Perfect CrossCountry train

[ABB125]

If you were specifying new trains for the XC franchise, what would you do?

Personally, I would get a nice 7 or 9-car EMU with massive windows, and make sure a large amount of axles are motored. I would then fit a powerful diesel engine (eg:1000hp) next to each cab, and lots of smaller one wherever they would fit underneath the rest of the coaches. There are 2 reasons for this: not all the engines would be needed at all times, so if an engine fails it doesn't really matter. With massive windows, it would be much easier for everyone to have a view.

In theory, all this would result in a fast accelerating, powerful, unaffected(ish) by engine failure bi-mode unit that could go anywhere. it could even have 3rd rail shoegear.

What do you think?

 

[class387]

More HSTs, less Voyagers.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you were specifying new trains for the XC franchise, what would you do?

Class 801 bi-modes, probably 6 or ideally 7-car. Off the shelf and absolutely ideal for the job.

Or as an alternative Stadler FLIRTs, if the East Anglia ones are good.

 

[najaB]

Two words: 'slip coaches'.


--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Personally, I would get a nice 7 or 9-car EMU with massive windows, and make sure a large amount of axles are motored. I would then fit a powerful diesel engine (eg:1000hp) next to each cab, and lots of smaller one wherever they would fit underneath the rest of the coaches.

Other than the cab-end engine, you pretty-much just described the Class 800.

 

[168lover]

I know it's never going to happen but a Class 121 with a Class 168 engine.

 

[Clansman]

Coach body similar to the Polaris design:
Maximised width, slightly curved body for tilt compatibility, end to end doors, bi-mode power cars (or 1 bi mode power car and a next gen DVT), decent legroom, window-seat alignment and a buffet car. Toilets in all coaches including 1 disabled toilet for each class of travel. Proportionate airlines/table seats (4 rows:2 tables). Extendible tables at all seats, including airline seats. Larger luggage provision (including luggage capacity in DVT)

Formations:
Around 7 or 8 coaches.
7 coach: 5 standard/1 standard+buffet/1 first
8 coach: 6 standard/1 buffet + first/1 first

Other prerequisites:
Free Wifi, complimentary bottle of water for all passengers, newspaper provision and up to date travel information screens in the vestibules, basic information screens throughout every coach (as per usual on most trains).

Most importantly - in cab signalling for the 140mph operation that will never come.

As simple as it is to type

 

[J-2739]

Hitachi bi modes that can be easily reformed in the maintenance facility as traffic dictates.

 

[shaun]

A Class 800, no contest. Nothing better for the job!

 

[Blindtraveler]

A Bi Mode fault free class 180 in fixed lengths of 10 coaches with SDO
8 Standard, 1 amixed use Buffet/kitchen/crew office/luggage van in 1 driving car and 1 first in the other driving car.

a fleat of 100 would be ordered for the core routes with the 3 car 175s moved from ATW for the 170 worked routes and any others needing 3 or 6 coaches of Standard only

The bi modes would offer hot and cold food at all times and carry a sheff on every train as well as 2 hoasts to deliver plated meals to seats. USB and 3 pin sockets would be offered as well as leather seats in First

 

[Harpers Tate]

...with overhead luggage space throughout large enough for an airline cabin baggage sized item, and preferably more space between seat backs (so, no airline style seating). "Keep Your Belongings With You At All Times" might then become a practical thing to actually do.....

 

[Clip]

Logo hauled 442s. ??????

 

[alexl92]

I know it's never going to happen but a Class 121 with a Class 168 engine.

Excuse me?

 

[ABB125]

Two words: 'slip coaches'.


--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Other than the cab-end engine, you pretty-much just described the Class 800.

Although class 800s have raised floors, my train wouldn't (hence the cab end engines to ensure there's enough power).

 

[Harbornite]

In my opinion, a class 68s, DBSOs and either chilternised mark 3s or a new build of coaching stock that isn't crap.

From a TOCs point of view, they'd probably go for units. Therefore, I'd suggest AT300s because they've got a got a suitable top speed and bi-mode capabilities. A mix of 6 car, 5 car and 11 car units would be nice, allowing for portion work a la GWR.

 

[Clansman]

In my opinion, a class 68s, DBSOs and either chilternised mark 3s or a new build of coaching stock that isn't crap.

Agree with you on the coaching point of view. Although 68s are limited to 100mph (upgrade to 125mph in future?).

Off topic, I must say - your posts number to sign up date ratio is impeccable

 

[Harbornite]

Off topic, I must say - your posts number to sign up date ratio is impeccable

Don't worry. As of October, I'll be slightly busier and my post per day ratio should go down!

 

[6Gman]

If XC was to use 7car sets (as many people here suggest) wouldn't it mean that doubling-up would be impossible?

 

[J-2739]

If XC was to use 7car sets (as many people here suggest) wouldn't it mean that doubling-up would be impossible?

They wouldn't need to double up if they were that long!

 

[najaB]

If XC was to use 7car sets (as many people here suggest) wouldn't it mean that doubling-up would be impossible?

If they had a mix of seven and four car sets then it should be possible (SDO may be required). Two seven car sets, even with SDO, would be challenging.

 

[A0wen]

More HSTs, less Voyagers.

It rather depends on the route.

HSTs are hopeless for services which have frequent stops, which many of the XC services do.

They are relatively slow to accelerate and the boarding time is chronically slow, add in from a mechanical point of view their reliability suffers with regular stop/start workings. It's part of the reason why the Midland Mainline uses Meridians (which let's be honest are essentially Voyagers) on its stopping services.

In many respects 2+2 seat Desiros would make pretty good XC units where they are run under the wires. Capable of 110mph, flexible enough to be run in 4, 8 or 12 car formation. Quiet from a passenger perspective and nice riding.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They wouldn't need to double up if they were that long!

I think they would be better to run longer sets and use more effective yield management to fill the seats on quieter services, a la VWC.

 

[Harbornite]

If XC was to use 7car sets (as many people here suggest) wouldn't it mean that doubling-up would be impossible?

I think that going for 5 car, 4 car and 11 car sets would sort it.

 

[J-2739]

I think they would be better to run longer sets and use more effective yield management to fill the seats on quieter services, a la VWC.

I'm not sure a 14 car train would go down well with guards (something that I'm NOT debating in this thread). If we must have a fixed formation, sensible lengthed 10 car IETs will go down a treat (longer cars+less cabs= more capacity). Do that and increase frequencies, and you'd be doing many favours to the generic public.

 

[swt_passenger]

Logo hauled 442s. ��

That's the branding sorted out then...

 

[Haydn1971]

I'd be reforming the 220/221s into longer units, ordering a small package of Class 802 bi-modes to replace the HSTs and to compensate for the reformed 220/221s, then look at picking up some more 170s, reforming into a flexible fleet that works with the existing stations they call at.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Ideal cross-country train?

Between 7 & 10 mk1/mk2a-c carriages including 1 brake first, 1 first, 1 buffet/griddle car, 3-6 standard and 1 brake standard. All corridor compartment coaches. Hauled by class 50s or 55s, with 37/4s on routes with restrictions. Services under the wires hauled by 85s...

In the real world, some sort of fixed-formation bi-mode unit with just one fully accessible loo per 5 coaches, to be placed near to the accessible seating. Adequate catering provision for both first and standard class, with one vehicle per set designed for family groups (So that I can avoid the screaming brats!).

 

[Adam0984]

I think it's gotta be the Hitachis for ease of maintenance fitting in with the GWR and VTEC depots would cut down on having to build new depots. Not sure whether to go 5/6 cars with enough for double sets through the core or 9/10 cars both have their merits

 

[class387]

Ideal cross-country train?

Between 7 & 10 mk1/mk2a-c carriages including 1 brake first, 1 first, 1 buffet/griddle car, 3-6 standard and 1 brake standard. All corridor compartment coaches. Hauled by class 50s or 55s, with 37/4s on routes with restrictions. Services under the wires hauled by 85s...

In the real world, some sort of fixed-formation bi-mode unit with just one fully accessible loo per 5 coaches, to be placed near to the accessible seating. Adequate catering provision for both first and standard class, with one vehicle per set designed for family groups (So that I can avoid the screaming brats!).

Something like this?

(Train in question is a SBB IC2000, not my photo)

 

[AlterEgo]

Ideal CrossCountry train is a Dash-8 Q400 operated by Flybe.

 

[6Gman]

They wouldn't need to double up if they were that long!

So trains currently 9/10car would be better for passengers if they were 7car?