Weymouth idling trains leave 'horrendous smell'

[neonison]

BBC (bless them) are reporting on GW trains idling at Weymouth:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-dorset-3655708

Noise, fumes and the "horrendous smell" of idling diesel trains are blighting the lives of people in a seaside town.

Residents of Princes Drive in Weymouth, whose gardens back on to the mainline to London Waterloo, said trains stop with their engines running for up to five hours on Saturdays.

They said their weekend noise nightmare started last year.

Great Western Railway (GWR) said new procedures had now been put in place to minimise the time engines run.

Peter Yarwood, who has lived on Princes Drive for 15 years, said: "We quite enjoy the trains passing but to have one parked outside your house for five hours on a Saturday is not very nice."

As well as the "constant droning noise" he said he could not open his windows or sit in the garden because of the fumes....

In a world where my car engine dies if I pause for a couple of seconds, why would GW want to leave their engines idling, or is this necessary for 'hotel power' for the a/c? Either way 5 hours seems excessive.

 

[Deepgreen]

BBC (bless them) are reporting on GW trains idling at Weymouth:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-dorset-36557083

In a world where my car engine dies if I pause for a couple of seconds, why would GW want to leave their engines idling, or is this necessary for 'hotel power' for the a/c? Either way 5 hours seems excessive.

Yes - a ridiculous amount of time, wasting fuel and polluting needlessly. Hotel power is only required shortly before departure, not for several hours. A question might be, are these trains manned at the time, and, if so, what do the crew do for five hours? If not, is it acceptable to leave a train unattended with the engine(s) running for hours - fire risk, vandalism/tampering, etc?

 

[brad465]

Looking at the article, are they currently running HSTs to Weymouth (e.g. for summer specials)?

When I was there earlier this month the train I took from there was a 150 which was switched off until the doors were opened about 5 mins before departing.

 

[Wookiee]

Looking at the article, are they currently running HSTs to Weymouth (e.g. for summer specials)?

When I was there earlier this month the train I took from there was a 150 which was switched off until the doors were opened about 5 mins before departing.

I reckon the photo is of one of the Olympic specials.

 

[higthomas]

Looking at the article, are they currently running HSTs to Weymouth (e.g. for summer specials)?

When I was there earlier this month the train I took from there was a 150 which was switched off until the doors were opened about 5 mins before departing.

Yes, they run Summer Saturday specials; the so called 'Weymouth Wizard.' As in the frequently requested diagrams thread.

 

[Johnuk123]

What a silly waste of money.

 

[TheEdge]

I have a feeling Mk3 (and Mk2) stock can start behaving oddly when they loose all power for an extended period of time. I might be wrong but Mk3s can start having CDLs bolts retract if they loose power for an extended period. Not a problem on a depot where they are being serviced and prepped but out during a turnaround that would need to be investigated as a wrong side door failure.

 

[Deepgreen]

I have a feeling Mk3 (and Mk2) stock can start behaving oddly when they loose all power for an extended period of time. I might be wrong but Mk3s can start having CDLs bolts retract if they loose power for an extended period. Not a problem on a depot where they are being serviced and prepped but out during a turnaround that would need to be investigated as a wrong side door failure.

Would this therefore mean that coaching stock stabled in sidings, etc., overnight can be expected to present faults when used in the morning? Surely not.

 

[island]

Don't know about 43s, but Iarnród Éireann's 200 class locos are rarely shut off for fear they won't start up again!

 

[ComUtoR]

Would this therefore mean that coaching stock stabled in sidings, etc., overnight can be expected to present faults when used in the morning? Surely not.

Yep. That is exactly what happened to me a few days ago. Our units will lose air and go "flat" if left cut out and cutting them back in takes a while and can cause problems on reboot. In the winter there is no heating so you need to leave them cut in to keep the anti frost heating active.

 

[Jamesb1974]

Deleted

 

[dgl]

Is it to keep the engines hot? I think I read on this forum that the MTU engines now fitted to the HST's do not like being cold started (it can damage them) and in normal occasions would be hooked up to a depot supply which powers heaters in the engine to keep it warm when stabled for long periods, but with there being no supply at Weymouth they have to keep the engines running.

Normally keeping the engines running wouldn't be a problem as the train would not be stopped at a station for very long but in this case due to the extended dwell time it is a problem.

And as for shore supply, I think it could be done (they've obviously got some power available nearby) whether they would bother it another matter.

 

[ComUtoR]

And as for shore supply, I think it could be done (they've obviously got some power available nearby) whether they would bother it another matter.

Would they need staff to hook it up ? All I do is put a unit in the shed and the maintenance guys change it over to shore supply. I'm not allowed or qualified to touch anything inside the sheds. I just drive 'em.

 

[Jamesb1974]

Deleted

 

[Ash Bridge]

If they are complaining about fumes from MTU power units when idling, then they should consider themselves lucky the the HST's aren't still fitted with Paxman Valenta units, then they would really know what fumes were

 

[AM9]

If they are complaining about fumes from MTU power units when idling, then they should consider themselves lucky the the HST's aren't still fitted with Paxman Valenta units, then they would really know what fumes were

Not really. The worse the pollution is the more likely that somebody responsible will have to react.

 

[455driver]

I have a feeling Mk3 (and Mk2) stock can start behaving oddly when they loose all power for an extended period of time. I might be wrong but Mk3s can start having CDLs bolts retract if they loose power for an extended period. Not a problem on a depot where they are being serviced and prepped but out during a turnaround that would need to be investigated as a wrong side door failure.

You are correct, leaving them with no hotel power will mess up the CDL and air con systems which is why they are either plugged into a shore supply or one PC is left running.

Of course I assume the paper thinks it would be better if the driver turned off both pcs and then ran back to Bristol ECS because of the faults leaving everyone to squeeze onto the next train.

Oh and the driver or a competent person would have to remain with the set, good eh.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Yes - a ridiculous amount of time, wasting fuel and polluting needlessly. Hotel power is only required shortly before departure, not for several hours. A question might be, are these trains manned at the time, and, if so, what do the crew do for five hours? If not, is it acceptable to leave a train unattended with the engine(s) running for hours - fire risk, vandalism/tampering, etc?

You an expert on HSTs are you then?
Could you please rewrite our traction manuals because according to you they are all wrong.

Edit-
Maybe the paper should approach GWR for an explanation or would that mess up the article moaning about the railways?

 

[Rich McLean]

Starting Power Car engines from cold incurs a 100 hour penalty, so is another reason why there is an instruction to keep one PC running. The other alternative is not to run the HST at all, and make do with units

 

[Zoidberg]

Starting Power Car engines from cold incurs a 100 hour penalty...

Could you explain what you mean by that, please?

I infer that it brings the engine 100 hours nearer a service, but I'd rather know than infer.

Thanks.

 

[dgl]

Could you explain what you mean by that, please?

I infer that it brings the engine 100 hours nearer a service, but I'd rather know than infer.

Thanks.

Yep, that's why when they are stabled in a depot they use the shore supply to run heaters in the engine to keep it warm.

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Do HSTs have any kind of "power bus" running through the train from one power car through all coaches to the other powercar?

 

[Zoidberg]

Yep, that's why when they are stabled in a depot they use the shore supply to run heaters in the engine to keep it warm.

Thanks. There must, then, be significant risk of excessive wear stemming from a cold start.

I know that with a car, the most "damage" is done to an engine within the first few minutes of a cold start but didn't realise just how bad it could be for big lumps like those in railway locos (and presumably others, like marine ones, too).

 

[markindurham]

Thanks. There must, then, be significant risk of excessive wear stemming from a cold start.

I know that with a car, the most "damage" is done to an engine within the first few minutes of a cold start but didn't realise just how bad it could be for big lumps like those in railway locos (and presumably others, like marine ones, too).

You are quite correct.

 

[Rich McLean]

Yep 100hrs closer to a service from a cold start, which would be over a weeks revenue earning service (there or there about's) lost, instead of 5hrs idle plus fuel which is significantly cheaper.

 

[Zoidberg]

Yep 100hrs closer to a service from a cold start, which would be over a weeks revenue earning service (there or there about's) lost, instead of 5hrs idle plus fuel which is significantly cheaper.

Puts things in perspective, thanks.

 

[TheEdge]

Thanks. There must, then, be significant risk of excessive wear stemming from a cold start.

I know that with a car, the most "damage" is done to an engine within the first few minutes of a cold start but didn't realise just how bad it could be for big lumps like those in railway locos (and presumably others, like marine ones, too).

From a laymans view I assume these big prime movers are designed to be running 16 hours a day so I guess they are just not designed for cold starts.

 

[superalbs]

If there are problems with the engines, will it swap back to a unit?

 

[Andyh82]

Is it possible to leave them idling in the station, or to use an alternative stabling site in the area?

 

[SpacePhoenix]

Do Weymouth sidings have a shore supply that the HSTs could be plugged into?

 

[TheEdge]

Is it possible to leave them idling in the station, or to use an alternative stabling site in the area?

Or they could just accept they live next to a railway which was there before them and deal with the train noise...