Rail strikes discussion

[SignallerJohn]

Don't see how you got to that. The view was (and mine is too) that airing your dirty laundry about your employer in public while doing your job is unacceptable behaviour. It's a matter between them, their Union and the employer, and none of the passengers' business.

So why did he say “It was something like £40,000 which isn’t millions but will hardly put you in poverty when you think cabin crew start on roughly £15,000 and survive.” ?

I agree 100% you shouldn’t talk about your employer in a negative light on any platform especially at work. But he then mentions the money.

 

[baz962]

What are these so called “Spanish practices“?

Don't you know that us lazy rail staff have a midday siesta.
Edited to add some wag beat me to it above

 

[Bluejays]

Someone has submitted FOIs to relevant TOCS on WDTK about payments for contingency TMs during strikes. Interesting to see what comes back

Contingency Guard Payment Agreement documents or information. - a Freedom of Information request to London North Eastern Railway Limited

I have seen a document going around social media from Abellio Greater Anglia showing their "Contingency Guard Payment Agreement" for the upcoming strikes next week. The document sets out the full agreement with staff members that are becoming Contingency Guards and the rates of pay that they...

www.whatdotheyknow.com

Some poor person has to read through all that waffle and rubbish before getting to a simple question.

Would be interesting to know the answer though

 

[KM1991]

What are these so called “Spanish practices“?

Sunday working a big one apparently. No pay deal or dispute will be resolved by the attempted inclusion of Sunday into the working week. Not going to happen.

 

[Bluejays]

Unprofessionalism reached its peak on the 0844 Alton - Waterloo today, as the guard said:

“Industrial action will take place tomorrow, and your journeys must be finished by 6pm. I know this may be inconvenient but imagine you’ve worked for the same poultry some of XXX grand for three years only to be offered a poxy 3% pay rise. The cost of living is rising, so is the cost of food - we cannot afford to put food on the table - we are not seen as worthy of a decent rise…”

He said more but I can’t remember what - it went on for about five minutes. The two SWR staff sat down the carriage (who looked rather high up like officials or something) stared at each other and gaped open mouths. The noisy carriage fell silent and just looked awkward.

Highly unprofessional… somewhat embarrassing even.

It is unprofessional and I also agree that its embarrassing. Continually Identifying people on public forums isn't a particularly great trait either though to be honest. I'd have hoped someone had a word with that guy and told him to wind his neck in. Does he deserve to be publicly outed though?

 

[baz962]

Sunday working a big one apparently. No pay deal or dispute will be resolved by the attempted inclusion of Sunday into the working week. Not going to happen.

Problem with this too is that some tocs already have Sunday inside, so how would the negotiations go with them.

 

[2021_Signaller]

I’m totally in favour that workers salary/benefits/conditions in all industries are not eroded & power to the elbow to those who have a union that fight for them.

I wanted to point out that though that there are railway workers like myself (agency) & many agency colleagues who have had this week’s shifts cancelled as ‘surplus to requirements’ because of the strike.

Bearing in mind our weekly shifts issued can range from zero to seven per week & anything in between.

If the strike continues for weeks or months then agency workers many already struggling on just over a tenner & some under a tenner pre tax/NI (based on region) won’t survive.

It isn’t just the fare paying passengers impacted & outside of my shifts for social travel I too am a fare paying passenger. There is a negative trickle down effect on certain staff in the industry because of a strike.

With that said I sincerely hope railway staff get a ‘fair day’s pay for a fair day’s work’ if that can be quantified.

Let's wait and see. Some people are already talking about action short of a strike. So normal timetables, everyone will be paid but we will be very uncooperative. The government isn't negotiating in good faith, so they are dragging us down to their level. It won't be pretty.

 

[GB]

Didn't you know at 1pm everything stops for a siesta?

Don't you know that us lazy rail staff have a midday siesta.
Edited to add some wag beat me to it above

Ah yes, should have remembered that!

Sunday working a big one apparently. No pay deal or dispute will be resolved by the attempted inclusion of Sunday into the working week. Not going to happen.

Indeed, at least not for such a small % increase....and nor should it.

 

[2021_Signaller]

Wrong. £15k wouldn't even be the basic salary and then there are allowances on top of that etc.



I assume a "mañana mañana" ethos


Feel free to move into another job then. No one is forcing you to work for the railways.

I'm considering my options. It's no skin off my nose. It's the company that's wasted the best part of quarter of a million training me. Looking into becoming a driver if there's a pathway for signallers to make that move...

 

[Starmill]

Apparently all this has been presented to the DFT for approval and HM Treasury is refusing to agree to any of it.

Indeed. The operator isn't at liberty to take commercial risk under their current contracts. The Treasury won't accept any proposals that require them to take on additional commercial risk, even if they're actually pretty good. So it's very unlikely that such a deal could be done.

 

[niggill617@gma]

Unprofessionalism reached its peak on the 0844 Alton - Waterloo today, as the guard said:

“Industrial action will take place tomorrow, and your journeys must be finished by 6pm. I know this may be inconvenient but imagine you’ve worked for the same poultry some of XXX grand for three years only to be offered a poxy 3% pay rise. The cost of living is rising, so is the cost of food - we cannot afford to put food on the table - we are not seen as worthy of a decent rise…”

He said more but I can’t remember what - it went on for about five minutes. The two SWR staff sat down the carriage (who looked rather high up like officials or something) stared at each other and gaped open mouths. The noisy carriage fell silent and just looked awkward.

Highly unprofessional… somewhat embarrassing even.

When I joined the industry back in 2000, aged 40, some old hand said to me " welcome to the railway boy, money for old rope, always has been, always will be".

 

[Watershed]

It is unprofessional and I also agree that its embarrassing. Continually Identifying people on public forums isn't a particularly great trait either though to be honest. I'd have hoped someone had a word with that guy and told him to wind his neck in. Does he deserve to be publicly outed though?

I think he publicly outed himself when he made a public announcement in that manner... it could have been recorded and uploaded to social media for all he knows. I hardly think he deserves the benefit of anonymity if he chooses to do that.

 

[Gems]

Just a point to those of you obsessing about what airline cabin crew earn.

Northern rail had 9. Yes 9 former cabin crew in guards training last year. Everyone left within a week once the airlines came a calling.

 

[KM1991]

Strikes are on tomorrow. No resolution was found at the talks today. A lot more can change before Thursday now though.

 

[2021_Signaller]

Just a point to those of you obsessing about what airline cabin crew earn.

Northern rail had 9. Yes 9 former cabin crew in guards training last year. Everyone left within a week once the airlines came a calling.

Same as the signaller training pilots that the Southern section of NR thought was a great idea recruiting for G9 jobs. What a waste of money...

 

[dk1]

What are these so called “Spanish practices“?

I find him more & more eccentric every time he appears for an interview. What with his orchestra, railway/nurses salary comparison, negotiate with their employers & the £16bh pandemic spend he & his team agreed too. They seem to be the only parts of the script that he can memorise.

 

[Bluejays]

I think he publicly outed himself when he made a public announcement in that manner... it could have been recorded and uploaded to social media for all he knows. I hardly think he deserves the benefit of anonymity if he chooses to do that.

I'm not advocating for him to revieve anonymity am I. If someone from management was on the train and heard him then he deserves what he gets. Detailing the incident on a public forum for a whole new set of people to see is out of order in my eyes.

 

[dk1]

Problem with this too is that some tocs already have Sunday inside, so how would the negotiations go with them.

According to inside sources my TOC isn’t interested in going for this but then we have no problem covering Sundays most of the time.

 

[Adrian1980uk]

The problem with all this we really have no idea what's being offered or requested. If one side came out and said we're offering x% based on Sunday working and xxx then the public could make an informed decision where their sympathy lies. Not that I believe it would happen because both parties aren't being totally upfront in my opinion.

 

[Gems]

We all know the government is blocking the pay side of agreements.
We'll all of us who aren't up Grants backside and have an agenda.

 

[Egg Centric]

I'm not advocating for him to revieve anonymity am I. If someone from management was on the train and heard him then he deserves what he gets. Detailing the incident on a public forum for a whole new set of people to see is out of order in my eyes.

He has anonymity. How would any normal person know who he is from what service he was running?

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'm not advocating for him to revieve anonymity am I. If someone from management was on the train and heard him then he deserves what he gets. Detailing the incident on a public forum for a whole new set of people to see is out of order in my eyes.

It's no different than the Press reporting it. If you do something in public you can't expect privacy. He's entitled to those views and to discuss them with his colleagues away from the public, but announcing them over the PA was gross stupidity of the highest order and may well even get him disciplined or even sacked for misuse of Company property and for wilfully bringing the Company into disrepute. (The latter is very often gross misconduct).

A strike is protected. Gobbing off over the PA isn't.

 

[Gems]

It's no different than the Press reporting it. If you do something in public you can't expect privacy. He's entitled to those views and to discuss them with his colleagues away from the public, but announcing them over the PA was gross stupidity of the highest order and may well even get him disciplined or even sacked for misuse of Company property and for wilfully bringing the Company into disrepute. (The latter is very often gross misconduct).

A strike is protected. Gobbing off over the PA isn't.

Funny but silly. Beats listening to the usual waffle of texting the BTP about anything suspicious.

 

[Bluejays]

He has anonymity. How would any normal person know who he is from what service he was running?

I don't think somebody should be outed on a forum that management read. Like I said, if management heard him on the train then he deserves what he gets. It's far from the first time the op has called staff out on here and twitter

 

[Watershed]

I don't think somebody should be outed on a forum that management read. Like I said, if management heard him on the train then he deserves what he gets. It's far from the first time the op has called staff out on here and twitter

You reap what you sow... he clearly wanted people to hear what he had to say. To reach a wider audience, if you will. Well he's reached a wider audience alright...

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

But I can see where he’s coming from when in as many words you say a salary of £40 k won’t put you in poverty so stop moaning.
The more you earn, the more you spend otherwise what’s the point?
Another point, where did you get the figure £40k from, both of your salary figures that you quote are wholly inaccurate?

I can’t remember the exact figure. My point isn’t the amount it was the fact he shouldn’t be divulging his salary on the tannoy in order to slag off his bosses or whoever

 

[Bluejays]

It's no different than the Press reporting it. If you do something in public you can't expect privacy. He's entitled to those views and to discuss them with his colleagues away from the public, but announcing them over the PA was gross stupidity of the highest order and may well even get him disciplined or even sacked for misuse of Company property and for wilfully bringing the Company into disrepute. (The latter is very often gross misconduct).

A strike is protected. Gobbing off over the PA isn't.

I'm not talking about the legalities of expecting privacy. More about the morality of the poster on here outing him on a forum that management read. As you point out, his idiotic ramblings could lead to dismissal. If someone hears him first hand then I would have little sympathy for him. But why would anyone want to post about it on a public forum and potentially cause him issues. All the op had to do was leave the time of the train out.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

The problem with all this we really have no idea what's being offered or requested. If one side came out and said we're offering x% based on Sunday working and xxx then the public could make an informed decision where their sympathy lies. Not that I believe it would happen because both parties aren't being totally upfront in my opinion.

Well so far nothing has been tabled, DfT or TOCs would be very quick to say if they put something out there that the RMT refused.

The only concrete offer was the NR one the other day of 2% plus 2x 0.5% salary bonus for milestone agreements towards modernisation program

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

It's far from the first time the op has called staff out on here and twitter

Can you DM me what you mean by this? Don’t put it here.

 

[Bluejays]

You reap what you sow... he clearly wanted people to hear what he had to say. To reach a wider audience, if you will. Well he's reached a wider audience alright...

'You reap what you sow' . Something I think many could bear in mind.