Is the use of cash dying out?

[najaB]

But Britain was not the only large country where the introduction of ATMs were introduced in that time period.

And the UK isn't the only country where these stores are being introduced.

I have just received my new 5-year contactless debit bank card, but once activated, my bank has insisted that I make a purchase using my pin number to fully activate the contactless function of the card.

As @DelayRepay notes, you are required to use the PIN occasionally as a security measure - if you lose your card anyone who finds it can only make a small number of low-value transactions before they will be asked to enter the PIN.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Maybe banks will get rid of physical bankcards in the medium term and expect customers to have their own contactless payment device? Chip & PIN readers could be replaced by contactless only readers.

There will absolutely be banks that do that very soon if there aren't already. I'd bet on one of Monzo, Starling or Chase Bank being first - Monzo for instance already does virtual cards for online use, allowing those to be added to Apple/Google Pay is not a big step. The option of a card is unlikely to go away soon though.

Obviously before this can become widespread, ATMs will have to be modified (although my bank, NatWest, allow me to generate a code in their mobile app, that I can use to withdraw cash from their ATMs without my card - this would need to be extended to work across all ATMs), and there will still need to be cards for overseas in countries who are not moving as quickly as we are.

While this thread is about cash going away, for that reason I can see this happening first with a credit rather than a debit card, as while you can draw cash on those it's rare for people to do it as the fees and interest are swingeing - it's very much an emergency measure.

 

[ChrisC]

I picked up a leaflet the other day warning of the perils of a cashless society calling it an attack our human rights, no financial privacy etc. Whilst I can understand their point I very rarely use cash anymore, my local barber is still cash only although they admit that they'll have to start accepting cards before long. Greggs bakers went cashless during the pandemic (at least some stores) but they they lost so much custom that they had to go back to accepting cash and apparently takings are down by 40% at the De Bradelei Wharf shopping centre in Dover since the car park was made RingGo only, many senior citizens regard it as ageist.

I’m using far less cash now than I was a few years and don’t have any problems with anywhere that is card only. Before the pandemic, I would almost always pay by cash in my smaller local food shops when I was spending under £20 but now I mostly pay by card. In larger supermarkets where I was spending more I have been paying by card for years. Even now if I go in somewhere like Greggs just to get a coffee or in a small shop to buy a couple of items I still tend to pay with cash. I always used to pay by cash on the bus but now always pay using contactless or use a mobile ticket. At a car park I usually pay using cash but don’t object to those where the machine is card only. However, if I see that a car park is something like RingGo I move on and park elsewhere even if it means walking some distance. Perhaps one day I will adapt to it if I’m really forced to but can understand people even older than me who won’t adapt.

 

[Bletchleyite]

apparently takings are down by 40% at the De Bradelei Wharf shopping centre in Dover since the car park was made RingGo only, many senior citizens regard it as ageist.

RingGo is a bit of a faff compared to tapping a contactless card on a machine on exit. I use it in preference to pay-and-display because it means it's easy to extend the time if necessary, but pay on exit by contactless is my preference if the car park's layout allows for that to be possible. At many such car parks you just tap your debit card as you drive up to the barrier to leave - it doesn't get easier than that.

On the other hand I'm not sure I'd agree it's ageist - plenty of older people use smartphones - my parents are never off them.

 

[gswindale]

RingGo is a bit of a faff compared to tapping a contactless card on a machine on exit. I use it in preference to pay-and-display because it means it's easy to extend the time if necessary, but pay on exit by contactless is my preference if the car park's layout allows for that to be possible. At many such car parks you just tap your debit card as you drive up to the barrier to leave - it doesn't get easier than that.

On the other hand I'm not sure I'd agree it's ageist - plenty of older people use smartphones - my parents are never off them.

I agree with this - my in-laws are constantly on their smart phones (well MIL anyway)!

My main problem with car parks is the variety of apps that you end up needing - for instance if you visit Forestry England's Wendover Woods site and want to pay by the app, you need "Glide". If you visit Cannock Chase, then you need RingGo.

I think I mentioned up-thread that John O'Groats was quoting different prices depending on how you paid (which I think was an oversight on updating the app more than anything), but certainly if it is a Pay and Display car park, then the app makes life so much easier (I recall a meeting in Brum where I was expecting to leave the office by 14:30 to get home (after a 10:30 meeting start). It went on longer than expected, so I was able to just extend without having to leave the meeting and walk 10 minutes back to the car park to extend parking etc.)

 

[Bletchleyite]

My main problem with car parks is the variety of apps that you end up needing - for instance if you visit Forestry England's Wendover Woods site and want to pay by the app, you need "Glide". If you visit Cannock Chase, then you need RingGo.

You've then got the confusion of LNR car parks where both Glide and Saba apps work but the signage is very confusing and implies you have to use Glide.

I think I mentioned up-thread that John O'Groats was quoting different prices depending on how you paid (which I think was an oversight on updating the app more than anything)

Like the likes of Eventbrite, car park operators using RingGo etc can choose whether to absorb the platform's fees or pass them on. This does mean in some cases there's a difference.

 

[gswindale]

You've then got the confusion of LNR car parks where both Glide and Saba apps work but the signage is very confusing and implies you have to use Glide.



Like the likes of Eventbrite, car park operators using RingGo etc can choose whether to absorb the platform's fees or pass them on. This does mean in some cases there's a difference.

It was £3 cash according to the machines and £2 (plus a 30p "convenience fee) on the app. Given that they also had signs up that said the toilets were 50p, but you could just push the turnstile with your knee, I suspect they were in the process of updating various things (I think the whole site is volunteer managed unlike the hellhole that is Lands End!)

 

[brad465]

At the rate the currency is crashing, cash will become literal toilet paper, although that would be repurposing rather than dying out.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Does anyone on this thread foresee any of the criminal fraternity taking advantage of the cashless society, more so than they do at present?

 

[najaB]

My main problem with car parks is the variety of apps that you end up needing - for instance if you visit Forestry England's Wendover Woods site and want to pay by the app, you need "Glide". If you visit Cannock Chase, then you need RingGo.

As always, there's an an XKCD that relates:

(Explained here for the benefit of those using screen readers - https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/927:_Standards )

 

[Bletchleyite]

Does anyone on this thread foresee any of the criminal fraternity taking advantage of the cashless society, more so than they do at present?

Much crime and small scale tax evasion involves cash, so I suspect it would be a crime-reducing move.

As always, there's an an XKCD that relates:

(Explained here for the benefit of those using screen readers - https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/927:_Standards )

To be fair, that joke was rife when mobile phone charger standardisation was under discussion, and Apple aside we do seem to have achieved that. Yes, USB C is a 15th standard, but it's made the other 13 go away, and Apple are headed that way too.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

At the rate the currency is crashing, cash will become literal toilet paper, although that would be repurposing rather than dying out.

If you honestly think that I will wipe my bum on 50p coins, then you have another think coming....

 

[Ashley Hill]

My nearest Asda no longer accepts cash for parking,the slots are now taped over. Offered to pay cash at customer services and was told quite abruptly to use the card machines followed by a withering look. S*d this I’m off to Tescos. I was then smugly informed that numberplate cameras are used so if I didn’t pay I’d receive a fine even though I no longer wanted to park there. Mrs H insisted that we shop at Asda so she used her contactless card. It’s like the world is conspiring to rid itself cash payments and force people into going cashless.

 

[Bletchleyite]

My nearest Asda no longer accepts cash for parking,the slots are now taped over. Offered to pay cash at customer services and was told quite abruptly to use the card machines followed by a withering look. S*d this I’m off to Tescos. I was then smugly informed that numberplate cameras are used so if I didn’t pay I’d receive a fine even though I no longer wanted to park there. Mrs H insisted that we shop at Asda so she used her contactless card. It’s like the world is conspiring to rid itself cash payments.

As Asda is a budget supermarket this is genuinely surprising, but I doubt it's a conspiracy per-se, just a business decision!

Were it Waitrose then I'd not be surprised if they stopped accepting cash entirely including in the shop.

 

[najaB]

To be fair, that joke was rife when mobile phone charger standardisation was under discussion, and Apple aside we do seem to have achieved that. Yes, USB C is a 15th standard, but it's made the other 13 go away, and Apple are headed that way too.

Largely due to EU regulation though, rather than the industry working together.

It’s like the world is conspiring to rid itself cash payments.

Cash costs money to handle and businesses hate unnecessary costs.

 

[Ashley Hill]

As Asda is a budget supermarket this is genuinely surprising, but I doubt it's a conspiracy per-se, just a business decision!

They use a contractor to manage the parking. Even garages are getting into this nonsense. It used to be free to check your tyre pressures,now it’s between 30 and 50p but most machines are guess what,contactless payment only!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Cash costs money to handle and businesses hate unnecessary costs.

Such as getting customers to perform self-service checkout tasks instead of having their own staff to perform that particular task. I have heard of an instance many months ago when a staff member tried to encourage a regular user of a manned checkout to use the self-service facility and being asked if their shopping would then be paid for at staff discounted prices.

 

[Bletchleyite]

They use a contractor to manage the parking. Even garages are getting into this nonsense. It used to be free to check your tyre pressures,now it’s between 30 and 50p but most machines are guess what,contactless payment only!

The reason garages charge for ancillaries now is becaue it's the only thing that really makes money! While fuel seems expensive at the moment, supermarkets selling it at very low prices to encourage you to shop there at the same time as getting fuel mean there's very little profit in it for an independent site. The money is made in the shop and for ancillaries like tyre inflation and car washes, hence why independent sites don't generally do pay at the pump.

 

[DoubleLemon]

Yes. It is a totally app based setup like the Amazon store almost diagonally opposite it. There are no traditional checkouts.

Outside there is invariably a small collection of puzzled looking people with their heads in their phones. Personally I don't think it is a good model even if I would be totally happy were cash to be abolished entirely, and I normally choose to use self checkouts in preference to staffed ones.

We managed to walk out without it charging us for most of the alcohol we had in our bag. Reported it as that's a BIG failing - and got to keep the unpaid stuff.

 

[DelayRepay]

It was £3 cash according to the machines and £2 (plus a 30p "convenience fee) on the app. Given that they also had signs up that said the toilets were 50p, but you could just push the turnstile with your knee, I suspect they were in the process of updating various things (I think the whole site is volunteer managed unlike the hellhole that is Lands End!)

In my opinion, the extra charge should be for people who choose to pay by cash. The costs of having someone going round in a van emptying the machines and banking a load of coins, as well as dealing with faults, vandalism, filling tickets etc must outweigh the cost of running an app.

Such as getting customers to perform self-service checkout tasks instead of having their own staff to perform that particular task. I have heard of an instance many months ago when a staff member tried to encourage a regular user of a manned checkout to use the self-service facility and being asked if their shopping would then be paid for at staff discounted prices.

On the other hand, Sainsburys provide discounts if you use their SmartShop app to scan your own shopping on your phone. So in a sense they are passing part of the saving on to the customer. And for a long time banks have offered online only savings accounts which pay more interest than branch based ones - same concept applies.

 

[Dai Corner]

Such as getting customers to perform self-service checkout tasks instead of having their own staff to perform that particular task. I have heard of an instance many months ago when a staff member tried to encourage a regular user of a manned checkout to use the self-service facility and being asked if their shopping would then be paid for at staff discounted prices.

Do you also object to picking your own goods from the shelves? Many supermarket chains which will do that for you and you just have to collect your purchases from the designated place outside. They'll even deliver them to your front door (or tradesman's entrance) for a modest charge. You do have to place your order and pay online though.

 

[Bletchleyite]

On the other hand, Sainsburys provide discounts if you use their SmartShop app to scan your own shopping on your phone. So in a sense they are passing part of the saving on to the customer. And for a long time banks have offered online only savings accounts which pay more interest than branch based ones - same concept applies.

SmartShop is I find a bit cack-handed, e.g. if it crashes you have to rescan everything rather than them having the sense to record it in a database rather than on the phone. So I'm not enthused to use it, and the requirement to do so in order to get discounts is fairly riling to the point I may stop shopping there.

On the other hand if they fix the reliability issues on the app and allow me to pay through the app using Apple Pay and I won't object. It is fairly handy going round with bags in the trolley and putting stuff into the right one.

 

[Gloster]

My new debit card arrives with the contactless facility. I then go into the bank and get them to send me a second new card without contactless. When it arrives I then destroy the first new card and validate the second, non-contactless one. Even though I do this each time, I can’t have a standing instruction to be sent a card without contactless. To validate it I don’t need to buy something: checking my balance in the machines in the bank will do.

Standard cheque books now only have about seventeen cheques in them, rather than the old twenty-five. More annoyingly, a new book is no longer automatically ordered when you get a certain way through: the user has to ask for a new one to be sent.

And you get people like the chap I saw last week in the bank. He was on holiday and paying for every thing by card, but had messed up his PIN number when it asked him for it because it was the xth contactless transaction and wasn’t happy that his card was cancelled: he only had a bit of loose change for parking machines and didn’t know how he was going to get back to Chorley. (Most of the details from interjections by his wife.)

 

[Bletchleyite]

My new debit card arrives with the contactless facility. I then go into the bank and get them to send me a second new card without contactless. When it arrives I then destroy the first new card and validate the second, non-contactless one. Even though I do this each time, I can’t have a standing instruction to be sent a card without contactless. To validate it I don’t need to buy something: checking my balance in the machines in the bank will do.

Does your bank not let you just set the contactless limit to 0 even if the card technically has it? Mine does, or you can set it to something still useful but not going to clean your account out*, such as £20 as it originally was. I thought most banks now allowed this since the maximum was increased to £100.

* This will be refunded if it happens but I can see why some don't want the stress.

 

[Gloster]

Does your bank not let you just set the contactless limit to 0 even if the card technically has it? Mine does, or you can set it to something still useful but not going to clean your account out*, such as £20 as it originally was. I thought most banks now allowed this since the maximum was increased to £100.

* This will be refunded if it happens but I can see why some don't want the stress.

Maybe they do now, but this is the system that I have been using since contactless appeared and it works. It is also absolute: there can’t be any errors if the system isn’t even on the card.

As to refunds, I know that you should be able to get money back, but a friend took six years to get back the money (nearly £2000) taken from his account following a bit of bank sloppiness. It is not worth the hassle to risk that.

 

[Edsmith]

As Asda is a budget supermarket this is genuinely surprising, but I doubt it's a conspiracy per-se, just a business decision!

Were it Waitrose then I'd not be surprised if they stopped accepting cash entirely including in the shop.

My local Asda and Waitrose offer free parking subject to a time limit, 2 hours I think?

Many people seem to resent paying for parking anywhere whilst shopping and regard having to mess around with RingGo etc as the final straw.

 

[route101]

I used a car park at the weekend. £1 for the day by cash, or £1.30 on ring go. Used the app, still cheap parking.

 

[The exile]

SmartShop is I find a bit cack-handed, e.g. if it crashes you have to rescan everything rather than them having the sense to record it in a database rather than on the phone. So I'm not enthused to use it, and the requirement to do so in order to get discounts is fairly riling to the point I may stop shopping there.

On the other hand if they fix the reliability issues on the app and allow me to pay through the app using Apple Pay and I won't object. It is fairly handy going round with bags in the trolley and putting stuff into the right one.

All SmartShop really does is shift the time spent scanning at a checkout (where you are in no one’s way) to time spent trying to scan in while blocking other shoppers’ access to the shelves (was particularly noticeable when it was new to most people using it!)

 

[Bletchleyite]

All SmartShop really does is shift the time spent scanning at a checkout (where you are in no one’s way) to time spent trying to scan in while blocking other shoppers’ access to the shelves (was particularly noticeable when it was new to most people using it!)

It does slow your shop down a bit, but it does help in allowing you to bag things correctly for quick unloading when you get home. If they fixed the bugs I'd happily use it, but it's too flaky.

 

[najaB]

Does your bank not let you just set the contactless limit to 0 even if the card technically has it? Mine does, or you can set it to something still useful but not going to clean your account out*, such as £20 as it originally was. I thought most banks now allowed this since the maximum was increased to £100.

Or disable contactless or the card entirely via their app. I definitely can with both of mine.