Scotrail Class 385 Discussion

[InOban]

The problem isn't Partick, the junction is grade separated. It's the flat junction beyond Hyndland.

 

[NotATrainspott]

Thinking long term, say 25 years from now, and assuming Network Rail’s demand forecasts are accurate, would tram train be able to provide enough capacity to meet peak time demand on the Cathcart lines? Could you feasibly run 30-40 tram trains per hour in the peak?

There’s a high risk you’d regret giving up the potential capacity which heavy rail would offer.

A necessary part of metro conversion would be a shift in expectations. In the peak someone joining at Pollokshields might have a tram every couple of minutes but they're likely going to have to stand up for the few minutes it'll practically take them to reach their destination. Most people around the world wouldn't bat an eyelid at having to stand for that sort of journey. The fact that they might currently have more seats and other facilities is an anomaly.

This discussion has been had before, but the theoretical capacity of heavy rail is just that - theoretical. Unless the economics are there to actually reach that capacity, it isn't actually realisable. The need to shift a vast number of people during the peak doesn't always mean it's economical to do so as that capacity could well sit idle the rest of the time, losing money. A system could be better overall despite having a lower theoretical peak capacity because of how it better matches demand throughout the rest of the day.

I mean, if the cost savings/benefits from using metro light rail are as high as they appear to be out of the peak, it might be cheaper just to throw more bus services at Pollokshaws Road for a few hours during the peak. Rail is just one part of the transport system and deficiencies in one mode should be made up for by other modes. Buses are much cheaper and more adaptable to demand changes than rail is.

Another option might be 5x23 units. Would have more space as you only have 2 cabs not 4 and only need 1 accessible loo instead of 2 and still fit in the exisiting platforms.

The train frequency through both tunnels is very low at 6 an hour via Central and 8 an hour via Queen Street so another option would be more trains rather than longer ones, although some of these would need to terminate before the routes merge at Partick.

There's a cheap solution for more capacity on either North Clyde or Argyle line networks east of the city - finish building the third platform at Hyndland. The fact that it hasn't happened yet, and isn't planned either, is possibly indicative of the lack of any need to do it. What would the extra services actually be? A major constraint is that the Yoker loop is the only real overtaking opportunity on the whole network. Extra services could only fill certain gaps in the timetable rather than enabling fundamentally new journey opportunities.

 

[youngac]

Anyone know how many 385s have the new windshield fitted? Only units I have confirmed so far are 003, 004, 005, 104 and 107.

 

[yorkie]

Can I again remind members that this is a Traction and Rolling Stock thread for discussion of Scotrail Class 385 issues.

Topics relating to timetables, infrastructure, or anything else should be posted in the appropriate threads in the appropriate sub forums. Feel free to create a thread if there isn't one already.

 

[JumpinTrainz]

It’s bizzare to think that the 318s are 32 years old and the Class 320s are nearing 30 also! I always see these trains as newer than they actually are. I think the difference there is that they’ve been modified and refurbished as they years have gone on compared to the 314s which had barely been touched. They also had no toilet access or selective door opening.

Within the next 10 years they’ll be looking to replace them. I definitely think they’ll continue with the longer carriages like the 380s and 385s to accommodate for rising passenger demands. Because 318s and 320s have come to dominate these routes I wonder if they’ll order a huge fleet for the Argyle and North Clyde lines to run alongside the 334s or whether they’ll be cascading the 380s on to Airdrie-Bathgate. Will be an odd one to see....

 

[youngac]

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K96000/2018/08/24/advanced

Realtimetrains has paths for 385 deliveries running every night from Tuesday till Friday.

 

[SC318250]

No delivery paths in yet for deliveries this week. The paths you see are movements between maintenance depot and cleaning depot/stabling yard

Deliveries come from Merchant Park sidings

 

[youngac]

No delivery paths in yet for deliveries this week. The paths you see are movements between maintenance depot and cleaning depot/stabling yard

Deliveries come from Merchant Park sidings

My apologies, I’m a bit new to the train enthusiast scene.

 

[alangla]

Does anyone know if a 385 will fit down the Paisley Canal line? It's 314/380 only just now, so presumably will become solid 380 if the 385 can't squeeze under the wires safely

 

[Stopper]

Not seen anything on 385s to Paisley Canal. Once all of the 385s are in service, Gourock/Wemyss Bay was supposed to become exclusively worked by 380s, I assume Paisley Canal would be the same.

 

[Bikeman78]

I read somewhere , one of the mags that the 385s are not being cleared for Neilston due to the turnback not long enough for 6 cars . SO going to 318s and 320s , though do 320s have to be cleared for Neilston?

320s have been to Neilston. There's a booked 318 diagram now which sometimes get a 320.

 

[Bikeman78]

The 314s have been on the Gourocks and maybe the Weymss bay for years . They are covering for 380s on the E & G , there is 318 diagram on saturday to Gourock for some reason.

Yes I know. 314s to Gourock started when they took them off the Argyle line around 1999/2000. More recently, there were never quite enough 380s to cover all Wemyss Bay and Gourock trains although I think 314s were peaks only for a time.

 

[route101]

320s have been to Neilston. There's a booked 318 diagram now which sometimes get a 320.

Didnt realise , i throught id read somewhere that 320s were not cleared for the Neilston Branch .

 

[GrimShady]

How many are in service now on the E&G?

 

[Highlandspring]

Still the same pair.

 

[Journeyman]

How many are in service now on the E&G?

Just one diagram, with the same pair of units every day (003 and 104).

 

[youngac]

Those two units must be fairly knackered after a month of near constant running!

 

[Highlandspring]

Hardly.

 

[Carntyne]

Those two units must be fairly knackered after a month of near constant running!

They're built to be hammered on the E&G for the next 40 years!

 

[youngac]

They're built to be hammered on the E&G for the next 40 years!

I suppose the fact there’s been no reported hiccups suggests that they’re doing very well so far.

 

[Journeyman]

I suppose the fact there’s been no reported hiccups suggests that they’re doing very well so far.

As far as I can tell, it's covered every turn it's meant to have done so far. That said, there's usually always Hitachi staff on board, so it's being monitored closely at the moment.

 

[youngac]

As far as I can tell, it's covered every turn it's meant to have done so far. That said, there's usually always Hitachi staff on board, so it's being monitored closely at the moment.

Only problem I noticed on my first ride on one on Tuesday was a high frequency flickering on the passenger information display which made it very hard to look at. Aside from that I was very impressed and look forward to seeing them on my local line in the near future.

 

[GrimShady]

Still the same pair.

Hardly.

Thanks for the info.

 

[TheAlbanach_]

Is there a reason there are only two sets running?

 

[Journeyman]

Only problem I noticed on my first ride on one on Tuesday was a high frequency flickering on the passenger information display which made it very hard to look at. Aside from that I was very impressed and look forward to seeing them on my local line in the near future.

Personally, I'm a bit underwhelmed - I've travelled on it a lot over the last month, and there's some evidence of poor design. Window alignment is poor, there's not enough airline seats, and the ironing boards are a bit grim. It's functional rather than anything particularly special, although it rides nicely and does the job perfectly well for what will be a 42-minute run.

 

[GrimShady]

Personally, I'm a bit underwhelmed - I've travelled on it a lot over the last month, and there's some evidence of poor design. Window alignment is poor, there's not enough airline seats, and the ironing boards are a bit grim. It's functional rather than anything particularly special, although it rides nicely and does the job perfectly well for what will be a 42-minute run.

Did you by chance try out first?

 

[Journeyman]

Did you by chance try out first?

I've had a look in it, but not used it yet. It looks nicer, but has only one airline single seat - with absolutely no view.

 

[InOban]

I guess they're only operating one diagram because the Hitachi engineers are on board. If they were to add extra diagrams, they would need more Hitachi staff. Once they can be dispensed with, then they can bring more units into use.

 

[GrimShady]

I've had a look in it, but not used it yet. It looks nicer, but has only one airline single seat - with absolutely no view.

Bummer!

 

[youngac]

Another issue I’ve just remembered is the location of the plug sockets between the seats which makes them a bit awkward to use. The one I used was filthy.