Islineclear3_1
Established Member
Of course, how will driverless cars bring in much needed tax revenues if ththey don't attract parking/speeding/red-route fines, fuel duty, road fund duty etc etc...?
Of course, how will driverless cars bring in much needed tax revenues if ththey don't attract parking/speeding/red-route fines, fuel duty, road fund duty etc etc...?
Who would own them if they are basically taxi pods?. Who is responsible for insuring them? What happens if one skids on a wet road and hits my car? Assuming I still own a car when these are being introduced...Why would they not be taxed?
Who would own them if they are basically taxi pods?. Who is responsible for insuring them? What happens if one skids on a wet road and hits my car? Assuming I still own a car when these are being introduced...
But as there is no driver, presume the cost of insurance will be factored into the hire charge. Then you could add on road tax, fuel (electric) duty, cost per mile which could then add up to be prohibitively expensive for particularly, short journeys.Same as care hire / taxi firms.
An intermediate stage would be to have a driver who works remotely. The technology works for military drones. It can default to an autonomous mode if it loses network access, and perhaps avoid that location if its a permanent blackspot for internet access.
For a taxi service, you can then avoid the cost of paying for a driver to hang around waiting for passengers to turn up. If the taxi ends up in the suburbs, it can park there, and the driver can switch to a different journey. If the taxi needs to park in a city centre, they can park automatically in a car park, which could be done at much higher density if you don't need to open the doors to get inside, and if they are parked closely in line.
Taxi driving would then become something like working in a call centre, and might get off-shored to save more.
But as there is no driver, presume the cost of insurance will be factored into the hire charge. Then you could add on road tax, fuel (electric) duty, cost per mile which could then add up to be prohibitively expensive for particularly, short journeys.
Then as these pods won't be able to break the speed limit or attract parking fines, there's a lot of revenue to be lost...
The cost of all those things is in the cost of taxis today, plus the cost of the driver (which is the biggest cost), and they seem to be perfectly affordable for many.
The finance and ownership structure will be different to existing taxi and car hire operations. The change in technology and capital outlay will dictate that.Who would own them if they are basically taxi pods?. Who is responsible for insuring them? What happens if one skids on a wet road and hits my car? Assuming I still own a car when these are being introduced...
One thought about family trips. Once the destination is set how do you tell the pod that little Johnny needs a loo stop NOW!
Presumably by pushing the relevant button on the control panel. Rumours that it replies with a meassaging stating “YOU SHOULD’VE GONE BEFORE WE LEFT!” are as yet unconfirmed.
I don't think that taxi style autonomous vehicles will work for more than local journeys. A thousand suddenly turning up at Blackpool or Brighton today all needing a recharge before the customers return home tonight?
Was there a shortage of Petrol for all the petrol cars that turned up today?I don't think that taxi style autonomous vehicles will work for more than local journeys. A thousand suddenly turning up at Blackpool or Brighton today all needing a recharge before the customers return home tonight?
Although, even if you were able to halve the cost "taxis" would still be quite a bit more expensive than most public transport options (locally I could go about twice as far by bus for about half the cost compared to getting a taxi, that's not even using a season ticket).
There was a forum for doomsayers, The Times.it's a good job forums like this didn't exist at the time when internal combustion engines were taking off, I can just imagine the doomsayers in action staying that there would never be enough petrol stations around.
I can't work out if you have totally missed the point or are just trolling.Was there a shortage of Petrol for all the petrol cars that turned up today?
it's a good job forums like this didn't exist at the time when internal combustion engines were taking off, I can just imagine the doomsayers in action staying that there would never be enough petrol stations around.
My point is the market will evolve as it always had and is likely to carry on doing.I can't work out if you have totally missed the point or are just trolling.
If autonomous vehicles are ito be individually owned then charging would be dispersed and there would be no problem. The issue is taxi style operation where you could get a peak of demand at a single depot.
(Second response)it's a good job forums like this didn't exist at the time when internal combustion engines were taking off, I can just imagine the doomsayers in action staying that there would never be enough petrol stations around.
I don't think that taxi style autonomous vehicles will work for more than local journeys. A thousand suddenly turning up at Blackpool or Brighton today all needing a recharge before the customers return home tonight?
I don't think that taxi style autonomous vehicles will work for more than local journeys. A thousand suddenly turning up at Blackpool or Brighton today all needing a recharge before the customers return home tonight?
How will these driverless taxis plug themselves in to charge?
How will these driverless taxis plug themselves in to charge?
Induction, probably, as used on the MK electric bus trial.
In my experience that's rarely true outside large cities once there are two or more of you. For example, a simple return trip into town by bus for me would cost 5.70, while a taxi would be about 6 pounds each way. Of course on longer distances the bus wins. It's the same with train fares, if there are four people travelling it's quite likely the petrol to drive it will be less than the cost of the train.
As pointed out in the previous post, if you move to a shared mobility model then the charge for each journey must include a share of the fixed(ish) cost of the vehicle. It's much lower than a journey would cost in an owned vehicle, because a shared vehicle makes a lot more journeys, but as you say nobody really thinks about the fixed cost of an owned vehicle.Once again, the "full cost of a car" model is an absolute fallacy and should be disregarded. Hardly anybody models their car use like that. They consider the fixed or occasional costs as a membership, effectively, and only consider fuel when making a journey.
It makes no difference if they technically should do this - simply that they do. And it will not change.
Until public transport accepts that and competes, using things like Railcards, it is always going to be onto a loser.
The bus industry mostly "gets it", with excellent value unlimited travel season tickets which cover the area that a "runabout" car would mostly be used in, allowing unlimited journeys.
As pointed out in the previous post, if you move to a shared mobility model then the charge for each journey must include a share of the fixed(ish) cost of the vehicle. It's much lower than a journey would cost in an owned vehicle, because a shared vehicle makes a lot more journeys, but as you say nobody really thinks about the fixed cost of an owned vehicle.
That would be a bad idea in transport and environment terms, exactly because it makes car use cheaper on a marginal basis once someone has paid out the lump sum. The rational choice to do so is exacerbated by the emotional "I've paid out all this money for this service, might as well make the most of it" factor.Of course, for the reason I pointed out, a shared model will not work if it doesn't include a "lump sum for membership then marginal cost" usage model for heavy users.