Theresa May calls General Election on 8th June.

[Tetchytyke]

don't you believe that Britain should contribute to its own defence rather than simply freeloading on the Americans and French?

We don't contribute towards our own defence, the Tories in the last seven years have cut military spending significantly. NATO are repeatedly criticising us for not contributing 2% GDP towards defence. Only Labour, oddly enough, are promising to meet that target.

FWIW I don't think nuclear capability has any influence on our defence capabilities whatsoever. I think nuclear capability is nothing more than willy-waving at the UN Security Council: all the other nations with veto powers have it. I think Trident replacement is a waste of money.

 

[DarloRich]

I think Trident replacement is a waste of money.

I don't. Historically we negotiated a good deal with the yanks and got the missiles for a fraction of their true price and once they were developed. The Nassau Agreement negotiated by Macmillian & the following Polaris Sales Agreement were very clever, whether by design or accident!

That isnt me saying the system is cheap just that we didn't pay the true costs!

 

[Barn]

We don't contribute towards our own defence, the Tories in the last seven years have cut military spending significantly. NATO are repeatedly criticising us for not contributing 2% GDP towards defence. Only Labour, oddly enough, are promising to meet that target.

According to NATO's own figures, we've met the 2% target every year since the data range I looked at started in 2009.

The Conservatives have expressly pledged to meet the target.

 

[sk688]

Just out of interest , has anyone on this forum bought the " Strong and Stable my A*se " Posters ?

Seen a fair few recently , and would like to buy one , but not sure where from

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Amazing to see such differences on a matter where factual evidence is readily available to those who are prepared to look for it.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Just out of interest , has anyone on this forum bought the " Strong and Stable my A*se " Posters ? Seen a fair few recently , and would like to buy one , but not sure where from

It sounds very much like a poster that describes the condition known as severe constipation....

 

[HSTEd]

FWIW I don't think nuclear capability has any influence on our defence capabilities whatsoever. I think nuclear capability is nothing more than willy-waving at the UN Security Council: all the other nations with veto powers have it. I think Trident replacement is a waste of money.

A nation without nuclear weapons cannot possibly withstand a nation with nuclear weapons in an actual war.

Without nuclear weapons the state could be defeated in a matter of minutes when all of its major military installations are converted into clouds of radioactive vapour.

 

[RichmondCommu]

A nation without nuclear weapons cannot possibly withstand a nation with nuclear weapons in an actual war.

That's hardly a startling revelation.

 

[Y961 XBU]

Just out of interest , has anyone on this forum bought the " Strong and Stable my A*se " Posters ?

Seen a fair few recently , and would like to buy one , but not sure where from

I got one through my letterbox this morning, i noticed whos car delivered it so when they went into the next street to deliver more i used a marker pen to remove my details and put it in their car window

 

[EM2]

A nation without nuclear weapons cannot possibly withstand a nation with nuclear weapons in an actual war.

Without nuclear weapons the state could be defeated in a matter of minutes when all of its major military installations are converted into clouds of radioactive vapour.

Well that could still happen if the state does have them.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

Funny that during an election, talk about impending nuclear elimination is perfectly reasonable and if you don't consider it a possibility, you are a smelly "peace... man" hippy.

Outside of an election, talking about impending nuclear elimination makes you a survivalist wacko.

 

[HSTEd]

Well that could still happen if the state does have them.

The aggressor state's military would take catastrophic losses however and would be unable to exploit its advantage

 

[Groningen]

I guess nobody has calculated how much money has been spent from development from the atomic bombs in the 2nd World War untill now. It must where calling the amount in billions is an understatement.

One book about it is 20 years old. > https://www.brookings.edu/book/atomic-audit/

 

[Darandio]

Seems Diane Abbott has called in sick.....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/elec...alth'&&ns_fee=0#post_5937b24ee4b05cda1b1157fc

Jeremy Corbyn has asked Labour's shadow police minister Lyn Brown to stand in for Diane Abbott during her period of ill health.

Ms Abbott called in sick to an interview on BBC Radio 4's Woman's Hour yesterday - and the Labour leader confirmed she had been unwell for the past couple of days.

Ms Brown is Labour's candidate for West Ham.

 

[AlterEgo]

The best thing Labour can do right now is hide Diane Abbott. She's one of the reasons why I, regrettably, won't be voting for them.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Without nuclear weapons the state could be defeated in a matter of minutes when all of its major military installations are converted into clouds of radioactive vapour.

But then if Mental Country nukes my nukes before I get to nuke their nukes, what happens then?

 

[DarloRich]

But then if Mental Country nukes my nukes before I get to nuke their nukes, what happens then?

hard with them hidden on a submarine somewhere

 

[me123]

The best thing Labour can do right now is hide Diane Abbott. She's one of the reasons why I, regrettably, won't be voting for them.

Same.

 

[Tetchytyke]

hard with them hidden on a submarine somewhere

I'm pretty sure Mental Country know where Faslane is.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The best thing Labour can do right now is hide Diane Abbott. She's one of the reasons why I, regrettably, won't be voting for them.

It's fascinating, isn't it, how Labour "hiding" Diane Abbott is big news. But has anyone seen Liz Truss, the Lord Chancellor, and her pork markets recently? Anyone? No? Wonder why that might be.

I don't like Abbott and think she is useless, but I genuinely think the constant carping at her- and her alone- is nothing more than Tory dog whistling.

 

[DarloRich]

I'm pretty sure Mental Country know where Faslane is.

that is why we maintain at least one submarine constantly at sea, armed and ready to fire. I think the specification for trident was the total destruction of 15 Russian cities by any one submarine. That should be enough destructive power to deter most mental countries.

 

[AlterEgo]

I don't like Abbott and think she is useless, but I genuinely think the constant carping at her- and her alone- is nothing more than Tory dog whistling.

It's because she's a sitting duck of a target.

 

[pemma]

Ignore.

 

[Tetchytyke]

It's because she's a sitting duck of a target.

So are plenty in Labour. McDonnell is probably more useless than her. But he's neither black nor a woman.

That's not to say everyone who criticises her is dog whistling. She is useless, and always has been.

But the Tories' focus on her and her alone is absolutely and definitely dog whistling.

 

[DarloRich]

So are plenty in Labour. McDonnell is probably more useless than her. But he's neither black nor a woman.

That's not to say everyone who criticises her is dog whistling. She is useless, and always has been.

But the Tories' focus on her and her alone is absolutely and definitely dog whistling.

she has been more visible ( sadly because as you say they is a walking disaster area) than Old McDonnell and is a massive hate figure for many on the right because of her, frankly, bonkers views. Criticising McDonnell has less traction with the Kippers and other frutiy right wingers the Conservatives are pitching at.

I am not sure it is racist dog whistling, but it is certainly designed to bring out the right wingers

 

[Tetchytyke]

I am not sure it is racist dog whistling, but it is certainly designed to bring out the right wingers

Most of the fruity right wingers wouldn't give a toss about her if she was a white bloke, regardless of her views. They don't froth at the mouth about Dennis Skinner, for example. I don't think she's the most bonkers on the Labour front benches (that award goes to Richard Burgon, since you're asking), never mind the most bonkers in the parliamentary party.

And that's why I think it is dog whistling.

 

[Barn]

Most of the fruity right wingers wouldn't give a toss about her if she was a white bloke, regardless of her views. They don't froth at the mouth about Dennis Skinner, for example. I don't think she's the most bonkers on the Labour front benches (that award goes to Richard Burgon, since you're asking), never mind the most bonkers in the parliamentary party.

And that's why I think it is dog whistling.

To be fair, Dennis Skinner:

(a) isn't seeking to be home secretary during an apparent terror campaign;
(b) doesn't volunteer for every interview going (until this week).

I do agree about Richard Burgon though.

 

[AlterEgo]

Most of the fruity right wingers wouldn't give a toss about her if she was a white bloke, regardless of her views. They don't froth at the mouth about Dennis Skinner, for example.

Dennis Skinner is an old man and not a prospective Home Secretary (one of the Great Offices of State, no less) who has been on the TV most days.

 

[DarloRich]

To be fair, Dennis Skinner:

(a) isn't seeking to be home secretary during an apparent terror campaign;
(b) doesn't volunteer for every interview going (until this week).

I do agree about Richard Burgon though.

Dennis Skinner is an old man and not a prospective Home Secretary (one of the Great Offices of State, no less) who has been on the TV most days.

Agreed!

 

[Tetchytyke]

Dennis Skinner is...not a prospective Home Secretary

Abbott got just as much crap flung at her when she was a backbencher. The one thing everyone remembers- her children's schooling- was from her time on the back benches.

As I said, though, I think there are many legitimate complaints about Abbott's competence. I think many people who dislike Abbott have legitimate reasons.

But none of these complaints are being raised by the Tories. It is, instead, a direct attack on her as a person. The campaign is nothing more than "Diane Abbott? Eugh". I think that is dog whistling.

ETA Dog whistling is all about the subtext, that is exactly what the term means. And in this case, the subtext is clearly "do you really want a black woman as Home Secretary?" And as the Tories are not picking on Burgon, or Tom Watson, or Rebecca Long-Bailey, I do not think that is coincidental.

And if you don't think the Tories are like this, look at what they did to Sayeeda Warsi. And compare how she has been treated for a minor expenses issue compared to, say, Jeremy *unt.