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Future of the Class 60 locos at Toton?

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E_Reeves

E_Reeves

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Hi,
I know this may have been discussed somewhere else, but after my recent visit to Toton, I am amazed that they would have so many perfectly good locos lined up waiting for nature to take them over. Also says that most of them are unserviceable, but they look good (apart from the odd broken window)
Will they be scrapped in the near future, or be refitted to work services?

Thanks :)
 
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Strathclyder

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Considering how long some of them have been parked there (over 10 years for some of them), I highly doubt that they'll ever turn a wheel under their own power again. They may look alright externally, but lord knows what the insides of them is like. The cost of making them fit for mainline service couldn't really be justified in today's economy, particularly when there are plenty of 66s available.

A great shame and a tragic waste of some fine locomotives, if you ask me.
 
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Harbornite

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I heard from my friend's neighbour's colleague's brother's cleaner that Crosscountry want to fund the overhaul of these locos so they can raise their top speed to 125mph for new motorail services from Stranraer and Dumfries to Brighton via the Settle and Carlisle line and Newhaven Marine. They'll top and tail 442s and will have class 230s as slip coaches.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Tracked said:
Push-pull arrangement with 442's and 142 DVT's?

There. Said it.

<D


Probably too late to do them up for export?
Click to expand...

Top and tail will be better!
 
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Ash Bridge

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trainmania100 said:
I'd love to buy a 60 to have in my back garden :) no idea how much they'd cost
Click to expand...

You must have a hell of a large back garden then ;)

I seem to recall they worked out at close on £2m apiece when ordered near 30 years ago, I'll bet their scrap value today would be a healthy 5 figure sum?
 
BestWestern

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Considering the state of some of the stuff brought back to life in the past, is it plausible that Euro Pheonix or whoever might be able to set up a natty production line getting them sorted for export? It appears to be a viable market, and I'd guess a 60 is pretty close to the 'ideal mix' for some countries of reasonably modern but with the most basic sort of electro gadgetry? They can't be very complicated, by today's standards, surely?!
 
Philip Phlopp

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SpacePhoenix said:
Do class 60s have any electronics onboard for anything?
Click to expand...

Yes - they have a fairly advanced traction system using SEPEX (separately excitable) traction motors which are computer controlled.

There's also the cab signalling equipment - TPWS, AWS, GSM-R (if fitted, now needed) and OTDR.
 
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SpacePhoenix

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Philip Phlopp said:
Yes - they have a fairly advanced traction system using SEPEX (separately excitable) traction motors which are computer controlled.

There's also the cab signalling equipment - TPWS, AWS, GSM-R (if fitted, now needed) and OTDR.
Click to expand...

I would guess that the SEPEX would be the only potential source of problems with regard to obsolete electronic components
 
BR60062

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CosherB said:
http://www.railmagazine.com/trains/current-trains/making-the-class-60s-super-again

An interesting article describing a Super 60 overall, for those that haven't seen it before.
Click to expand...
Very good read that :). I am pleased that its not completely game over for these locomotives. I would say that more Class 60's could return to service if GB Railfreight/Europorte buy any for their fleet. Colas has a few of them with a positive outcome.

On the talk of Class 60 with passenger trains, if the Class 60's were ever modified to work on passenger trains. They would firstly need to have a HEP output to power the carriages or a generator coach (converted Mk3 DVT with generator fitted for HEP/ETH?) in the consist as a minimum. Also secondly the locomotives would need a serious rework with uprated traction motors to deliver a top speed of about 80/90mph to comply for mainline operations.

Depending on the rolling stock used. The Class 60's would fit perfectly with a rake of Mk3's and a Mk3 DVT as I run one of my Hornby Class 60's with a Mk3 rake and DVT and it looks somewhat uniform! :lol:. If a new power unit would be required. You could always used the Caterpillar V12 as used on the Class 68 locomotives. Or shove some secondhand EMD710T-3i's in them for some awesome thrash. The video below will show how they might sound with that setup.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1U4T85H4G-k
 
Harbornite

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No chance or point, I'm afraid. There isn't a need for new passenger locos, that can be met by ordering purpose built designs that can actually do 80/90mph as part of their design speed.
 
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richieb1971

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That article was written before colas bought theirs I think.

Its old. I don't recall any 60's being brought into service since colas bought theirs.

And look how it went, a month later colas was running 2 oil tank trains that DBs ran before the sale. I don't think they will sell again. Perhaps if its new business that DBs doesn't already own that the locos are for.
 
CosherB

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BR60062 said:
Very good read that :). I am pleased that its not completely game over for these locomotives. I would say that more Class 60's could return to service if GB Railfreight/Europorte buy any for their fleet. Colas has a few of them with a positive outcome.

On the talk of Class 60 with passenger trains, if the Class 60's were ever modified to work on passenger trains. They would firstly need to have a HEP output to power the carriages or a generator coach (converted Mk3 DVT with generator fitted for HEP/ETH?) in the consist as a minimum. Also secondly the locomotives would need a serious rework with uprated traction motors to deliver a top speed of about 80/90mph to comply for mainline operations.

Depending on the rolling stock used. The Class 60's would fit perfectly with a rake of Mk3's and a Mk3 DVT as I run one of my Hornby Class 60's with a Mk3 rake and DVT and it looks somewhat uniform! :lol:. If a new power unit would be required. You could always used the Caterpillar V12 as used on the Class 68 locomotives. Or shove some secondhand EMD710T-3i's in them for some awesome thrash. The video below will show how they might sound with that setup.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1U4T85H4G-k
Click to expand...

I think that qualifies as todays best "Barnpot Engineering Award (not involving 442s and 321s)" :lol:
 
Harbornite

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CosherB said:
I think that qualifies as todays best "Barnpot Engineering Award (not involving 442s and 321s)" :lol:
Click to expand...

It might not be that complicated. One ex forumgoer reported that a class 60 once reached 100mph with a railtour... :)
 
BR60062

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Harbornite said:
It might not be that complicated. One ex forumgoer reported that a class 60 once reached 100mph with a railtour... :)
Click to expand...
A Class 60 doing 100mph! :lol:. That's new to me because they are limited to 60mph max regardless of what they can haul. I think without some serious modifications to the traction motors, that would result in a serious traction motor barbecue moment! :lol:

CosherB said:
I think that qualifies as todays best "Barnpot Engineering Award (not involving 442s and 321s)" :lol:
Click to expand...
I am staying well clear of the Class 442 debate because there is enough froth floating about on here as it is mate :lol:. As for the mods side of things. I was just having a bit of banter ;).

Don't get me wrong though, the Class 442's were good in their day and as much as I like them. The future for the 442's is either preservation at heritage railway sites like the MNR, NNR, NVR, ELR, SVR, GCR etc and perhaps Booth's for the really rough units that would cost too much to preserve. As times have changed and the travelling public want the latest trains. We are just rail enthusiasts :).

However most of the Class 60's that are stored at Toton have a lot more reuse value. I did read a while ago that a Class 37 that was stored over 10 years was reinstated back into traffic (It could have been 37501? But honestly speaking I cannot remember its fleetnumber for the life of me). But that shows that its not necessary the end of the road for the Class 60's as that has been proved with the "Super Tug" program that started in 2011 under DB Schenker that would have never happened under EWS. The downside for the Class 60's was that every single one went to EWS as had Freightliner inherited some of them and perhaps GBRF at the end of the 1990's when BR was totally privatised. I reckon that ones under Freightliner would have been used and ugly Class 70's would have not been required for heavy haul. Same with GBRF as the Class 60's are very good locomotives and they had very advanced CPU's that were ahead of their time in the 1980s/1990s when they first entered service under BR :).

You would be forgiven that I am speaking here from an enthusiast point of view and yes I will admit that the Class 60 is my favourite freight locomotive that is on the mainline. But for an FTOC that wants a powerful locomotive that is cheaper than buying a new locomotive. The obsolete Class 60's that DBC don't need/require is a good choice as demonstrated by Colas and I hope that Freightliner and GB Railfreight/Europorte will consider buying some. As then, all those 142/143/144 Pacers when displaced by proper trains can take the place of those stored Class 60's! ;). Also putting more freight by rail would be a good start as it would take some lorries off the road as well :D.
 
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BR60062 said:
A Class 60 doing 100mph! :lol:. That's new to me because they are limited to 60mph max regardless of what they can haul. I think without some serious modifications to the traction motors, that would result in a serious traction motor barbecue moment! :lol:
Click to expand...
Except it didn't barbecue anything. North Wales Railday or whatever it was, Brush man with laptop in attendance and the pair of 60s went well above 60mph...
 
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