish and, at our place, the early jobs tend to be amongst the best jobs. But having said that I like lates. Because generally speaking they are less busy and it enables you to get things done during the day. Horses for courses
HarleyDavidson
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I used to like the very early starts, now I hate them with a passion, I don't like the lates because you just get the drunken Troglodytes of SW London causing nothing but trouble.
I like the turns where I can come & go by train, so it means I don't have to fight to find a parking space or deal with the lunatic women drivers in their Chelsea Tractors taking their brats to school. Local station usually has spaces available during the day, but if I have to go in after 1100 I can find a parking space at depot because the early starters & cover crews have gone home.
I like the turns where I can come & go by train, so it means I don't have to fight to find a parking space or deal with the lunatic women drivers in their Chelsea Tractors taking their brats to school. Local station usually has spaces available during the day, but if I have to go in after 1100 I can find a parking space at depot because the early starters & cover crews have gone home.
To be fair the roster at the depot I work is quite intense, we have 6 jobs that book on before 04.00, 2 different night turns both over 9 hours in length and most of the jobs are over 9 hours, we have work where you are in the seat for over 4 hours without a break, even a turn round time. But of course you get people who love the job and most, in fact I think all of them are enthusiasts so are interested in the railway and trains and when they are off they go on train rides and do heritage work but for me I am not interested the trains at all, I would sooner drive a 150 than a loco as loco work is noisy, dirty and more involved, I have done both so know what loco work is like. But as I did say everyone to their own and many of my friends are enthusiasts. During my time off I do other things like drink ale and go out to the pub I certainly wouldn't want to go near a train.
It is a personal list, some is generic and some is Me but in general the job is very taxing on the body and soul.
it may be an opinion but i bet a pound to a pinch of poop if you went into a railway mess room and conducted a survey of the positives and negatives to the job most would put answer very similarly to what TDK has put!
bottom line is it's an industry where to get the money you do have to take the rough with the smooth and i am not saying it is like working in hell as despite me having no interest in trains whatsoever outside of driving them i wouldn't work in any other industry now!
HOWEVER
lets not make the mistake here of thinking just because there are a lot of enthusiasts that work on the railway that go to work with a hop skip and a jump every day feeling like every day is a lottery win that it is a paradise either!........a lot of people think that the positives outweigh the negatives heavily but i don't think it's that clear cut at all!.........there is a reason that the positives are there......and that's generally because the positives are very much needed after a week on the railway!!
it's very much an industry where you can push on if you are ambitious etc and it's great to see but have a word with the people that leave the industry and those still in the industry and take TDK'S list with you when you do i think your eyes may be opened up a tad more that's for sure!
Minilad
Established Member
I don't need a list to tell me my own opinion thanks. I make up my own mind about things. I don't need you to tell me about opening my eyes either. I enjoy my work and I enjoy the job. I didn't say I go to work with a hop skip and a jump either. I'm sorry the thought of someone enjoying what they do gets to you so much. But I have been doing this for 17 years now so you would think I would have found out by now if I didn't like it.
Quite frankly if you don't like it get out. Simple. I have left jobs before because I didn't like it. And took pay cuts too. Life is too short to moan about work.
If I could find a job that paid the same or more with a better chance of a social life I would take it but unfortunately there isn't anything that will pay me £55k a year for doing a job with the same hours and stability so I will stick with what I have, Minilad, are you a railway enthusiast by any chance? If you are I can understand your views on the job and that is up to you, however there are many entering the role or have entered it recently and by recently I mean over the past 5 years who were enthusiasts and are now regretting the job and are not as interested in the railway as they used to be. I am not moaning about work but emphasising it isn't a role that some may think it is that's all. I have seen people who are drastically desperate even spending thousands on trying to get the role of driver all because they love trains, it is slightly different looking in from the outside.
my comment regarding TDK'S list and enthusiasts had nothing to do with your opinion on your enjoyment of the job and when i was talking about enthusiasts i was actually talking about spotters going to work with a hop skip and a jump!......and once again your name was not mentioned!! (talk about a complex) how am i supposed to know whether u are a spotter or not!? i used the word enthusiast as its a tad more PC than spotter!
my comment was simply based on your reply to TDK which basically told him no 2 people are the same!!........ fair enough.......but his post never said they were!???........... I am more than happy in my job thank you very much! (you must have been a careers adviser in one of the other jobs you speak of??) I'm just not into thinking it's a paradise and it was my OPINION that most people on the railway would agree with the list TDK posted!.......i never said it was fact!
hey if you are happy in your work hats off to you.......just so you know though very little gets to me in this life!.......(sorry to shatter your ego there chap) anyway I'm not really into pathetic little arguments because someone has taken a post completely out of context so i will put the next bit in capitals so you understand more clearly what i was saying!.............. IT IS ONLY MY OPINION THAT THE LIST TDK POSTED WAS QUITE ACCURATE!......I HAVE NOT BEEN READING RAILWAY PSYCHOLOGY WEEKLY (other psychology publications are available) OR NUMEROUS RAIL MAGAZINES TO GET FACTS AND FIGURES ON WHAT PLEASES AND ANNOYS RAILWAY EMPLOYEES ABOUT THE JOB JUST TO IRK MINILAD AND CAUSE AN ARGUMENT!. hope thats ok for you mate!?
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Minilad
Established Member
No one can possibly know what a job will be like until they are doing it. So lists like yours can be helpful for someone thinking of coming into the job. All I was saying was that some of the items on the list wouldn't apply in every situation so people reading the list would have to take them at face value. I didn't have a problem with the list. Many of the things on there I agree with entirely but some of the things on the list may not apply. Car parking for example. Anyway there isn't really a right and wrong answer as some people can put up with more than others to do something they want to do. Maybe I am like that sometimes I don't really know.
There are plenty of things I get angry about on the railway but I will always respect another drivers opinion and I do respect yours too.
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Chill out fella. It's just the internet!
if i am any more chilled I'd be sat in the fridge chap!....just wanted to help you thats all
Jamesb1974
Member
- Joined
- 20 Mar 2006
- Messages
- 596
Eeh, it's ironic isn't it? 16 pages (and about two/three weeks ago) I questioned why this subject was being brought up again. I suggested that it would only lead to pointless bickering about why we drivers get paid what we do. I was also accused of attempting to inflame the situation by questioning why the subject had reared its head again.
I was censored for doing so, but it seems I was right after all.
I was censored for doing so, but it seems I was right after all.
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Minilad
Established Member
We are not bickering about being paid what we are though. We are bickering about how much we enjoy, or don't enjoy, the job!
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I don't think I need your help. But thanks anyway
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if i am any more chilled I'd be sat in the fridge chap!....just wanted to help you thats all
I don't think I need your help. But thanks anyway
siiiiiiiiggghhhhh
HarleyDavidson
Established Member
- Joined
- 23 Aug 2014
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Minilad
Established Member
Me too
Without being purposely rude to you but Im not sure that you can comment with such certainty about the role given you only joined 8 months ago* and should still be going through training so you wont have had time to bed in and realise just how mundane the job can be and I certainly dont think that on such a short period of time in the role you can criticise other drivers who have been doing it for a few years and more.
*I only remember your name from the recruitment thread and how desperate you were in wanting to become a driver.
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