But the HSTs have spent 40 years carting people about and there seems to be outcry every time their replacement is touted?
The PEP derived EMUs are also approaching 40 years old - they're still very much fit for purpose - so the basic D train unit is completely serviceable.
They are doing the job they were designed to do. The D train was never designed to be:
a) diesel powered
b) let loose on the "open" railway
c) meet current railway standards
There aren't many crossings or animals or vehicle incursions on the District Line
Two things against that - firstly the electrification of a number of lines is going to result in lots of DMUs coming free in any case - which will naturally allow some of the oldest units to be retired naturally.
Secondly - do you really think you can get to a 'single' design? You already have people moaning on these boards about the 350/4s being used on 'regional' (TPE) services for, among other reasons, they have 1/3 2/3 doors rather than vestibule end doors.
Yes electrification will release units IF the electrification plans actually happen or are not pushed back even further - but why not replace all of the oldest stock in one go with something new with a long design life
It shouldn't be beyond us to design a train that can be "modular" and offer different configurations to suit all needs
BTW the 350 is a perfect design for the kind of work TPE use them for. They just don't have enough
Unless I've missed something, nobody's opted for anything yet with regard to the D train, beyond Vivarail developing a prototype - I'm not aware of any TOC signing up to then or even the government committing to buy them?
No one has signed up yet but they will. You are naive if you think otherwise.
It's using a basic EMU shell which is of a comparable age to a MK3 shell or a PEP unit. It's then deploying a new traction package - and whilst you may sneer about the "Transit engine" - the fact is the engine ISN'T being used to actually drive the train - instead it's retaining electric motors for the drivetrain - and the engine is being used to provide the electric power in the same way 3rd rail or OHLE does.
i know how a diesel/electric train works thanks. Guess what? Regardless of how you dress it up real people will not care about "traction packages" or "electric motor drivetrains" - they will see a second hand knackered underground train driven by a Ford transit engine.
Have leasing costs been confirmed?
Have you travelled on one to know it will offer "a more reduced passenger journey experience" (whatever that is) ?
Perhaps it would be better to reserve judgment until we've actually seen one in action and can make an objective judgment rather than a subjective judgment from afar.
If you think that these trains will not offer rock bottom leasing costs to attract the TOCs desperate for capacity you are, once again, showing naivety. They only selling point is the reduction in cost to the TOC and rapid availability.
Yes - the leasing costs may be cheap - but then the lines it will probably be operating on have relatively low revenue therefore these lines need to be operated on a sensible budget - I'm not sure buying new DMUs for the Marston Vale line would be a particularly sensible investment?
Do you seriously think those reduced operating costs will be passed on the passenger? really? :roll:These trains will boost TOC profits and cost us as passengers more. You may be prepared to offer the benefit of the doubt. Going on recent train design i am not, certainly internal internal design wise
OBVIOUSLY buying a small fleet of trains for individual lines makes no sense. However as part of a wider scheme it does.
As for the Marston Vale line we will need something new and offering more capacity. The 153 is often full in the mornings and as Amazon and others at Ridgemont expand and more workers realise they have a station of their own at the gate of the warehouse AND even more housing gets built along the line passenger numbers will increase. They already have in the 5 years i have used the line
Maybe so - but presumably to obtain another 150 would have an impact elsewhere on a busier route? Probably a WM commuter service which is already at capacity.....
Bluntly: Do i care? I don't travel in the WM. If it is bad give them a D train - they will be ideal for commuter flows!