McGill's Scotland East (Midland Bluebird and Eastern Scottish)

[Baileygirl]

I notice that Scotland East have published advance notice of tomorrow's cancellations due to the ongoing driver shortage on their social feeds. Hopefully this continues, is kept up to date, and posted on the website/app tomorrow too.


I think the point being made is that the app shows every mobile ticket in one long list, which isn't intuitive. A search function, or putting each "zone" in its own category, might be better.


I agree. The McGill's CEO was justifying the new livery by saying "one says Lothian on it and the other says Eastern Scottish" and "all buses in London are red and it doesn’t confuse matters", the latter is hardly a valid comparison to make.

Two companies with near-identical liveries, operating in the same area (some services timetabled to run directly behind the other!) is only going to cause confusion amongst passengers, and more work for the drivers telling folk "you need the green bus, just make sure it has a big Eastern Scottish on it"...

The only good thing at the moment is that the route numbers are different for both operators so regulars will know which is which. The only concern is that tourists etc with day tickets will get confused.

 

[Lothian Buses]

I notice that Scotland East have published advance notice of tomorrow's cancellations due to the ongoing driver shortage on their social feeds. Hopefully this continues, is kept up to date, and posted on the website/app tomorrow too.


I think the point being made is that the app shows every mobile ticket in one long list, which isn't intuitive. A search function, or putting each "zone" in its own category, might be better.


I agree. The McGill's CEO was justifying the new livery by saying "one says Lothian on it and the other says Eastern Scottish" and "all buses in London are red and it doesn’t confuse matters", the latter is hardly a valid comparison to make.

Two companies with near-identical liveries, operating in the same area (some services timetabled to run directly behind the other!) is only going to cause confusion amongst passengers, and more work for the drivers telling folk "you need the green bus, just make sure it has a big Eastern Scottish on it"...

dont they all have the same fares shared etc?

 

[stevenedin]

The website doesn’t seem to work for me. Does it work for anyone else?

 

[Voyager lad]

The website doesn’t seem to work for me. Does it work for anyone else?

I can’t get it to work either

 

[Mickcloud9]

Me too and doesn’t look like the Lothian livery so much as previously thought. Only slightly.

It’s practically a carbon copy of Lothian Country livery. Here we go, everyone in West Lothian will be confused as to what bus belongs to who. Folk boarding country services with McGills tickets and vice versa. It smacks of desperation. I give them a year and Livingston Depot will be closed with Lothian being the dominant operator in West Lothian. Ye really can’t polish a turd. Day one of their operations and they have a cancellation list as long as the queue for Lizzie’s coffin. The depot is leased also and, given some of the ticket prices, it will be difficult to turn a coin outwith the Bright Bus operation. West Lothian Council are also shareholders of Lothian Country… so I can’t see them allowing their investment to suffer. How long before we see the bog standard McGills clapped out solo or dart sitting waiting for a fitter, causing carnage at Livingston centre? Fun and games indeed.

 

[Bus Lightyear]

It’s practically a carbon copy of Lothian Country livery… here we go, everyone in West Lothian will be confused as to what bus belongs to who. Folk boarding country services with McGills tickets and vice versa. It smacks of desperation. I give them a year and Livingston Depot will be closed with Lothian the dominant operator in West Lothian. Ye really can’t polish a turd. Day one of their operations and they have a cancellation list as long as the queue for lizzie’s coffin. The depot is leased also and given some of the ticket prices it will be difficult to turn a coin outwith the Bright Bus operation… and West Lothian Council are also shareholders of Lothian Country… so I can’t see them allowing their investment to suffer… how long before we see the bog standard McGills clapped out solo or dart sitting waiting for a fitter, causing carnage at Livingston centre. Fun and games indeed.

The new operator hardly have their foot in the door and it has the blood boiling of the LRT loyalists.

 

[Mickcloud9]

The new operator hardly have their foot in the door and it has the blood boiling of the LRT loyalists.

The new operator isn’t exactly trying to look new or outstanding. Given the livery it’s typical McGills. We shall see how many drivers they lose in the coming weeks. They have a reputation which unfortunately proceeds them at every opportunity. Coming from Glasgow and Lanarkshire I have seen them many times try to take over companies, implement their management style and contracts and saw them fall flat on their backside. McNairns/United Coaches is a prime example; they spent millions buying up small independents only for said independents to go buy new/better buses and lo and behold 18 months later, the independents are back on their routes with newer fleets with McGills retreating into a corner cowering at the money they have wasted.They are worse than First. Believe me when I say the people of Scotland East think they are the saviour the now, give it a year and they be wishing First had stuck it out.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

I think for this to work out McGills really need to improve the fleet, and quickly. I could count on hand the number of buses that are in a good presentable condition, and as we all know most are well past their sell by date now.

In time I expect McGills to try and get a depot in Edinburgh for Bright Bus. As for anything else, who knows what could happen. As with any takeover change will happen, but in what capacity only time will tell.

 

[Bus Lightyear]

The new operator isn’t exactly trying to look new or outstanding. Given the livery it’s typical McGills. We shall see how many drivers they lose in the coming weeks. They have a reputation which unfortunately proceeds them at every opportunity. Coming from Glasgow and Lanarkshire I have seen them many times try to take over companies, implement their management style and contracts and saw them fall flat on their backside. McNairns/United Coaches is a prime example; they spent millions buying up small independents only for said independents to go buy new/better buses and lo and behold 18 months later, the independents are back on their routes with newer fleets with McGills retreating into a corner cowering at the money they have wasted.They are worse than First. Believe me when I say the people of Scotland East think they are the saviour the now, give it a year and they be wishing First had stuck it out.

They have, albeit with some funding, deployed substantial numbers of electric buses on routes serving the western corridors into Glasgow.

What have Lothian done? Invested in 100 diesel double decks in the last 12-18 months. Perhaps it's Lothian who need to get with the times.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

They have, albeit with some funding, deployed substantial numbers of electric buses on routes serving the western corridors into Glasgow.

What have Lothian done? Invested in 100 diesel double decks in the last 12-18 months. Perhaps it's Lothian who need to get with the times.

All I’ll say is. Volvo BZL. Lothian don’t venture into big non Volvo orders. The BYD’s were funded by SEN and the StreetAirs were part of a trial in a massive multi-model order that was never completed.

 

[fgwrich]

This image has just been posted on the McGill's Enthusiast Group on Facebook in the last few minutes by Ralph Roberts

Image shows an E400MMC in the new Eastern Scottish livery
View attachment 120939

Having just seen it on Flickr, I’m also surprised that First included a load of Enviro MMCs in the sale. Id have thought, given their relative newness, they would have chosen to keep them in the group and swap them for some of the older vehicles in the empire!

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

In the Official McGill’s Bus Enthusiast Group on Facebook, Ralph Roberts confirmed that Falkirk Bus Station would be in McGill’s ownership from 19th September:

McGill’s will own the bus station from 19th September

It’s from this thread, you need to be a member to view it:

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www.facebook.com

Might we see McGills return the buses to the Bus Station? It seems like there’s some public support for it in the comments.

 

[CN04NRJ]

They have, albeit with some funding, deployed substantial numbers of electric buses on routes serving the western corridors into Glasgow.

What have Lothian done? Invested in 100 diesel double decks in the last 12-18 months. Perhaps it's Lothian who need to get with the times.

You just can't compare the two operations - 100 very low capacity double deckers that are often out for 20+ hours a day with huge numbers of customers/tourist customers. After the Streetair debacle and the shortcomings of hybrid tech now becoming clear perhaps it's one operator being smart and waiting for technology to mature (including hydrogen) and others jumping in too quick just because funding is available?

Early electric buses with some operators are already having expensive battery issues.

 

[Observer]

In the Official McGill’s Bus Enthusiast Group on Facebook, Ralph Roberts confirmed that Falkirk Bus Station would be in McGill’s ownership from 19th September:


It’s from this thread, you need to be a member to view it:


Might we see McGills return the buses to the Bus Station? It seems like there’s some public support for it in the comments.

The bus station is a complicated issue regarding ownership. Some of the buildings are actually owned by other landlords, McGill's do not have it all. The ownership issue is why First exited it.

It'd need a lot of work to have it redone and even then is it worthwhile? I seem to recall there was a plan to build a bus station near Falkirk Grahamston railway station.

 

[GusB]

The website seem to be working, although I haven't tried the journey planner.

Midland Bluebird

Scotland's Largest Independent Bus Company

www.mcgillsscotlandeast.co.uk

The midlandbluebird.co.uk domain has also been transferred - yesterday it was pointing to First's website.

 

[stevenedin]

The website seem to be working, although I haven't tried the journey planner.

Midland Bluebird

Scotland's Largest Independent Bus Company

www.mcgillsscotlandeast.co.uk

The midlandbluebird.co.uk domain has also been transferred - yesterday it was pointing to First's website.

It’s working for me now

I just looked at the route map has the X53 to Kinross been withdrawn now?

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

I just looked at the route map has the X53 to Kinross been withdrawn now?

If I remember correctly First withdrew that earlier in the year.

 

[GordonT]

In time I expect McGills to try and get a depot in Edinburgh for Bright Bus. As for anything else, who knows what could happen. As with any takeover change will happen, but in what capacity only time will tell.

Or get shot of Bright Bus in exchange for LRT reduction in West Lothian?

 

[stevenedin]

Or get shot of Bright Bus in exchange for LRT reduction in West Lothian?

Sounds like history repeating itself.

 

[overthewater]

The bus station is a complicated issue regarding ownership. Some of the buildings are actually owned by other landlords, McGill's do not have it all. The ownership issue is why First exited it.

It'd need a lot of work to have it redone and even then is it worthwhile? I seem to recall there was a plan to build a bus station near Falkirk Grahamston railway station.

I thought First had managed to sell it off? I can't see it coming back either.

Having just seen it on Flickr, I’m also surprised that First included a load of Enviro MMCs in the sale. Id have thought, given their relative newness, they would have chosen to keep them in the group and swap them for some of the older vehicles in the empire!

Are these the Livingston ones, ie the ones bought with Scottish Government funding?

If I remember correctly First withdrew that earlier in the year.

I think it was withdrawn at the start of the year and its not Bay Travel 202 missing section from Kinross - Dollar?

#####

Zone tickets will need to be overhauled at some point. Does anyone know if 3+ ticket is valid on McGills City service to Govan and Paisley?


Does Midland Bluebird no longer give change?
https://images-mcgills.passenger-website.com/inline-images/No Change.png

 

[Highland050261]

I see the Facebook page was taken down now theres a new one with nothing on it.

I thought First had managed to sell it off? I can't see it coming back either.



Are these the Livingston ones, ie the ones brought with Scottish Government funding?




I think it was withdrawn at the start of the year and its not Bay Travel 202 missing section from Kinross - Dollar?

#####

Zone tickets will need to be overhauled at some point. Does anyone know if 3+ ticket is vailed on McGills City service to Govan and Paisley?


Does Midland bluebird no longer give change?
https://images-mcgills.passenger-website.com/inline-images/No Change.png

On their website it says that they no longer give change.

 

[Observer]

I see the Facebook page was taken down now theres a new one with nothing on it.


On there website says no longer gives change.

Doubt it's going to happen suddenly...only Livingston doesn't give change. Otherwise there will be quite a lot of complaints getting sent in as no notice was given prior.

No signs on buses stating this...still buses going around with First labelling, no white stickers or anything mentioning the new company name or McGill's.

 

[JurassicMan]

It’s practically a carbon copy of Lothian Country livery. Here we go, everyone in West Lothian will be confused as to what bus belongs to who. Folk boarding country services with McGills tickets and vice versa. It smacks of desperation. I give them a year and Livingston Depot will be closed with Lothian being the dominant operator in West Lothian. Ye really can’t polish a turd. Day one of their operations and they have a cancellation list as long as the queue for Lizzie’s coffin. The depot is leased also and, given some of the ticket prices, it will be difficult to turn a coin outwith the Bright Bus operation. West Lothian Council are also shareholders of Lothian Country… so I can’t see them allowing their investment to suffer. How long before we see the bog standard McGills clapped out solo or dart sitting waiting for a fitter, causing carnage at Livingston centre? Fun and games indeed.

Sorry, didn't Lothian copy the Eastern Scottish /SMT Livery and also route numbers to try and imitate a former operator in the area?

And let's not speak about directly copying the First route x25 with 280 and 26 with 281. All of course is fair in love and war, so they say.
No use crying when the impersonator finds themselves being impersonated.

It’s obvious for whatever reason McGills have deliberately tried to do a livery similar to Lothians shape. As I’ve said before the colours are not the problem, it’s the design that is. Ralph Roberts can try to justify it but I’m afraid he’ll struggle to convince the majority.

I’ve also noticed the shade of green in the final design looks darker than we first expected, and is strangely similar to the shade of green that Lothian are applying to their new green and white design…

Didn't Lothian deliberately try to imitate the colours of Eastern Scottish in West lothian to the extent of even resurrecting old route numbers when they launched an attack into West Lothian? It really would be rather hypocritical to now cry wolf if another operator tries the same tactic.

 

[JurassicMan]

Desperate stuff. Nothing new to bring to the table, so copy your competitor.

That comment could of course apply to Lothian Country when they entered West Lothian

Will get really interesting once a new network is launched and LC no longer have areas to themselves once again.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

I’ve been looking through the fleet numbers on bustimes and I’ve tried to find the fleet numbers for the following:

SK63KKJ
SK63KKL
SK63KNY
SN14DXW
SN64CKF

I believe SN14DXW should be 0418 but that could easily be wrong as SK63KNY could also be 0418, or that could be 0430 as nothing really fits into that gap. SK63KKJ/L I’d have thought would’ve taken up 0405 and 0406 but those numbers are already in use by Xplore Dundee’s two StreetLites.

As for the others that are missing I believe I have those so any help for these 5 would be much appreciated. It would appear that the 26 Daimler ones are taking up 0454-0479 in registration plate order.

Thanks

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

I’ve been looking through the fleet numbers on bustimes and I’ve tried to find the fleet numbers for the following:

SK63KKJ
SK63KKL
SK63KNY
SN14DXW
SN64CKF

I believe SN14DXW should be 0418 but that could easily be wrong as SK63KNY could also be 0418, or that could be 0430 as nothing really fits into that gap. SK63KKJ/L I’d have thought would’ve taken up 0405 and 0406 but those numbers are already in use by Xplore Dundee’s two StreetLites.

As for the others that are missing I believe I have those so any help for these 5 would be much appreciated. It would appear that the 26 Daimler ones are taking up 0454-0479 in registration plate order.

Thanks

You can use the fleet list on the new website: http://mcgillsscotlandeast.co.uk/fleet-list

Tread with caution, though, as there may be some errors, as it is populated manually by office staff.

You are correct that 0405/6, and 2850-2855 have been reused. I'm not sure if that was intentional.

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

You can use the fleet list on the new website: http://mcgillsscotlandeast.co.uk/fleet-list

Tread with caution, though, as there may be some errors, as it is populated manually by office staff.

You are correct that 0405/6, and 2850-2855 have been reused. I'm not sure if that was intentional.

Thanks for that. At least that’s cleared up 2 of the 5 I needed. Hopefully the other 3 will be revealed in due course. I believe uk buses website is planning on an update to McGills group fleet list soon too. You’re right in saying that it should be treated with caution as it suggested a few days back (and still does) that a number of the Daimler StreetLites would be taking up 16xx numbers, when in fact it appears these are to be 0454-0479.

 

[tbtc]

Sorry, didn't Lothian copy the Eastern Scottish /SMT Livery and also route numbers to try and imitate a former operator in the area?

Didn't Lothian deliberately try to imitate the colours of Eastern Scottish in West lothian to the extent of even resurrecting old route numbers when they launched an attack into West Lothian? It really would be rather hypocritical to now cry wolf if another operator tries the same tactic.

I’d suggest that there’s a huge difference between adopting a colour scheme and route numbers that hadn’t been used for many years (which is what Lothian did) and copying what a current operator is doing (which is what the diagonal McGills livery appears to be doing)

Deep down you know this, hence your use of “former operator” and “old route numbers” - Lothian weren’t passing themselves off as a current operator

(Similarly, I doubt that McGills could complain if someone set up a new firm in Paisley with red/yellow buses like Clydeside once had, but they might be annoyed if you copied their blue livery?)

 

[fgwrich]

Are these the Livingston ones, ie the ones bought with Scottish Government funding?

Possibly so, the ex Route 600 branded ones? Seems to be a decent amount of MMCs and Streetlites in this sale, definitely rather surprising as I thought the group would have wanted to keep those. Also a little surprised at Brightbus being included, but I suppose there would have been no other way of operating it without looking for a new base.

 

[Highland050261]

There is a photo of the new Midland Bluebird Livery and it looks really good. The bus is SN66 WGV.

https://imgur.io/a/HDjGiy1