First South West (Kernow & Buses of Somerset)

[iantherev]

Rail replacement tends to be for GWR south west from Bristol. Short journeys tend to produce a variety of vehicles e.g. Paignton Branch, while longer trips e.g Exeter - Newton Abbot/Plymouth sees coaches or Enviro 400s.

 

[richw]

Thanks all for the helpful info. I hadn't appreciated that First Kernow did rail replacements up here in middle England. Is there any particular rail job Olympians are favoured on?

No the Tridents and Enviros seem to be sent to do the railway work - They went to Devon last weekend to pretend to be Pacers between Exeter and Paignton.
Resulted in Olympians covering for Tridents and Enviros over the weekend on the Kernow network it seems.

 

[83G/84D]

Yesterday Enviro 400 33422 worked the 1745 (18) Truro to Penzance whilst both Marshall Dart's were seen with 41490 on the 47.
Former Stagecoach Kent Volvo B10M R908 XVM was seen passing through Camborne in a (Chepstow Classic Bus)blue colour.

 

[richw]

Talking of 33422, on Sunday afternoon I saw a convoy of pink nosed deckers heading west on the A30 past Redruth, all with Kernow logos applied.
A driver contact told me yesterday that Kernow should be getting a decent number of new deckers for the 14/18/U1/U2 late this year, He implied brand new but couldn't be definite.
He said newer deckers are a definite due to the U1/2 contract specifying average age under 5 years,

 

[83G/84D]

Talking of 33422, on Sunday afternoon I saw a convoy of pink nosed deckers heading west on the A30 past Redruth, all with Kernow logos applied.
A driver contact told me yesterday that Kernow should be getting a decent number of new deckers for the 14/18/U1/U2 late this year, He implied brand new but couldn't be definite.
He said newer deckers are a definite due to the U1/2 contract specifying average age under 5 years,

The rumour doing the rounds in Camborne at the moment is up to 30 new buses for First Kernow before the end of the year including new deckers for U1/U2.

No mention of new deckers for 14/18.Talk of replacements of some sort for the Eden artics.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The rumour doing the rounds in Camborne at the moment is up to 30 new buses for First Kernow before the end of the year including new deckers for U1/U2.

No mention of new deckers for 14/18.Talk of replacements of some sort for the Eden artics.

Recall that SouthWesterly intimated that there may be some news on new fleet for FSW in 2016 - what actually happens, who knows.

Were the last new vehicles for Kernow the 55 plate Tridents (32761-3) of which two have now returned to the area? I'm not including 33420-2 which were at Bude as they were used predominantly in Devon on the X9/10.

 

[richw]

Recall that SouthWesterly intimated that there may be some news on new fleet for FSW in 2016 - what actually happens, who knows.

Were the last new vehicles for Kernow the 55 plate Tridents (32761-3) of which two have now returned to the area? I'm not including 33420-2 which were at Bude as they were used predominantly in Devon on the X9/10.

They were certainly the last new deckers. I believe there were some 56 plate Darts new for the old 41 route with wheel to coast branding.

SN53KKE is now sporting a all over Heart advert. Seen on the 18 this morning.

LN51GLF is currently playing dead on the A30 between Camborne and Redruth.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

They were certainly the last new deckers. I believe there were some 56 plate Darts new for the old 41 route with wheel to coast branding.

Of course, the ones of which some survive, one has headed to Norfolk and another couple are in Oldham.

Fingers crossed that there's some new fleet for Kernow.

 

[83G/84D]

Apart from possible new buses for the U1/U2 I reckon it will be more cascades from elsewhere rather than more new buses for First Kernow.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Apart from possible new buses for the U1/U2 I reckon it will be more cascades from elsewhere rather than more new buses for First Kernow.

To be honest, we all know that Cornwall is thin operating territory. Even in the hallowed days of the NBC and the new bus grant, it still survived on cascades from around the country whether that be Atlanteans in the mid 1970s from M&D and Trent, Nationals from Midland Red, VRs from Oxford, Fleetlines from London etc. It was ever thus and pragmatism has to rule.

However, even if we see limited numbers of new vehicles plus some reasonable cascades, that has got to be welcomed.

 

[83G/84D]

To be honest, we all know that Cornwall is thin operating territory. Even in the hallowed days of the NBC and the new bus grant, it still survived on cascades from around the country whether that be Atlanteans in the mid 1970s from M&D and Trent, Nationals from Midland Red, VRs from Oxford, Fleetlines from London etc. It was ever thus and pragmatism has to rule.

However, even if we see limited numbers of new vehicles plus some reasonable cascades, that has got to be welcomed.

I fondly remember the ex London Daimler Fleetline's and ex Southampton Atlantean's of the 1980's, possibly more fondly than the drivers and fitters of that time.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I fondly remember the ex London Daimler Fleetline's and ex Southampton Atlantean's of the 1980's, possibly more fondly than the drivers and fitters of that time.

Were the Southampton Atlanteans bought to support the fleet during the first Plymouth bus war but headed to Penzance (?) to allow VRs to head to Plymouth?

Conversely, I was brought up in the North and so remember receiving new Olympians to then allow our mid life VRs to head to Bristol and WN Group. Mid life in those days being c.6 years old!

 

[Goldfish62]

To be honest, we all know that Cornwall is thin operating territory. Even in the hallowed days of the NBC and the new bus grant, it still survived on cascades from around the country whether that be Atlanteans in the mid 1970s from M&D and Trent, Nationals from Midland Red, VRs from Oxford, Fleetlines from London etc. It was ever thus and pragmatism has to rule.

Yes, there were lots of cascades, but there was also a steady trickle of new vehicles coming in as well. There were constant new deliveries through the 1970s, but these then dried up in the early 80s, resuming in the mid-80s with a massive of Merc minibuses. The influx of new vehicles continued through until the formation of First - and the rest is history...

While I agree that Cornwall isn't the best operating territory I'm sure it's better than many rural areas and the 14/18 corridor is heavily used. I have heard from two independent and reliable sources that the Kernow business is now making money, although I suspect that may mean that the losses are reducing.

 

[83G/84D]

They were certainly the last new deckers. I believe there were some 56 plate Darts new for the old 41 route with wheel to coast branding.

SN53KKE is now sporting a all over Heart advert. Seen on the 18 this morning.

LN51GLF is currently playing dead on the A30 between Camborne and Redruth.

LN51 GLF now at Camborne having been towed in.

Here is SN53 KKE (42875) at Penzance earlier. The rear was red but I could not see it due to where it was parked.

 

[83G/84D]

Olympian 34172 worked a trip on service 1 this afternoon and seen here at Lands End and Sennen Cove.Trident 33084 was on service 2 today.

 

[Busaholic]

I fondly remember the ex London Daimler Fleetline's of the 1980's, possibly more fondly than the drivers and fitters of that time.

And certainly more fondly than we remember them from their London days.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Yes, there were lots of cascades, but there was also a steady trickle of new vehicles coming in as well. There were constant new deliveries through the 1970s, but these then dried up in the early 80s, resuming in the mid-80s with a massive of Merc minibuses. The influx of new vehicles continued through until the formation of First - and the rest is history...

While I agree that Cornwall isn't the best operating territory I'm sure it's better than many rural areas and the 14/18 corridor is heavily used. I have heard from two independent and reliable sources that the Kernow business is now making money, although I suspect that may mean that the losses are reducing.

I meant predominantly cascades - they did get new fleet in the late 70s up until the bus grant got pulled. Also, they did get reasonable numbers of Merc minibuses (aside from the de-reg era ones) and Darts in the Badgerline (Badgers and Flags) days. You're right.... that began to dry up under First ownership and the succession of poor management decisions and service cuts.

Things look a little more hopeful now - agree the 14/18 are probably (with the U1/2) some of the likeliest places to get new vehicles.

 

[83G/84D]

Eden artic 11036 seen at Eden project today and has suffered front end bodywork damage and is out of use.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Today I decided to have a day out on the buses using a First one day ticket. When I have done these outings in the past I have meticulously planned my day prior to setting off however today I decided to decide on the day. Having said that I wanted if possible to have a ride on at least one Olympian.
At 0830 I arrived at Camborne bus station to find Marshall Dart 41490 awaiting departure on the 0845 "45" to Helston. Having never ridden on this bus before I decided to travel to Helston.
A lightly loaded bus should have meant that we set off on time however the driver turned up after departure time and we departed 4 minutes late. The journey was relatively uneventful despite meeting green Trident 32716 outside Camborne on a narrow bit of road and a problem with parked cars in Carwynnen Close at Praze-an-Beeble. The bus had plenty of rattles and the seats were rather hard but the lost time was made up and we arrived on time at Coinagehall Street in Helston.
I then thought the service 2 to Penzance would be a good idea to try and sample a Olympian on the 1 to Lands End. A quick tea break was interrupted when 34049 turned up on the 0900 "37" from Redruth to The Lizard. I was rather tempted to get this however stuck to my plan. The 2 eventually arrived from Helston Tesco around 5 minutes late after the incoming working from Penzance was late, Trident 32846 doing the honours.
Another uneventful journey with only a few passengers joining and alighting until we got to Goldsithney where a total of 10 passengers joined at three separate stops. It was the same at Marazion where 9 people joined at two stops.

At Penzance Volvo B7RLE 69230 was seen on the 18, Solo 53826 on the 11 Trident 33172 on the 2, Trident 32878 on the 10A, Solo 53709 on the 16, Solo 53504 on the 6 & Volvo B7RLE 69226 was on the 18. Laying over were 33175 & 33176. Arriving soon after was Olympian 34172 on the 1 which paused briefly for a driver change before working the next 1 to Lands End (1045 from Penzance).
I decided a trip to Lands End and back was in order. A slightly late start was insignificant and with only around a dozen passengers on board I was confident timekeeping would not be a major issue.
The narrow lanes around Lamorna and St Buryan proved a bit of a headache though with oncoming traffic meaning more time being lost but the Olympian managed all the hill climbs with no problems.
Arrival into the Lands End complex was around six minutes late but a quick turnaround kept that delay to a minimum. Even the hill out of Sennen Cove did not prove too much of a challenge for the Olympian. On the way back to St Buryan we had a meeting with a fairly large lorry in a country lane with no room for us to pass. The lorry driver eventually reversed into a farmer's field to enable us to get by much to the amusement of a foreign man with his son who were on board taking photo's with bemused looks on their faces!
Arrival back into Penzance was more or less on time and I got off in Market Jew Street for a cup of tea and a takeaway snack before walking back to the bus station. I toyed with the idea of getting Trident 33172 on the 2 back to Helston in the hope of catching up with 34049 again but decided against this.

Meanwhile Solo's 53503 on the 6 and 53826 on the 11 came and went as did Trident 32878 on the 10A, a Volvo B7RLE on the 18 and Dart 42872 which arrived on the 10 and departed on the 17. Also present was 33175, 33084 & 33176.

I next decided to catch Solo 53709 on the 16 to St Ives, a route I had not travelled on since the last days of the Vario's. There were only four passengers on board after departure from Penzance and after a trip to the out of town Sainsbury's we headed to Gulval.
It was a case of "breathe in" as we squeezed past Solo 53801 on the 16 heading in the opposite direction, on a narrow lane near Ludgvan.
We missed out on the most scenic part via Gurnards Head which is served by the 16A and the rest of the journey was uneventful.
At St Ives I alighted near the park and ride site just outside the town where several Solo's were operating and Plymouth Citybus coach WA64 FZY was present at the coach park. After walking into the town centre I just had enough time for a pint in Wetherspoon's before walking the short distance to the bus station.
Here Solo 53709 was just departing back to Penzance on the 16 and Scania 65760 was present. Shortly after Trident 32878 arrived on the 17 and former Western Greyhound Solo WK56 PEN went past heading out of town. I then boarded Scania 65760 on the 1357 "14" to Truro. A reasonably well loaded bus this time but again uneventful with no timekeeping issues. We passed several Volvo B7RLE's heading west on the 14 & 18 in the Hayle area.
Approaching Camborne I consulted my timetable and decided that I would see what was on the 1440 "45" to Helston with a view of going back to Helston for the "37" to Reduth.
Arrival at Camborne found Marshall Dart 41490 on the stand showing "45" on the display. Having had enough of the "boneshaker" earlier I decided to stay on the 14 and come up with another plan.
At Camborne were Dart's 43862, 43906, 41490 7 42876, Trident's 32759 & 32757 along with coaches 20504 & 23313. Also seen in the depot were Volvo B7TL's 32097 & 30878. Scania 65763 was on the 18.
A right time arrival turned into a 6 minute late departure with a new driver taking over. Cheerful he certainly was but he was not in a rush to get going!
Plenty of passengers alighted and joined at various stops to Redruth, resulting in a 10 minute late arrival.
I left the bus and waited for the "U2" to Falmouth which arrived around 5 minutes late with E400 33659. Again a relatively quiet bus with the top deck virtually unoccupied. Other than passing Solo 53701 showing route 69B (?) at Ponsanooth there was little of interest. Trident 32803 was seen heading towards Truro "out of service" at Treluswell.
Entering Falmouth former Park & Ride Enviro 400 33422 was seen on the U3 and there was just time to grab a cup of tea at The Moor before re-boarding Enviro 400 33659 on the 1610 "U1" to Truro. On the way into Penryn green Enviro 33660 was seen Falmouth bound on the "U1" following 33667 on the "U2", Falmouth University resulted in 9 students joining our bus.
At Carnon Downs there was a flurry of activity as Trident's 32761 & 32758 along with Volvo B7TL 30877, all passed on Truro college service 231. At the Kea turn Solo 53040 was seen heading towards Playing Place on the 233 college service.

Relatively unhindered progress was made into Truro where the bus station was relatively quiet with only Volvo B7TL 30874 & Trident 33111 present. Two Volvo B7RLE's arrived in quick succession on the 18 and I boarded 69222 on the 1655 "18" to Camborne. Departure was on time and despite several stops leaving Truro we were waiting time at Threemilestone.
As well as several Volvo B7RLE's seen inbound to Truro and Solo 53402 on the "47" at Treliske there were several Park & Ride vehicles noted. Dart 42873 was also on the 18.
Ttraffic build up in the Scorrier area where Trident 32759 was seen on an eastbound "18", meant we were six minutes late by the time Redruth was reached. Despite the driver missing a stop near Mount Ambrose much to the disdain of a passenger facing a quarter of a mile walk back along a road with no pavement, the rest of the journey to Camborne went without a hitch and my excellent day out came to an end.

 

[Busaholic]

Eden artic 11036 seen at Eden project today and has suffered front end bodywork damage and is out of use.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Today I decided to have a day out on the buses using a First one day ticket. When I have done these outings in the past I have meticulously planned my day prior to setting off however today I decided to decide on the day. Having said that I wanted if possible to have a ride on at least one Olympian.
At 0830 I arrived at Camborne bus station to find Marshall Dart 41490 awaiting departure on the 0845 "45" to Helston. Having never ridden on this bus before I decided to travel to Helston.
A lightly loaded bus should have meant that we set off on time however the driver turned up after departure time and we departed 4 minutes late. The journey was relatively uneventful despite meeting green Trident 32716 outside Camborne on a narrow bit of road and a problem with parked cars in Carwynnen Close at Praze-an-Beeble. The bus had plenty of rattles and the seats were rather hard but the lost time was made up and we arrived on time at Coinagehall Street in Helston.
I then thought the service 2 to Penzance would be a good idea to try and sample a Olympian on the 1 to Lands End. A quick tea break was interrupted when 34049 turned up on the 0900 "37" from Redruth to The Lizard. I was rather tempted to get this however stuck to my plan. The 2 eventually arrived from Helston Tesco around 5 minutes late after the incoming working from Penzance was late, Trident 32846 doing the honours.
Another uneventful journey with only a few passengers joining and alighting until we got to Goldsithney where a total of 10 passengers joined at three separate stops. It was the same at Marazion where 9 people joined at two stops.

At Penzance Volvo B7RLE 69230 was seen on the 18, Solo 53826 on the 11 Trident 33172 on the 2, Trident 32878 on the 10A, Solo 53709 on the 16, Solo 53504 on the 6 & Volvo B7RLE 69226 was on the 18. Laying over were 33175 & 33176. Arriving soon after was Olympian 34172 on the 1 which paused briefly for a driver change before working the next 1 to Lands End (1045 from Penzance).
I decided a trip to Lands End and back was in order. A slightly late start was insignificant and with only around a dozen passengers on board I was confident timekeeping would not be a major issue.
The narrow lanes around Lamorna and St Buryan proved a bit of a headache though with oncoming traffic meaning more time being lost but the Olympian managed all the hill climbs with no problems.
Arrival into the Lands End complex was around six minutes late but a quick turnaround kept that delay to a minimum. Even the hill out of Sennen Cove did not prove too much of a challenge for the Olympian. On the way back to St Buryan we had a meeting with a fairly large lorry in a country lane with no room for us to pass. The lorry driver eventually reversed into a farmer's field to enable us to get by much to the amusement of a foreign man with his son who were on board taking photo's with bemused looks on their faces!
Arrival back into Penzance was more or less on time and I got off in Market Jew Street for a cup of tea and a takeaway snack before walking back to the bus station. I toyed with the idea of getting Trident 33172 on the 2 back to Helston in the hope of catching up with 34049 again but decided against this.

Meanwhile Solo's 53503 on the 6 and 53826 on the 11 came and went as did Trident 32878 on the 10A, Volvo B7RLE on the 18 and Dart 42872 which arrived on the 10 and departed on the 17. Also present was 33175, 33084 & 33176.

I next decided to catch Solo 53709 on the 16 to St Ives, a route I had not travelled on since the last days of the Vario's. There were only four passengers on board after departure from Penzance and after a trip to the out of town Sainsbury's we headed to Gulval.
It was a case of "breathe in" as we squeezed past Solo 53801 on the 16 heading in the opposite direction, on a narrow lane near Ludgvan.
We missed out on the most scenic part via Gurnards Head which is served by the 16A and the rest of the journey was uneventful.
At St Ives I alighted near the park and ride site just outside the town where several Solo's were operating and Plymouth Citybus coach WA64 FZY was present at the coach park. After walking into the town centre I just had enough time for a pint in Wetherspoon's before walking the short distance to the bus station.
Here Solo 53709 was just departing back to Penzance on the 16 and Scania 65760 was present. Shortly after Trident 32878 arrived on the 17 and former Western Greyhound Solo WK56 PEN went past heading out of town. I then boarded Scania 65760 on the 1357 "14" to Truro. A reasonably well loaded bus this time but again uneventful with no timekeeping issues. We passed several Volvo B7RLE's heading west on the 14 & 18 in the Hayle area.
Approaching Camborne I consulted my timetable and decided that I would see what was on the 1440 "45" to Helston with a view of going back to Helston for the "37" to Reduth.
Arrival at Camborne found Marshall Dart 41490 on the stand showing "45" on the display. Having had enough of the "boneshaker" earlier I decided to stay on the 14 and come up with another plan.
At Camborne were Dart's 43862, 43906, 41490, 42876 Trident's 32759 & 32757 along with coaches 20504 & 23313. Also seen in the depot were Volvo B7TL's 32097 & 30878. Scania 65763 was on the 18.
A right time arrival turned into a 6 minute late departure with a new driver taking over. Cheerful he certainly was but he was not in a rush to get going!
Plenty of passengers alighted and joined at various stops to Redruth, resulting in a 10 minute late arrival.
I left the bus and waited for the "U2" to Falmouth which arrived around 5 minutes late with E400 33659. Again a relatively quiet bus with the top deck virtually unoccupied. Other than passing Solo 53701 showing route 69B (?) at Ponsanooth there was little of interest. Trident 32803 was seen heading towards Truro "out of service" at Treluswell.
Entering Falmouth former Park & Ride Enviro 400 33422 was seen on the U3 and there was just time to grab a cup of tea at The Moor before re-boarding Enviro 400 33659 on the 1610 "U1" to Truro. On the way into Penryn green Enviro 33660 was seen Falmouth bound on the "U1" following 33667 on the "U2", Falmouth University resulted in 9 students joining our bus.
At Carnon Downs there was a flurry of activity as Trident's 32761 & 32758 along with Volvo B7TL 30877, all passed on Truro college service 231. At the Kea turn Solo 53040 was seen heading towards Playing Place on the 233 college service.

Relatively unhindered progress was made into Truro where the bus station was relatively quiet with only Volvo B7TL 30874 & Trident 33111 present. Two Volvo B7RLE's arrived in quick succession on the 18 and I boarded 69222 on the 1655 "18" to Camborne. Departure was on time and despite several stops leaving Truro we were waiting time at Threemilestone.
As well as several Volvo B7RLE's seen inbound to Truro and Solo 53402 on the "47" at Treliske there were several Park & Ride vehicles noted. Dart 42873 was also on the 18.
Ttraffic build up in the Scorrier area where Trident 32759 was seen on an eastbound "18", meant we were six minutes late by the time Redruth was reached. Despite the driver missing a stop near Mount Ambrose much to the disdain of a passenger facing a quarter of a mile walk back along a road with no pavement, the rest of the journey to Camborne went without a hitch and my excellent day out came to an end.

Thank you for a very comprehensive report. I think my conclusion from it would be that we who live in WC are very fortunate to have such comprehensive coverage, and these may prove to have been halcyon days. Some would query the use of so many older buses, but if this is the price of keeping services, then sobeit, I say.

 

[83G/84D]

I enjoyed the day and next time will head off to Mid Cornwall. Sadly I doubt that there will be any Olympians around by then.

 

[busconductors]

Busaholic, too long to quote, your day outing was really interesting and amusing. You provided a lot of detailed information. Did you talk with any of the passengers or staff? Did you gather any opinions about bus operations in Cornwall?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Sorry I should have congratulated 83G/84D. I mistakenly thought it was busaholic who had made the entry.

 

[83G/84D]

busconductors - No I did not chat to any passengers or staff. There was not the opportunity to talk to the latter as it was a case of "off one bus and straight on another" for most of the day.

Maybe next time when I cover mid Cornwall I'll do it.

 

[Busaholic]

Marshall Dart on the 39A this p.m., first I've seen in PZ for a while.

 

[CD]

Thank you for a very comprehensive report. I think my conclusion from it would be that we who live in WC are very fortunate to have such comprehensive coverage, and these may prove to have been halcyon days. Some would query the use of so many older buses, but if this is the price of keeping services, then sobeit, I say.

Cornwall is indeed lucky to have a county council that supports public transport.
First have a virtual monopoly of bus and train services in the county.
Look at the other half of First South West, Buses of Somerset they have competition from Webberbus on almost every route and a county council that has no interest in public transport. It also has an even older bus fleet.
Unlike Somerset, Cornwall has not had any real cuts to services. How long it will last?

 

[richw]

Cornwall is indeed lucky to have a county council that supports public transport.
First have a virtual monopoly of bus and train services in the county.
Look at the other half of First South West, Buses of Somerset they have competition from Webberbus on almost every route and a county council that has no interest in public transport. It also has an even older bus fleet.
Unlike Somerset, Cornwall has not had any real cuts to services. How long it will last?

Cornwall council's pro public transport is helped by having a leading officer who doesn't drive and champions public transport.
First and Cornwall Council clearly have an excellent relationship looking in from outside.

 

[83G/84D]

Marshall Dart on the 39A this p.m., first I've seen in PZ for a while.

Which one, 41383 or 41490?

 

[Busaholic]

Which one, 41383 or 41490?

Sorry, I was driving in the opposite direction and only saw it head-on for a few seconds.

 

[83G/84D]

Well if it was in Barbie it was 41383 otherwise 41490 in urban.

 

[Busaholic]

Well if it was in Barbie it was 41383 otherwise 41490 in urban.

Barbie!

 

[Westnat]

Not sure if it's been posted, but saw P10 HDC with First Kernow fleet names and carrying fleet number 21100 at Bodmin last week.